These are so much fun on a Friday afternoon too, not just late evening.
AudioQuest NightOwl - A closed-back NightHawk
- Thread starter XERO1
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Indeed. Here is my "test bench" for trying the Nightowl with balanced connection (as soon as I get the right leads/adapter).
Based on my Nightowl impressions, so far, I have ordered a pair of used original Nighthawks also, for a fair price, here in Norway. I favor this headphone!
Next comes the question, how to drive owls / hawks to best effect, different amps, balanced or not, and so on.
I have been corrected earlier in this thread. I thought that the Teac NT-505 had balanced headphone output. It hasn't. It does have a four pole (not three pole) output, but not "balanced". The UD-505 has "true" balanced output. Disappointment on my side. Teac should have included this for the NT version also.
Now, it turns out that Audiotailor Jade (and GK-1J), pictured in my last post, are not fully balanced either.
You can check the main thread here at headfi. Designer Hz_Joe calls it "pseudo balanced".
But the strange thing is that those who have heard the amp with "pseudo" balanced cable, like the sound better. I have seen no exceptions, in the Jade threads. And it includes my own experience also. I am not sure, what to make out of this, why should it play such a large role, if it is only "pseudo"...
It is hard to achieve balance in an unbalanced world...
Next comes the question, how to drive owls / hawks to best effect, different amps, balanced or not, and so on.
I have been corrected earlier in this thread. I thought that the Teac NT-505 had balanced headphone output. It hasn't. It does have a four pole (not three pole) output, but not "balanced". The UD-505 has "true" balanced output. Disappointment on my side. Teac should have included this for the NT version also.
Now, it turns out that Audiotailor Jade (and GK-1J), pictured in my last post, are not fully balanced either.
You can check the main thread here at headfi. Designer Hz_Joe calls it "pseudo balanced".
But the strange thing is that those who have heard the amp with "pseudo" balanced cable, like the sound better. I have seen no exceptions, in the Jade threads. And it includes my own experience also. I am not sure, what to make out of this, why should it play such a large role, if it is only "pseudo"...
It is hard to achieve balance in an unbalanced world...
I have mainly listened to music through speakers, not headphones. I have used headphones also, especially when recording LPs. But I have never "stuck" to a headphone playback that I really preferred, over the speakers. The Nightowl brings me closer to that goal. For example, it makes the output from the little Fiio x3 far better than I have heard it through my other headphones / iems. Speaking from this experience, over the years:
- Stax amp and headphone combo, 20 years ago - clumsy, and disappointing in terms of sound (maybe also due to a poor cd source).
- Senn HD600 - like someone said, "oh so boring". Better with balanced cable to Jade, that I got from Audiotailor, but still clamped and closed in. I still get a bit of sweaty feeling in my head, thinking about it. I remember thinking, this is for classical music enthusiasts. Not so much, other music.
- AKG 450 - got better after a long break-in, but still, this is only good enough for monitoring e g a vinyl rip, not for pleasure listening (totally outclassed by Nightowl.)
- AKG 701 - more air, freedom of sound, better than the HD600 (and 450), and again best, with a pseudo-balanced dual jack into the Jade.
- Next, the over-achieving Fiio Ex1 ear buds, very good on clarity and air, but needs a push into my ears to attain a balanced frequency spectrum.
And now, Nightowl. The only serious contender I have is the AKG 701. Both are good, in different ways. The jury is out - I listen to both, now. But I think the Nightowl wins by a clear margin. We'll see - and also, about the Nighthawk.
- Stax amp and headphone combo, 20 years ago - clumsy, and disappointing in terms of sound (maybe also due to a poor cd source).
- Senn HD600 - like someone said, "oh so boring". Better with balanced cable to Jade, that I got from Audiotailor, but still clamped and closed in. I still get a bit of sweaty feeling in my head, thinking about it. I remember thinking, this is for classical music enthusiasts. Not so much, other music.
