[Uncle AL]

-While it would be fun, it would also (probably) serve as inspiration for some unscrupulous boutique high-end snake-oil pusher...

Weeks after someone posts a new idea, it shows up in the 'coming soon!' section of the website of some company with a buzzword-laden name...

10-15 years ago, when I was in university doing an electrical engineering degree (I majored in RF design; did some signal processing on the side), some friends and I at the local ham radio club used to play a game - we'd sit at a bar, enjoying ourselves, trying to think up outlandish hi-fi gadgets and high-flying theories of operation (which, invariably, were rather -ahem- loosely based on the laws of physics paired with wilful misinterpretation of same.)

Problem was, when we googled the ideas, more often than not, it turned out they were already commercially available products...

Wow-- With your interest / background in engineering, and just a bit more forethought beyond current technical offerings, you guys could likely have filed patents on your ideas.

 

[Strangelove424]

   
-While it would be fun, it would also (probably) serve as inspiration for some unscrupulous boutique high-end snake-oil pusher...
 
Weeks after someone posts a new idea, it shows up in the 'coming soon!' section of the website of some company with a buzzword-laden name...
 
10-15 years ago, when I was in university doing an electrical engineering degree (I majored in RF design; did some signal processing on the side), some friends and I at the local ham radio club used to play a game - we'd sit at a bar, enjoying ourselves, trying to think up outlandish hi-fi gadgets and high-flying theories of operation (which, invariably, were rather -ahem- loosely based on the laws of physics paired with wilful misinterpretation of same.)
 
Problem was, when we googled the ideas, more often than not, it turned out they were already commercially available products...

 
Hah, good point, I wouldn't want us to become product designers for con men. 

 

[OddE]

Wow-- With your interest / background in engineering, and just a bit more forethought beyond current technical offerings, you guys could likely have filed patents on your ideas.

 
-It is my firm belief that Dante missed the tenth circle of hell - which is where patent trolls and telemarketers reside.
 
That said, it would be fun to deny licencing of any of our ideas which had not as of yet turned into a product, thus keeping them off the market - or, perhaps, on the basis that a fool and his money, etc - demand extortionate licensing fees. ('What, it's not like you won't be able to recoup this once you start shipping...')
 
I am still very pleased with one product I did actually build, just for kicks - to this day probably the most accurate-sounding DAC with valves in it.
 
I built a DAC around a pair of PCM1704 chips just to prove it was doable by a determined amateur (Whose labour costs were nada and equipment expenses same-same, and with just about unlimited access to very, very smart people with lots of experience in digital design), the icing on the cake being a couple of valves (tubes to those of you from the colonies) prominently displayed on top of the chassis.
 
Too bad the 12AX7s were just wired to heat the filaments for the decorative glow; the real output buffer was and is a couple of low-noise op-amps.

 

[Uncle AL]

-It is my firm belief that Dante missed the tenth circle of hell - which is where patent trolls and telemarketers reside.

That said, it would be fun to deny licencing of any of our ideas which had not as of yet turned into a product, thus keeping them off the market - or, perhaps, on the basis that a fool and his money, etc - demand extortionate licensing fees. ('What, it's not like you won't be able to recoup this once you start shipping...')

I am still very pleased with one product I did actually build, just for kicks - to this day probably the most accurate-sounding DAC with valves in it.

I built a DAC around a pair of PCM1704 chips just to prove it was doable by a determined amateur (Whose labour costs were nada and equipment expenses same-same, and with just about unlimited access to very, very smart people with lots of experience in digital design), the icing on the cake being a couple of valves (tubes to those of you from the colonies) prominently displayed on top of the chassis.

Too bad the 12AX7s were just wired to heat the filaments for the decorative glow; the real output buffer was and is a couple of low-noise op-amps.

Congratulations on your DAC accomplishment. The joy is in stretching the limits to test new ideas.
In the interest of full disclosure, I hold three patents, although not in respect to Dante's patent trolls.. Protection was necessary, because it cost $144K in research and ideas must be protected to have marketable value to major corporations. Crazy world and flawed system, to be sure. Ideally, would be great to have technological advancements shared freely, but alas, there wouldn't be incentive for someone to invest 10 years in development...

 

[OddE]

Congratulations on your DAC accomplishment. The joy is in stretching the limits to test new ideas.
In the interest of full disclosure, I hold three patents, although not in respect to Dante's patent trolls.. Protection was necessary, because it cost $144K in research and ideas must be protected to have marketable value to major corporations. Crazy world and flawed system, to be sure. Ideally, would be great to have technological advancements shared freely, but alas, there wouldn't be incentive for someone to invest 10 years in development...

 
-Patent law (when implemented and enforced sensibly) is a force of good; don't get me wrong (Matter of fact, my employer has got a pending one with, amongst others, my name on it. )
 
My thought (Not very clearly formulated!) was that any patent in the voodoo audio field would be of dubious merit, as it doesn't bring anything innovative but marketing to - ahem - the market. Hence, any attempt to enforce a voodoo audio patent would, in my book, be trolling...

 

[Uncle AL]

-Patent law (when implemented and enforced sensibly) is a force of good; don't get me wrong (Matter of fact, my employer has got a pending one with, amongst others, my name on it. )

My thought (Not very clearly formulated!) was that any patent in the voodoo audio field would be of dubious merit, as it doesn't bring anything innovative but marketing to - ahem - the market. Hence, any attempt to enforce a voodoo audio patent would, in my book, be trolling...

+1 OddE.. well put--

 

[Roly1650]

-Patent law (when implemented and enforced sensibly) is a force of good; don't get me wrong (Matter of fact, my employer has got a pending one with, amongst others, my name on it. )

My thought (Not very clearly formulated!) was that any patent in the voodoo audio field would be of dubious merit, as it doesn't bring anything innovative but marketing to - ahem - the market. Hence, any attempt to enforce a voodoo audio patent would, in my book, be trolling...

