[MelonHead]

That's a bit of a tricky question. We've got a discussion over on the R2R main thread if you'd like details, but to summarize...

There were/are 2 noises that occurred during playback

- The R2R 11 had one type of (to my ears) very low level noise that was present in all DSD playback. I would not have characterized it as a crackle myself, but noises are hard for me to describe... more of a hiss/static to me. Note - to my ears this was never objectionable. I don't listen to much DSD, but if I squinted my eyes and held my nose just right, I could hear it. That noise was constant in tone and amplitude. The upgrade removed (ok technically just reduced) that specific noise. It was specific to the R2R-11 (in the current R2R line of products). Kingwa confirmed that. I never heard it with an R-1 or R-8.
- There is (what I'd describe) as a weird noise during quiet passages or "silence" with some tracks. The opening seconds of a track will reveal its presence instantly to me if it is there. That noise is present in all the current A-GD R2R DACs I own and that some others own. Kingwa is now aware of it and studying the situation. It is only with some tracks from certain sources. It does not occur with all DSD tracks.

So, in summary... what I've recommended is that if DSD is an extremely important part of a music library, then the A-GD R2R DACs may not be the best choice at this time. There's a known issue without a known solution with some tracks. With other tracks (all of the music I own) it plays flawlessly. However, I've downloaded a few of the tracks with the issue, and it is 100% there. The cause and the subsequent solution are not yet known.

Are you sure that all R2R DACs including the new R1 suffer from the quiet passage (your 2nd mention) noise DSD plague? I'm on the fence right now to change my R2R11 to an R1 because of the aforementioned problem, and the balanced outputs.
I don' t care if the first problem is there, as I'm not able to detect it, but the second one is a deal breaker by me.

 

[Labov]

I haven't posted here since 2008. I bought a Beresford DAC and a Little Dot MkIV SE back then. Both died this month. So I am looking for a replacement. The headphones are my old, venerable Sennheiser HD580s. The source is my computer. Mostly .flac in various sampling rates 16/44 and 24/96 for the most part.

I am considering the R2R 11, NFB 11 and the GD 10.2 reference. The latter is being sold by a friend, so the price would be similar to the two first ones. Would they be able to drive the HD580s?

 

[FredA]

I haven't posted here since 2008. I bought a Beresford DAC and a Little Dot MkIV SE back then. Both died this month. So I am looking for a replacement. The headphones are my old, venerable Sennheiser HD580s. The source is my computer. Mostly .flac in various sampling rates 16/44 and 24/96 for the most part.

I am considering the R2R 11, NFB 11 and the GD 10.2 reference. The latter is being sold by a friend, so the price would be similar to the two first ones. Would they be able to drive the HD580s?

If you can get a good i2s (you would need to have an i2s input installed) or spdif transport for the 10.2, i would opt for it. That’s a lot of dac/amp for your money. And as a bonus, you get a seriously good preamplifier.

 

[ItsAllInMyHead]

Are you sure that all R2R DACs including the new R1 suffer from the quiet passage (your 2nd mention) noise DSD plague? I'm on the fence right now to change my R2R11 to an R1 because of the aforementioned problem, and the balanced outputs.
I don' t care if the first problem is there, as I'm not able to detect it, but the second one is a deal breaker by me.

I have an R-1. Yes, it is there. I love it either way. Note, it is ONLY with certain tracks. PM me if you'd like, and I can point you to a few free tracks to try. You'll hear it on the R2R11 so you know what I am describing. See the main R2R thread also for more info. Do you use native DSD as provided from the label / studio and/or do you or do you software convert? I can try some of your music and see if it may be an issue if you'd like. Note, I have only heard this particular issue in cases where the original recording was done in high depth and rate PCM / DXD. That is not to say there are not other cases, but I have not found them. Kingwa is investigating. The good news is that the R-1 has an FPGA, so there is a potential that the "issue" could be "fixed" with an firmware update. Who knows at this point... ??

tl;dr if you don't hear it with the music you listen to on your R2R 11, you won't hear it on the R-1.

 

[MelonHead]

I have an R-1. Yes, it is there. I love it either way. Note, it is ONLY with certain tracks. PM me if you'd like, and I can point you to a few free tracks to try. You'll hear it on the R2R11 so you know what I am describing. See the main R2R thread also for more info. Do you use native DSD as provided from the label / studio and/or do you or do you software convert? I can try some of your music and see if it may be an issue if you'd like. Note, I have only heard this particular issue in cases where the original recording was done in high depth and rate PCM / DXD. That is not to say there are not other cases, but I have not found them. Kingwa is investigating. The good news is that the R-1 has an FPGA, so there is a potential that the "issue" could be "fixed" with an firmware update. Who knows at this point... ??

tl;dr if you don't hear it with the music you listen to on your R2R 11, you won't hear it on the R-1.

Hey, thanks for the answer. I know about the problem, I was one of the firsts who recognized it, and a few of us were active member in a private thread regarding the issue a few month ago. I'll check the main R2R thread, as I wasn't aware of other involved products but the R2R-11. I will contact Joss@Magna-Hifi as well. I'll send you a PM as my DSD noise sampler music library is still available.

 

[Lespectraal]

Anybody know if this is a good pair for the ATH-R70X?

 

[MelonHead]

Anybody know if this is a good pair for the ATH-R70X?