- AKG 450 - got better after a long break-in, but still, this is only good enough for monitoring e g a vinyl rip, not for pleasure listening (totally outclassed by Nightowl.)
- AKG 701 - more air, freedom of sound, better than the HD600 (and 450), and again best, with a pseudo-balanced dual jack into the Jade.
- Next, the over-achieving Fiio Ex1 ear buds, very good on clarity and air, but needs a push into my ears to attain a balanced frequency spectrum.
And now, Nightowl. The only serious contender I have is the AKG 701. Both are good, in different ways. The jury is out - I listen to both, now. But I think the Nightowl wins by a clear margin. We'll see - and also, about the Nighthawk.
Nighthawks arrived! Time for comparation.
First impression, these both look and sound beautiful, a bit different from the Nightowl, but very good in their own way. Two great nightbirds.
First impression, these both look and sound beautiful, a bit different from the Nightowl, but very good in their own way. Two great nightbirds.
I agree. They are cult classics. Don't be afraid to EQ the Nighthawk a bit. It's the only headphone I use EQ on via the RME.
Thanks! Maybe I'll end up putting them on my small personal shelf of headphone classics, along with Audiotailor Jade.
It is not strange that my ears like their sound, I am an analog enthusiast, analog and tubes in my main rig, no disturbing electronics please, no solid state, no digital glare, and so on. Moving the speakers instead of using EQ. To a limit, however. What RME is this, and how do you adjust the EQ?
It is not strange that my ears like their sound, I am an analog enthusiast, analog and tubes in my main rig, no disturbing electronics please, no solid state, no digital glare, and so on. Moving the speakers instead of using EQ. To a limit, however. What RME is this, and how do you adjust the EQ?
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RME ADI-2 DAC. EQ walk-through is here:
My Nighthawk settings are:
Band 1 : G -4.0 F 230 Q 0.7
Band 2 : G - 3.0 F 600 Q 0.5
Band 3: G +6.0 F 950 Q 1.0
Band 4: G +2.0 F 3.0k Q 1.0
Band 5: G +2.0 F 5.0k Q 1.0
My Nighthawk settings are:
Band 1 : G -4.0 F 230 Q 0.7
Band 2 : G - 3.0 F 600 Q 0.5
Band 3: G +6.0 F 950 Q 1.0
Band 4: G +2.0 F 3.0k Q 1.0
Band 5: G +2.0 F 5.0k Q 1.0
ZOSMANOVIC
Formerly known as A0067EN
Nighthawks arrived! Time for comparation.
First impression, these both look and sound beautiful, a bit different from the Nightowl, but very good in their own way. Two great nightbirds.
Let us know which you prefer with a brief comparison if possible
Yes I will. What I can say for now, is that I am very impressed with the NH. Is the NO better? Well maybe yes. The NO sounds more closed in (surprise!) but I am still burning it in (maybe 100 hours, now), while the NH seems to have been played quite a lot before I got it. NH is easier to find, now - I got mine for half the price of the NO, and for that price it is a steal. Really enjoyable. I think each has its charm. For "relaxing" the NH seems hard to beat. Note that, I mainly play DSD files, and I think, with this higher resolution, plus good amping, it doesn't have the problems often associated with it (like too relaxed, lacking in treble, washed-out bass, etc), I don't hear much of that. Instead, a very "organic" sound. Very coherent. Yes maybe some "sins of omission", but not many "sins of comission". So far I have tested mainly with the Fiio X3ii. I got a Denon DA-10 from the NH seller, also for a very good price. It is not ideal for my uses, but the seller was right, the NH sounds better through the DA-10. Even though the X3 drives them quite well (better than most mobile phones, I would guess), the DA-10 adds authority and texture. Walking around yesterday, doing things in the house, with the X3 - Da10 - NH, and NOT being bound to a cable to some stationary amp, was really great. It adds to my "use value" from the NH / NO. I have done this before, of course, and for jogging or gym, the X3 with earbuds (EX-1) is what I use. But the X3 - DA10 - NH chain gave me much more of the music, I was impressed. So far, NH / NO is 1 - 1. They each do their thing. Great to have both!
