Audeze Penrose X and Penrose
Dec 1, 2020 at 1:50 PM Post #2,477 of 5,890

sidhelps

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I think the fight above is hitting on something important, though I don’t want to pile on. I think there was a failure to communicate some of the functions of this headset and its accompanying software. I expected chatmix as well, but its loss is less important for my needs. However, I did expect both an iOS application and independent volume control in dual wireless mode. I understand the official explanations that neither is possible, but it’s not what I expected in the product and reduces its value to me for my needs. I feel badly for anyone who doesn’t have access to a PC to run critical updates, especially with the audio bug in the launch firmware. Hopefully the firmware and the Mac/Android applications will launch at the same time, and hopefully both soon.
Independent volume control should work with Android imo. I will update on this feature as soon as I get my hands on Penrose.

Anyone with an android phone and Penrose headset is welcome to contact me for the steps for independent volume control.
 
Dec 1, 2020 at 5:48 PM Post #2,481 of 5,890
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In case any of you guys are wondering about my Penrose review. I have much written (like 95%), but I'm waiting on the next firmware before I solidify my review, as various things are being addressed, and I don't want my review impressions to be outdated. Mic clarity in particular is something I was pretty vivid about on the review, and so I wanna make sure the supposed clarity improvements make a meaningful difference.

I didn't address the whoosh issue because it's definitely being fixed, and I personally didn't hear it with 99% of my time with the Penrose...
 
Dec 1, 2020 at 6:17 PM Post #2,482 of 5,890
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To keep this on topic, I've received the new beta version and can confirm the noise floor is lower, and the female voice is much quieter. As for the whoosh, it's completely gone. All I need to address with the new fw is the mic clarity, which is my biggest concern. I'll be doing that now.

Doesn't VRR on the C9 increase input lag and raise black levels on the C9?

The difference between no vsync and vrr is like 1-2ms. I think it went from 6ms to 8ms. Definitely imperceptible. I can attest to it being amazingly responsive. As for black levels, this is...a little misunderstood. It doesn't raise black levels, it raises near 0 black levels, so the stuff just above blacks. The problem is real, but can be mitigated by lower brightness setting a few notches. So instead of 50 brightness, 47-48 fixes most of this issue. Since 0 is already true black, there's no downside to crushing the 0- value further. The tweak to lower near 0 back down to more correct levels fixes the higher VRR issues. Though not a perfect fix, it is a big one.



And i gotta say, as a big fan of CRT's, and plasma's to a lesser extent the LG C9 is both a downgrade and an upgrade. it's a mixed bag and is definitely not worth paying full price for. I ended up buying a mint floor display model and saved hundreds. no issues, no burn in etc. Also, i would _never_ let an LCD/LED/QLED, in my living room. even the top tier qled's with a 9ms motion response time have nasty motion smearing, along with the irritating compromises of local dimming such as blooming, and the dimming of white text and smaller white objects on black back grounds etc. Then there's the typical narrow viewing angles and of course inferior black levels. They're capable of of good color though, and are rocking true RGB color unlike OLED.....

While the C9 delivers a lot less motion blur than a good QLED, along with perfect black levels, amazing brightness & White whites(Vs Plasma),and wide viewing angles it stumbles with it's lower color volume, WRGB Color, Auto brightness limiting and Black crush.

Eh, I haven't noticed much in terms of black crush. Yeah, it's not my VT60 plasma in terms of shadow detail, but it's fine overall. Much better than OLEDs of yesteryear.

And 'like' QLED it only has a measly 300 lines of motion resolution. hell, an average plasma could deliver 700 lines with less blur, while others like the VT25, GT25 and panasonics latest and greatest VT60 did 1080 lines....All of the above problems never even existed on something like a 1987 Sony SD CRT. CRT is the only the tv tech with a stable picture. Zero motion blur, 480 lines of motion resolution that matches the native resolution of the TV itself, no ABL, No input lag, No black crush, great color and great blacks, the latter two depending on the model of course.

And sure, you can turn on BFI and gain 1080 lines with something like a 2020 Panasonic OLED, but then brightness takes a big hit and the input lag increases. Might be doable in a dark room for movies though if you favor 100 nits. Also, the C9's color out of the box was atrocious.....there was so much green in the picture, skin tones looked too yellow, yellows were too green and lacked warmth, picture was too cool and colors were desaturated. thankfully most of this can be corrected with color management and reducing 'High' GREEN in the white balance settings.

But yeah, I totally miss my 2003/4 Sony Wega trinitron 32" SDTV. :p....well, minus the funky silver bezel. the 27" models are perfect for Retro gaming hehe.

I'm one of those guys that uses BFI at all times when gaming with the C9. It's plenty bright. OLED light at 100 with BFI is the equivalent of OLED light at 40 without, more or less. Without BFI, I generally leave my OLED light at 25-30, so trust me when In say the TV is bright enough. In HDR, it's even brighter still even with BFI. Much brighter than I'd ever need it to be. Yeah it's not 1000nits, but I had a Quantum X FALD Vizio which had like 2500nits peak, and it was tooooooo much. Hell even NU8000 Samsung which had over 1000 and the outside Vizio P series in the living room have more brightness than I'd want personally.

As for input lag, even with BFI it's fine. It's def not like VRR/no vsync, but for 99% of games I play, it's more than responsive. I mean, as long as input lag measurements are below 30ms (which this TV WITH BFI is not even 20ms), I'm fine.


