[rsbrsvp]

I have the Phasure Audio Lush^2. Its a fine cable with a very full and rich sound. After geting and comparing with the Sablon 2020 USB I could not go back. My Sablon is not lean nor does it lack impact.

Nor is mine lean or lacking impact. Only that it is leaner than the Nimak. But it is superior, clearly.

 

[DecentLevi]

Hey guys just wanted to report on the difference power cables can make with the DI-20. I had the Aurora 7 cable from Wireworld laying around from it's use with former amps, which BTW made a significant difference especially along with a top-class power conditioner, but even without it was still able to yield a better sound than a generic power cable into a standard power outlet. Better in this case was more organic, rich, smooth and detailed.

So just yesterday I thought I'd try it into the DI-20. Thinking it may not do anything because my DI-20 must have already reached it's peak potential, I thought - what the heck. Boy was I WRONG! The sound of the DI-20 now can only be described with words such as spectacular and engulfing... eclipsing just about anything you can imagine! It went from sounding fantastic with great realism, authority and detail to sounding totally lucid with engulfing realism, deeper into the scene and smoother details. I had a few songs with fatiguing treble that I dealt with because I thought that was just the way it was recorded - but now the treble manages to be even more detailed but at the same time less tiresome. I'm now getting better bass, more holographic sound and everything is more organic / true to life, along with the smoother treble lets me turn up the volume more with less fatigue. Just plain luscious!

Interestingly I had already written off the merits of aftermarket power cables with the DI-20, being that I already had a failed experiment a while back. I took a standard power cable like the thicker black one shown in the middle of the photo below and tried a few ferrite clamps (ferrite beads / chokes) of different ratings on it, but IMO it only had negative impact on the sound; edgier or more dull accordingly; since then I was happy with just the standard medium-thick cord - that is, until I tried the Aurora 7 cable. Also note that yes I did a few A/B comparisons with these cables and the difference was repeatable not subtle.

My theory on why this has such a big impact on the sound would have to do with overall clean power in my chain. Logically you cannot get a "better quality" binary stream of 0's and 1's coming out of this DDC by improving power filtering. So what's going on here? Certainly part of it must have to do with better EMI/RFI, etc. rejection inside the DI-20, but I think a lion's share of the difference is also due to the fact that supplying cleaner power to your DI-20 also has the effect of trickling down this cleaner power to the rest of your chain; IE to your DAC. My Chord Qutest DAC this is connected to already uses a very high performing (and affordable) linear DC power conditioner (LPS); the only one in the world exactly like it thanks to a custom request to @Triode User . Now instead of feeding my DAC clean DC power and 'iffy' signal and/or power from the BNC cable that comes from the DI-20, now both cables are giving it ultra clean power, and the sound I'm getting is just incredible.

Of course YMMV a lot, depending on your chain especially the chosen DAC, existence of any power conditioner and/or power conditioning cables, and if your DI-20 is the standard or HE version. I have the normal version but IIRC the HE version has a separate power section so may/not benefit from such power filtering. For me the sound I'm getting is a culmination of this and many customizations including very premium specific ferrite chokes on USB cable from PC to the DDC and more on the BNC output cable, thick silver RCA audio cable, etc. And by no means do I proclaim this to be the 'world's best' option, this 5-foot (custom length) cable went for only $150 and there are numerous other options out there including pricier as well.

For me though this is the best I've ever heard the DI-20 anyway... and in a bit I will finally try the newer firmware from October.

 

[DecentLevi]

Super brief notes on newer firmware impressions:

- Coming from V 4.07Beta which to me was a legend, a breakthrough in fidelity with a very vivid, detailed and extended sound.
- V 3.933: highly detailed, even perhaps to the point of fatiguing.
- V 4.076: as detailed as above but maybe a nuance more laid back. This one focuses on soundstage and will please if that's your focus. Maybe too much emphasis on this and instrument separation.
- V 4.075: Initially it seemed bright, but after brain burn-in, this thing's all you could ask for! Seems to build of my favorite 4.07Beta, but seems to squeeze out that last drop of super bass purity / texture and adds a touch more of that lifelike / organic real world sensation. Bravo!! Nothing under/over done IMO. On my Qutest this like the Beta also sounds better on the "green" filter which seems to round off the top-end extremities a bit and adds just a touch more mids.

All my personal take.

 

[FredA]

Hey guys just wanted to report on the difference power cables can make with the DI-20. I had the Aurora 7 cable from Wireworld laying around from it's use with former amps, which BTW made a significant difference especially along with a top-class power conditioner, but even without it was still able to yield a better sound than a generic power cable into a standard power outlet. Better in this case was more organic, rich, smooth and detailed.