As a fellow holder of a good number of patents in my name, I agree with what you've said. However, it didn't stop Monster Cable from suing anybody in sight when they felt like it, the enforceability of your patents is directly related to the depth of your pockets.

 

[Uncle AL]

As a fellow holder of a good number of patents in my name, I agree with what you've said. However, it didn't stop Monster Cable from suing anybody in sight when they felt like it, the enforceability of your patents is directly related to the depth of your pockets.

It's interesting, but patents only provide a right to defend the technology you've patented, but it's up to patent holder to file suit for infringement (often $500K USD, up). If patent holder cannot afford to bring action, they diminish patent or can lose rights. Big pocket corporations can, therefore walk all over smaller patent holders.

 

[castleofargh]

you can have a lot of fun looking at what apple and samsung get patents for and how they fight over who "invented" the rounded rectangle... something nobody ever thought about before them obviously.
or amazon getting a patent for white background for packshot(taking pictures of objects in a studio with a uniform background). those are a few of thousands of ludicrous patents that shouldn't exist at all.

 

[Steve Eddy]

Not to mention that the patent office is little more than a rubber stamp these days. Kimber Kable managed to secure a patent on a four lead braided cable design that was previously patented in 1960. But in spite of the prior art, he could have sued anyone making cables of the same design (like many of those making aftermarket headphone cables) and made their lives miserable in the courts. Fortunately Ray took it well when I showed him the 1960 patent and to my knowledge has not tried to enforce it.

se

 

[Uncle AL]

Not to mention that the patent office is little more than a rubber stamp these days. Kimber Kable managed to secure a patent on a four lead braided cable design that was previously patented in 1960. But in spite of the prior art, he could have sued anyone making cables of the same design (like many of those making aftermarket headphone cables) and made their lives miserable in the courts. Fortunately Ray took it well when I showed him the 1960 patent and to my knowledge has not tried to enforce it.

se

Steve Eddy, Just to clarify, the USPTO (patent office) does not "rubber stamp" patent applications.  My first patent took 5 1/2 years, and the second one 5 years. The term for patent review is "Prosecution", and during the time a patent is pending, the examiner argues why a patent should not be granted.  Let me assure you they are TOUGH, and fire off several challenges per year before finally granting the patent.  This causes claims, often times, to be diminished in their scope.  Are corporations given priority?  I asked my patent attorney this question and he initially stated no, but after my research he tended to agree it may be less difficult for them, with their patents often being approved within 3 to 3 1/2 years.  Additionally, not all patent examiners are created equal, and some are easier than others.  If for any reason, a patent is approved easilly, competing corporations could request "re-examination", so if a patent was granted easy path (rubber stamped), it could result in claims being disallowed later.
The above should not be construed as legal opinion..

 blah.. blah.. blah

 

[Head Injury]

Late reply, but for good reason.
 
Quote:

http://www.coconut-audio.com

The more power cables I add, I get better sound. Not only is the sound better but all the qualities from each cable are not lost or wasted! They all add up in the musical sound stage. That is amazing. It sounds like Unreal 1.0 Ultra, Christmas Power, Unreal Natural, White Night power cables all had sex with each other. I was also surprised that how my White Night power cables on the speakers are not holding back! They continue to provide better sound as I add more cables and even better cables! This shows proof that your cables have great synergy and they don't cancel each other out. What this means to viewers / other customers? They don't need to discard or return old cables. Just add new ones somewhere else in your system!

 

[Steve Eddy]

Steve Eddy, Just to clarify, the USPTO (patent office) does not "rubber stamp" patent applications.  My first patent took 5 1/2 years, and the second one 5 years. The term for patent review is "Prosecution", and during the time a patent is pending, the examiner argues why a patent should not be granted.  Let me assure you they are TOUGH, and fire off several challenges per year before finally granting the patent.

If it's so "TOUGH," then could you please explain how, for example, John Bedini was able to secure more than one patent for his CD "clarifier" which simply spins a CD in a static magnetic field, claiming in the patent itself that doing so not only rearranges the data on the CD, but also results in data compression on the CD? Such claims wouldn't pass the giggle test even with most laypersons.

As well, please explain why the same John Bedini was able to secure a patent on a perpetual motion/over unity device in spite of the patent office stating outright that patents are not granted for such devices.

That doesn't even satisfy my definition of "tough" let alone "TOUGH."

se

 

[bigshot]

Hey! You started talking about perpetual motion machines and an ad for one showed up in the sidebar of the forum!

 

[proton007]

If it's so "TOUGH," then could you please explain how, for example, John Bedini was able to secure more than one patent for his CD "clarifier" which simply spins a CD in a static magnetic field, claiming in the patent itself that doing so not only rearranges the data on the CD, but also results in data compression on the CD? Such claims wouldn't pass the giggle test even with most laypersons.

As well, please explain why the same John Bedini was able to secure a patent on a perpetual motion/over unity device in spite of the patent office stating outright that patents are not granted for such devices.

That doesn't even satisfy my definition of "tough" let alone "TOUGH."

se

 
Steve,
as far as I know, filing an application for a patent does not require any physical demonstration or proof that the device actually works. Further, the phrasing of the document, as done by patent lawyers, renders the patent barely comprehensible.
Also, when saying getting a patent is 'tough' it's just that the idea itself may not be entirely original, however loony it may be.
 
I believe the reason is that a patent grants the patent holder the right to prevent others from producing and selling the device without some sort of legal arrangement, and not the right to be the monopoly.
For most 'nutcase' patents, it's mostly a question of bragging rights, nothing more.