Audio-gd R2R DAC Thread

Discussion in 'Dedicated Source Components' started by JoeDoe, Oct 5, 2017.
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  1. kvik
    Or he is just catering for different needs, and pricing his products to sell, as any good businessman will do. Since you’re never going to buy an Audio-gd product, your obsession with the brand seems a bit odd.
    Turdski, winja, D2Girls and 4 others like this.
  2. thedesigner2011
    Why would the balanced combo (R2R 1 + NFB 1) sound more neutral than the single ended combo (R2R 2 + C2)
  3. Jimster480
    Its not any obsession, I just spoke to him literally the beginning of last week because I was interested in his products until he couldn't answer any questions.
    Which to me is suspect, even when asking him in chinese he seemed to not be able to answer anything technical, only repeat his advertising.

    He told me to ask on this forum, now I write on this forum about his nonsense with balanced and people talking about Soekris and out of nowhere he releases a real balanced DAC for basically the same price?
    He could have mentioned that last week, but he chose not to. Suggesting to me that he is RESPONDING to what happened here / the market alternatives.

    Other than following this thread I don't check on anything from his brand, I'm just having a chuckle.
    D2Girls and omniweltall like this.
  4. kvik
    The whole product portfolio is based on single-ended alongside balanced, and separates alongside integrated. It always has been, or at least for the last 5-6 years I have been following the brand. So NFB-1 with R2R 1, and C-2 with R2R 2, nothing out of the ordinary here. As for the timing, well, sure, competition plays a part, sales matters if you want to stay in business. This affects pricings also, though you seem to think price is a static entity that should reflect costs of material and labour only. Of course business doesn’t work like that, the right price is what someone is willing to pay, not whatever manufacturing costs were involved.

    To me it basically looks like you were offended by Kingwa not wanting to engange in lengthy discussions with you, and have since been having a go at Audio-gd (or Kingwa, I am not sure which), in this and the two other currently active Audio-gd R2R threads. And when you’re not calling people delusional, you are calling manufacturers crooks. I don’t think you will be able to force your truth upon anyone, though you try hard, I’ll give you that.
    Turdski, VilMo, Currawong and 6 others like this.
  5. Mr G
    I've purchased 5 Audio Gd products (2 X DI, 1 X DAC 19, 1 X C2 amp and 1 X NFB-1 AMP) since 2011. In my opinion, Audio Gd products have a great performance to price ratio and are very reliable (DAC 19 was purchased in 2011). I hope that others will have the same experience with Audio Gd products.
    FredA, iamjaymo and D2Girls like this.
  6. humblesquad
    Singularity 19 was a controversial DAC, but R2R series seem to have a better reputation. Looking forward to more reviews.

    IIRC ES9018/9028/9038 are 8-channel so you can make a balanced DAC with only one chip. Like Oppo Sonica.
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
    rocksteady65 likes this.
  7. JaMo
    @ humblesquad: You are correct.
    "Balanced" in the audiodomain normally refers to the analog signals delivery for each channel in a push-pull scenario. Can be done with stacked identical amplifiers for pos./neg. waves or with an output transformer on a "single end"-amp. Connectors is usually XLR (Common-shield, Line(+), Return(-)). This technic has its history in the studio-context, and was a way to deliver signals long distanses without performance- or signal strength drop. 600 Ohms was/is still standard and usually HQ-transformers was used. Also old cinema's used this technic.(.and headphones). "Balanced signal transfer" is also much less sensitive for extrenal interferences than single ended connections. Of course You knew all this.
    Configuration of the digital decoding can be done in many ways. The way You mensioned are quite common. These ESS-chips has excellent specs and raises a bit more when using 4 ch for L and R. ESS also has cheaper 2-channel circuits aimed mostly for the portable market.(less current demanding). Enough of that. Crosstalk between channels and interference in general is always a challenge to work with when signal levels are low, but this in the analog part.
    So conclution.Yes, the NFB-28.38 among other gears built similar are "balanced".

    Excuse the OT, back to threads subject...
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
  8. thedesigner2011
    Can anyone shed some light on the technical reasons why the balanced outputs of the R2R1 and NFB1 sound more neutral than the single ended ones on the R2R 2 and C2? I like the look of the Audio-gd stuff and their amps on the whole seem to be better than Schiit, so I don't mind the wait and cost of getting a stack from them. That being said, I prefer a more neutral sound with my headphones adding the flavor I prefer, but I don't really feel like making balanced cables for all of my headphones. It would be easier and slightly cheaper to get the R2R 2 and C2, but like I said, I don't want the warmer sound.
  9. D2Girls
    Is there a thread for the r2r 1 discussion or should I just discuss it here? I just had a question but would it be safe to say that the r2r 1 is essentially a mini r2r 7? I see a lot of the same text featured in the overview of both product pages.
  10. JoeDoe
    Posting here is fine. This is supposed to be for any of the new ladder offerings from AGD.
  11. Mr G
    I asked Audio Gd about the difference between the ACSS connection and the XLR connection, when connecting R2R 1 with the NFB-1 AMP. I've reproduced their reply below.

    "ACSS connect can give them offer the most neutral sound , less sound coloration and less sensitivity on the cable quality. The XLR connect can effect the sound flavor by the cable quality and configure , some cable can make the sound dynamic or speed or more smoother or warmer sound. I am advice use the ACSS as standard, if you like to try the XLR cable you can had a regular to judge the sound ."

    I've also placed an order for R2R 1 with the TCXO upgrade option. I'll be using the ACSS connection to connect with my NFB-1 AMP.
    JoeDoe likes this.
  12. CJG888
    Is ACSS identical to / compatible with Krell CAST?
  13. Mr G
  14. CJG888
  15. Jimster480
    Its just not the case honestly. Using regular output vs using ACSS doesn't do anything honestly, the electrical properties of input/output don't actually change the sound. its the difference between an integrated DAC/Amp vs a DAC & Amp separated...

    On another note I listened to an R2R-11 at a meet yesterday, it has a smooth sound... when it comes to details its hard to gauge since I didn't have time to A/B test with my equipment.
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