What kind of sound signature do you want from the pair?
I've had a short time to test the R2R 11 with some AT headphones, but I'm a Beyer guy, so my answer has to be taken according to this.
If you are after meticulous, the most detailed, cleanest, and driest sound, my answer is No.
If you like untroubled, but powerful, sensual but natural sound character, than you would have a good chance to like the result.
It's important to mention, that while the amp part is a nice add-on in this combo, probably not the best in class.

 

[Lespectraal]

I see, so for amping I should look somewhere else..

Thanks for your input

 

[MelonHead]

I see, so for amping I should look somewhere else..

Thanks for your input

Don't take it too seriously, It is definitely a a good amp. I'm sure, many people take this and don't look back anymore.
You can't have everything maxed out in a sub EUR/USD 500 hp amp/dac combo, 'cause there will be no room for high-end.

 

[J Mirra]

Ive stopped for sure the R2R11 and the T1.1 is golden. It has everything I ever wanted, it's all I need

 

[Nickol]

I recently read about it
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-measurements-of-audio-gd-r2r11-dac-amp.5779/
What do you think about it?

I know that here, on the forum, in the community, there must be quite a few people who have had (had) experience with various DAC, as well as compared with other devices.
Have most of us heard so badly and been deceived?

 

[MelonHead]

I recently read about it
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-measurements-of-audio-gd-r2r11-dac-amp.5779/
What do you think about it?

I know that here, on the forum, in the community, there must be quite a few people who have had (had) experience with various DAC, as well as compared with other devices.
Have most of us heard so badly and been deceived?

I've shared it a few days ago in the main Audio-gd R2R thread.
Kingwa has replied on his front page as well. I copy it for the future, as "latest news" change regulary.

"A message to respond some one

The English is not my advantage so the message must had a lot grammar mistook.
If I was you, I would not say anything how the specs effect the sound quality.
You can say how bad of the specs and the sound quality , but you should not hint the transparency = low distortion.
Did you say the tube devices sound not transparency? Or did you mean the phono sound not transparency ?
You know how to measure , you may know the electric technology, but you may don't know the audio technology.

I have very lot changes to measure the expensive hi-end devices of different brands, because a lot customers brought their units come to our listen room to have the compared with our products.
I have measured the wonderful units to study why their sound is tube like or transparency or sound digital .
Through a lot measured and studied I know how to make the sound like analogue but not digital .
Audio study is large different to electric study . I can not study the audio technology only in book but I must open and study by the hi-end units , a lot practice and listen are necessary.

Did you know the specs effect between OS and NOS ? The same unit, OS and NOS can had 15DB different on the THD.
It is a unit only with NOS design.
We have declared on the web page :THD today is extremely low with Sigma Delta chips; R2R ladders have good THD but nos as good as Delta Sigma .
In your point the most DS design must better than most R2R design.

In the web page we have declared the unit sound has Smooth, coherent and analogue sound quality and has no emphasise on any frequencies in audio spectrum, and more like real oil painting.
It obvious design for the analog or tube like sound .
It must some things like the pure analog design .
There are over 3000 users and I had got a lot feedback from users says sound wonderful, I don't think these users don't know how to listen music .

A few Americians may dislike the Chinese products, like Mr. Donald don't like Huawei .
But music has not limit of countries. We are not only enjoy the Chinese music but we also respect the oversea musicians .
The most people just want to enjoy the music but not enjoy the specs."
Source: http://audio-gd.com/En audio-gd.htm

Trust your ears!

 

[Nickol]

Thanks, MelonHead
I have already read this.

But Such a response confirms only that all these measurements
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-measurements-of-audio-gd-r2r11-dac-amp.5779/
are correct.

He essentially has nothing to say.
Nevertheless, his higher, expensive products in the line have good measurements (and he measures them and publishes measurements and these specifications. Why then do it? After all, just "trust your ears.")
In all other lower products - we have the following:
It turns out that many people with good hearing simply will hear the polluted, distorted, and poorly detailed sound.
(which is called "oil painting").
right?

 

[MelonHead]

Thanks, MelonHead
I have already read this.

But Such a response confirms only that all these measurements
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-measurements-of-audio-gd-r2r11-dac-amp.5779/
are correct.

He essentially has nothing to say.
Nevertheless, his higher, expensive products in the line have good measurements (and he measures them and publishes measurements and these specifications. Why then do it? After all, just "trust your ears.")
In all other lower products - we have the following:
It turns out that many people with good hearing simply will hear the polluted, distorted, and poorly detailed sound.
(which is called "oil painting").
right?

As he mentioned, it's like tube amps or vinyls. Both have poor measurements, but somehow many-many audiophiles likes them.
I guess, this measurement result comes mainly from the absence of passive and active filters in the DAC. He wanted to present an affordable R2R DAC/AMP combo, where the total cost is a big limitation factor. I'm sure he would be able to put cheap filters into the box for better measurement results, but they will degrade the listening pleasure.

 

[gLer]

polluted, distorted, and poorly detailed sound

Those are your words (and Amir’s), not Kingwa’s. I think measurements are useful to a point. If something measures ‘poorly’ against some or other ‘standard’ of what’s meant to be ‘good’, and yet sounds amazing, what do you do? Just dismiss it as no good? Or continue listening and enjoying the sound that you enjoy?

I believe Amir and others like him will do the former, while I prefer to trust my ears and do the latter. There’s no right or wrong here, just what you prefer.