​

So just yesterday I thought I'd try it into the DI-20. Thinking it may not do anything because my DI-20 must have already reached it's peak potential, I thought - what the heck. Boy was I WRONG! The sound of the DI-20 now can only be described with words such as spectacular and engulfing... eclipsing just about anything you can imagine! It went from sounding fantastic with great realism, authority and detail to sounding totally lucid with engulfing realism, deeper into the scene and smoother details. I had a few songs with fatiguing treble that I dealt with because I thought that was just the way it was recorded - but now the treble manages to be even more detailed but at the same time less tiresome. I'm now getting better bass, more holographic sound and everything is more organic / true to life, along with the smoother treble lets me turn up the volume more with less fatigue. Just plain luscious!

Interestingly I had already written off the merits of aftermarket power cables with the DI-20, being that I already had a failed experiment a while back. I took a standard power cable like the thicker black one shown in the middle of the photo below and tried a few ferrite clamps (ferrite beads / chokes) of different ratings on it, but IMO it only had negative impact on the sound; edgier or more dull accordingly; since then I was happy with just the standard medium-thick cord - that is, until I tried the Aurora 7 cable. Also note that yes I did a few A/B comparisons with these cables and the difference was repeatable not subtle.


My theory on why this has such a big impact on the sound would have to do with overall clean power in my chain. Logically you cannot get a "better quality" binary stream of 0's and 1's coming out of this DDC by improving power filtering. So what's going on here? Certainly part of it must have to do with better EMI/RFI, etc. rejection inside the DI-20, but I think a lion's share of the difference is also due to the fact that supplying cleaner power to your DI-20 also has the effect of trickling down this cleaner power to the rest of your chain; IE to your DAC. My Chord Qutest DAC this is connected to already uses a very high performing (and affordable) linear DC power conditioner (LPS); the only one in the world exactly like it thanks to a custom request to @Triode User . Now instead of feeding my DAC clean DC power and 'iffy' signal and/or power from the BNC cable that comes from the DI-20, now both cables are giving it ultra clean power, and the sound I'm getting is just incredible.

Of course YMMV a lot, depending on your chain especially the chosen DAC, existence of any power conditioner and/or power conditioning cables, and if your DI-20 is the standard or HE version. I have the non HE version which IIRC has a separate power section so may/not benefit from such power filtering. For me the sound I'm getting is a culmination of this and many customizations including very premium specific ferrite chokes on USB cable from PC to the DDC and more on the BNC output cable, thick silver RCA audio cable, etc. And by no means do I proclaim this to be the 'world's best' option, this 5-foot (custom length) cable went for only $150 and there are numerous other options out there including pricier as well.

For me though this is the best I've ever heard the DI-20 anyway... and in a bit I will finally try the newer firmware from October.

It's all about the fact that noise translates into jitter. Timing is very important. An audio signal has 2 dimensions, amplitude ans time. We are used to inaccuracies with amplitude, as humain being and our hearing is not dead accurate and precise as far as perceiving amplitudes. But we have incredible precision with perceiving timing as this allows locating an object/creature emitting sound.

Another thing about jitter is it changes the signal's energy distribution in terms of frequencies. So it can impact the tonal balance.

 

[sajunky]

Interestingly I had already written off the merits of aftermarket power cables with the DI-20, being that I already had a failed experiment a while back. I took a standard power cable like the thicker black one shown in the middle of the photo below and tried a few ferrite clamps (ferrite beads / chokes) of different ratings on it, but IMO it only had negative impact on the sound; edgier or more dull accordingly; since then I was happy with just the standard medium-thick cord - that is, until I tried the Aurora 7 cable. Also note that yes I did a few A/B comparisons with these cables and the difference was repeatable not subtle.

Congratulations!

I need to add comment on standard cables. How thick is a cable it doesn't matter as currently, there is more mass volume of PVC, less copper. You never know how thick are copper wires, unless you cut wires. The old PC mains cables (when IBM dominated the market) result in better sound than a new ones. Aurora cable (looking from a picture) is shielded on each wire separately and with a power conditioner can bring even better result. A shield allows to move a point where EMI start emiting a noise meters away from the device, it is important.

A surprise in your post comes from a fact that DDC benefits from power cables. Of course, it does... Especially when using I2S interface. In this case a clock is generated on a DDC, a DAC just synchronise to this clock. On the other side, in the configuration where external clock is used, the most importand device is a clock generator device.

Using ferrite clamps is recommended on USB cables, but not on power cables. The whole idea of ferrite chokes is to redirect a flow of ground loops between two devices from interconnects to the power supply chain. If you place a choke on the USB cable you increase impedance for a common mode noise, so a main current will start flowing the easiest path. Now it comes to the point I want to make that placing a choke on the power cable leads to the redirecting current flow to the interconnect cable, it is wrong!