Can someone help me with two questions?
1 Sadly I broke off the minijack of the thick NH cable yesterday. It seems very fragile, like others in the NH thread have commented. I wonder, is it an idea to open the cable, get the leads, and solder or twist these to similarly exposed leads to a TRS minijack - or too difficult. I am not able to solder leads direct to a TRS plug - too small for me. But I was thinking of just cutting some decent standard TRS cable and then twisting the leads together with those from the NH cable.
2 I am still somewhat confused about what exactly is "balanced", not to speak of "pseudo-balanced" (like my Jade, and in fact, my Aesthetix phono preamp too). I have an extremely simple question for you. Why do headphones use three leads - L, R and common ground - while speakers use four? Just out of convenience? Because using a common ground makes headphones sound better in 95 percent of cases (unless you have a balanced amp)? Is there any audible difference, between a 4- and 3-lead connection? I am interested in listening experience. Maybe engineers say "no difference whatsoever" and yet listeners feel different (well known in audio). I have actually never tested in my speaker systems. Would I like it better, connecting the L and R ground? I seriously doubt it, but maybe, you can fill me in.
1 Sadly I broke off the minijack of the thick NH cable yesterday. It seems very fragile, like others in the NH thread have commented. I wonder, is it an idea to open the cable, get the leads, and solder or twist these to similarly exposed leads to a TRS minijack - or too difficult. I am not able to solder leads direct to a TRS plug - too small for me. But I was thinking of just cutting some decent standard TRS cable and then twisting the leads together with those from the NH cable.
2 I am still somewhat confused about what exactly is "balanced", not to speak of "pseudo-balanced" (like my Jade, and in fact, my Aesthetix phono preamp too). I have an extremely simple question for you. Why do headphones use three leads - L, R and common ground - while speakers use four? Just out of convenience? Because using a common ground makes headphones sound better in 95 percent of cases (unless you have a balanced amp)? Is there any audible difference, between a 4- and 3-lead connection? I am interested in listening experience. Maybe engineers say "no difference whatsoever" and yet listeners feel different (well known in audio). I have actually never tested in my speaker systems. Would I like it better, connecting the L and R ground? I seriously doubt it, but maybe, you can fill me in.
Testing NH vs NO some more. My DSD vinyl rip of Paul McC Egypt station. Fiio X3ii -> Denon DA-10 -> hawk / owl.
What about, NO in the morning, NH in the evening? They are similar in many respects but also quite different.
NO more upfront, tighter bass, probably measures better, music is alive and kicking.
NH more "lazy", may seem more blurred, less clear. And yet, they tend to stay, on my head.
What about, NO in the morning, NH in the evening? They are similar in many respects but also quite different.
NO more upfront, tighter bass, probably measures better, music is alive and kicking.
NH more "lazy", may seem more blurred, less clear. And yet, they tend to stay, on my head.
Listening tests - Fiio X2ii playing DSD files (and acting as DAC) -> DA-10 (as additional amp) - > Nightowl (black) and Nighthawk.
Testing Milos: Nights in white satin, a beautiful guitar analog track from his Sound of silence LP, Dsd128 recorded from my Tascam DA-3000. If this LP doesn't sound good, something is off in your system. I note that the NO plays a bit louder - or seems a bit louder - than the NH. Not sure why (this is with the same X3 - Da10 volume setup). Maybe just the closed design? It is not much, but it is notable - more "presence" with the NO. Is it due to different pads? My NH has pleather pads, the NO has velour.
stilleh
100+ Head-Fier
I have recently been rediscovering my Nighthawqs after I got a dragonfly cobalt. I got it for my laptop setup initially but have been using it with my phone (Xiaomi Note 10+) on the go and I have to say that it is a great pairing. I´m using the UAPP app connected to Tidal and is a gamechanger for me. Really enjoying the setup more and more.
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