Situation is changing when you place ferrite choke on both power cables (not a individual one). It is easy to do when you follow a general recommendation to lay down power cables together (even tie them together). It increase a common mode impedance for both devices, but a current flow between both devices is unaffected. I recommend to try it. Ordinary chokes from a hardware shop work well, expensive audiophile type is not needed on power cords nor USB cables.

 

[davidjus]

Using ferrite clamps is recommended on USB cables, but not on power cables. The whole idea of ferrite chokes is to redirect a flow of ground loops between two devices from interconnects to the power supply chain. If you place a choke on the USB cable you increase impedance for a common mode noise, so a main current will start flowing the easiest path. Now it comes to the point I want to make that placing a choke on the power cable leads to the redirecting current flow to the interconnect cable, it is wrong!

Situation is changing when you place ferrite choke on both power cables (not a individual one). It is easy to do when you follow a general recommendation to lay down power cables together (even tie them together). It increase a common mode impedance for both devices, but a current flow between both devices is unaffected. I recommend to try it. Ordinary chokes from a hardware shop work well, expensive audiophile type is not needed on power cords nor USB cables.

Sorry, I don't understand very well. You say: " Situation is changing when you place ferrite choke on both power cables (not a individual one). It is easy to do when you follow a general recommendation to lay down power cables together (even tie them together)"


Do you mean both power cables so: DI power cable + Dacs power cable + amps power cable?
One or more pieces of ferrite on each of them?
Can you explain better how do it, or showing some pictures, please?

 

[sajunky]

Do you mean both power cables so: DI power cable + Dacs power cable + amps power cable?
One or more pieces of ferrite on each of them?
Can you explain better how do it, or showing some pictures, please?

The ideal condition is when there is one power conditioner for all devices, all power cables are laid down close together to reduce EMI emision (or even shielded). It create an uniform power delivery for all devices. Placing a choke on a single cable doesn't make any sense. It makes your setup less uniform, it increase potential diferences between this device and all other. In result a current flow is changing, it will go through interconnects, it is not what you want!

In most cases you want to reduce ground loops between the most sensitible devices. It is usually a DAC and a source. In this case adding a ferrite clamps on the USB cable helps a lot. The same with HDMI cable. In both cases transmission is fully differencial, not affected by a choke, as it works on a common mode signals you want to get rid of and is fully recommended.

In some situation you may want to further reduce common mode noise of these two devices. You probably can't find large enough ferrite to clamp on the all power cables. In this case you will add a clamp on a pair of power cables. It doesn't change a current flow between these two critical devices which is good, but it create potential differences between those and all other, it is a trade off. It will put stress on other connections, in this case on RCA analogue DAC output, less on XLR. What is the best, you will find out only by testing. I can't give universal cure.

 

[DecentLevi]

It's all about the fact that noise translates into jitter. Timing is very important. An audio signal has 2 dimensions, amplitude ans time. We are used to inaccuracies with amplitude, as humain being and our hearing is not dead accurate and precise as far as perceiving amplitudes. But we have incredible precision with perceiving timing as this allows locating an object/creature emitting sound.

Another thing about jitter is it changes the signal's energy distribution in terms of frequencies. So it can impact the tonal balance.

So I guess cleaner power really can give "better quality" binary stream of 0's and 1's. I guess my guess is as good as yours if cleaner power into the DDC has a trickle down effect of improving other connected components as well.

Using ferrite clamps is recommended on USB cables, but not on power cables. The whole idea of ferrite chokes is to redirect a flow of ground loops between two devices from interconnects to the power supply chain. If you place a choke on the USB cable you increase impedance for a common mode noise, so a main current will start flowing the easiest path. Now it comes to the point I want to make that placing a choke on the power cable leads to the redirecting current flow to the interconnect cable, it is wrong!

Situation is changing when you place ferrite choke on both power cables (not a individual one). It is easy to do when you follow a general recommendation to lay down power cables together (even tie them together). It increase a common mode impedance for both devices, but a current flow between both devices is unaffected. I recommend to try it. Ordinary chokes from a hardware shop work well, expensive audiophile type is not needed on power cords nor USB cables.

Insightful points about the potential of ferrite chokes, but I didn't understand the scientific concepts about ground loops and increasing impedance for a common mode or redirecting it. The main thing I do agree on is What is the best, you will find out only by testing. I can't give universal cure. I spent countless hours over weeks testing and big bucks transforming my entire hi-fi system with ferrite beads, and I applied them based solely on what sounds good to me. While I do agree that ferrites don't sound good on the AC cable for this DDC, they are 'lifting their weight in gold' so to speak on the AC power cables of my amps and DC power cable going into my USB reclocker/purifier. My DAC doesn't need one being it's powered by a DC LPS.

I also agree with their benefit on USB cables. My highly extensive testing with numerous A/B's has told me however that in fact audiophile type ferrite chokes make a huge difference. Ordinary ferrite chokes sounded acceptable but the sound really came into its' own when using four of the STAR-TEC LFS (8.5mm size, universal item number: 74272132) series which targets the lower frequencies. It went from sounding OK yet fatiguing to highly organic, smooth treble, great bass weight and dynamics.

I found ferrite chokes can benefit almost ALL cables in my system: most AC/DC cables, USB, BNC, RCA and headphone cables. The trick is to experiment with which type sound good on which cables based on your preference and system synergy. Some cables use only the low or higher frequency ferrite chokes, others use a combination, and some even sound better with the cheap Chinese ones, as is the case of some of my DC and headphone cables. Never use too many or you'll 'choke' the good sounds, and often yields better results to use more clustered together on the 'receiving' side of the cable.

The difference between the two series is the core material. STAR-TEC ferrites have a NiZn core for supplementary interference suppression in the 1MHz to 1GHz range whereas the STAR-TEC LFS series feature a MnZn core for a low frequency suppression range from 300kHz to 30MHz.

The premium ferrite chokes are able to isolate frequencies much lower than ordinary ferrite chokes like the all black Chinese ones sold for pennies.

Here's how my chosen configuration looks on a BNC cable. (red marking was my indication of a different rating type)

These premium ferrites cost about $4 each and for my whole system it set me back $100's, but to me it was worth every penny because their cumulative effect on the sound is a TOTAL TRANSFORMATION of sound, as if upgrading every single component. I tried several premium brands and am forever a believer in the STAR-TEC brand; also they do have sizes all the way up to 13mm. I would never consider my hi-fi system complete again without them.

Also it's worth repeating that on the DI-20 (non HE), for some reason this benefits more with power conditioner and isolating AC cables than using ferrite chokes on standard AC cables.

 

[sajunky]

The difference between the two series is the core material. STAR-TEC ferrites have a NiZn core for supplementary interference suppression in the 1MHz to 1GHz range whereas the STAR-TEC LFS series feature a MnZn core for a low frequency suppression range from 300kHz to 30MHz.

The premium ferrite chokes are able to isolate frequencies much lower than ordinary ferrite chokes like the all black Chinese ones sold for pennies.

These are pretty standard EMI suppression chokes, there are other premium brands. TDK is the most respectful brand, available in many online shops. However I don't recommend using ferrite clamps on coax clock (like in your picture) or S/PDIF cable. It increase a slew rate of a signal, resulting more jitter, in other words - bad application. The same on the analog unbalanced interconnects. There are better ways to deal with a noise on analog lines than introducing inductors with hysteresis to the audio path. This is what I refer as audiophile type:

Such packages frequently come with marketing bull spreading confusion amoung users, like this:

Noise suppression filter manufactured using TDK's proprietary low distortion ferrite material
TDK newly developed a new ferrite material which achieves low distortion while retaining its noise elimination characteristics.

 

[Ratephi]

Has anybody tested a DI-20HE in combination with a Chord DAVE?

 

[tumpux]

I dont think the Chord market overlapped much with AGD market..

 

[sajunky]

Actually DI-20 spreads like corona virus. Ask user @Articnoise, this member asks challenging question at times in the high-end section and is a dedicated Chord user, having Hugo TT2 and DI-20HE in the sig.

 

[tumpux]

One outta 62,515 makes it more like a haemophilia case.. but please carry on.

 

[Articnoise]

Of course, you are right about how few people have both a Chord DAC and a DI-20HE.

Many people think that a DDC is only useful for those who want to convert the digital signal to I2S, but I am of a different opinion and use it for both my Pandora DAC and TT2. The sound enhancement provided by DI20HE is the same for both DACs. It is a larger sound image with more blackness and a more transformative sound with more density, without sacrificing any details or transparency. The base is clearly fatter and has both better weight and definition. The biggest improvement, however, is in the mids, which sounds richer and more lifelike.

 

[FredA]

Of course, you are right about how few people have both a Chord DAC and a DI-20HE.

Many people think that a DDC is only useful for those who want to convert the digital signal to I2S, but I am of a different opinion and use it for both my Pandora DAC and TT2. The sound enhancement provided by DI20HE is the same for both DACs. It is a larger sound image with more blackness and a more transformative sound with more density, without sacrificing any details or transparency. The base is clearly fatter and has both better weight and definition. The biggest improvement, however, is in the mids, which sounds richer and more lifelike.

Right on. After a few days of burn-in, the di20he gives you a preview of what is can do, and it did put a large smile on my face for the raisons you mentioned. I could not believe it.