The c9 ( with BFI does around 700lines, which is definitely more than enough for motion clarity, compared to the terrible 300lines of no BFI. I can't play without BFI. It's too blurry. WEith BFI, it's perfectly fine. It ain't my VT60 for motion, but it's close.

120hz mode disables BFI, but it's motion clarity is equivalent to BFI, so I'm happy with that as well. Justwaiting to replace my 2080ti with a 3080 or igher so I can take advantage of 4K/120 instead of being limited to 1440p/120.
 
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Dec 1, 2020 at 6:40 PM Post #2,483 of 5,890

Breadwinka

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To keep this on topic, I've received the new beta version and can confirm the noise floor is lower, and the female voice is much quieter. As for the whoosh, it's completely gone. All I need to address with the new fw is the mic clarity, which is my biggest concern. I'll be doing that now.

Can't wait for this update talking on discord with my friends is driving me crazy, the whoosh noise is there 100% of the time.
 
Dec 1, 2020 at 6:42 PM Post #2,484 of 5,890

drsnowball

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Sounds great, MLE. Your review of the Mobius is part of the reason I started following this thread.

Is there any ability to opt-in on the beta, or an ETA on the firmware? The whoosh is very apparent in my use conditions (I'm assuming lower-quality audio, because work calls and certain game noises have it bad for me), so it's made personally judging the headset difficult.
 
Dec 1, 2020 at 6:47 PM Post #2,485 of 5,890
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Sounds great, MLE. Your review of the Mobius is part of the reason I started following this thread.

Is there any ability to opt-in on the beta, or an ETA on the firmware? The whoosh is very apparent in my use conditions (I'm assuming lower-quality audio, because work calls and certain game noises have it bad for me), so it's made personally judging the headset difficult.
I assume since it's a beta, and they're still making tweaks, it's not available to the public.. It'll be worth it. I know waiting sucks, but once you get it, it'll be a thing of the past. :)

I don't know the ETA, so I'll leave it to Audeze to communicate that with you guys.

I'll likely have to rewrite a few sections of my review, since I KNEW I should've waited for the fixes. Ah well.
 
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Dec 1, 2020 at 8:06 PM Post #2,486 of 5,890

kism

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Got mine yesterday. Tried 'em out for about a half hour before I had to leave for the day. First turned them on and plugged into my PC, I heard the whooshing noise everyone is describing. I downloaded the Audeze app, and plugged them in with the included USB cord. After my PC and the app both recognized the headphones, I turned the sidetone feature to off and these things went pretty much dead silent. I listened to a few tracks via Tidal, and the audio quality is very good. Later yesterday, I started playing Ghost of Tsushima on my PS4 and they sound good there, too. However, at the beginning of the game I kept getting static/crackling noises like they were having trouble getting the audio data or something. After a few minutes they shut off and reconnected. That lady is indeed very loud, and she actually scared me lol. Once reconnected, I don't remember having any more problems like that last night. I sit about 6-8ft from my consoles, and maybe 10ft from my PC.

Today, I played a bit more of the game, and while I did not experience the reconnecting issue, every now and then I hear like 1 or 2 crackles or pops. They would just come and go very quickly and randomly. Sometimes it's just in one ear, and it was mildly uncomfortable to experience. Anyone else hear anything like this? I stopped after a while to put them on the charger and take a break. I'll keep testing them throughout the week. I wanted to try them Bluetooth for walking so I can hopefully return my Sony XM4s if they sound good enough. Speaking of which;


I know they aimed at different users, but how do these compare to the Sony wh-1000xm4 for their sound?

Thanks

While owning both right at this moment, I think the Penrose do sound a bit better right out of the gate. The Sony will sound their best plugged in via aux or using the LDAC codec, and when doing either they do sound pretty good. If you use the AAC or SBC codecs, the sound quality goes way down, though. I'm hoping the Penrose sound good enough with AAC. On the Sony, the stage is small, but the separation and timbre are both very good. Everything sounds as it should to my ears, though it doesn't really give me the same "feeling" that I get from the Penrose. The Penrose feel like they have slightly more texture, space, and detail in their sound. The Sony are more comfortable, however. I like that they come in a small form with a thin case that's easy to throw in my bag. I also really appreciate the sound-dampening feature with the XM4. It's so good for me as I have very noisy neighbors. I tried purchasing Bluetooth adapters for my consoles and PC, but the sound and connection quality were both terrible. The main reason I bought the Penrose was so that I could connect wireless and lossless to my PC, Switch, and PS4, while hopefully getting decent sound via Bluetooth on my phone. With a game or music playing, so far I haven't felt like I needed more outside sound reduction. My feelings on this may change as I use them more. These are just my first impressions. I would guess that I have 20-30 hours on the Sony, and maybe 3-5 hours on the Penrose so far.
 
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Dec 1, 2020 at 8:29 PM Post #2,487 of 5,890

ericking

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Today, I played a bit more of the game, and while I did not experience the reconnecting issue, every now and then I hear like 1 or 2 crackles or pops. They would just come and go very quickly and randomly. Sometimes it's just in one ear, and it was mildly uncomfortable to experience. Anyone else hear anything like this?

I’ve also been experiencing crackling/popping, along with the disconnects. I tried moving the USB dongle from the front of the console to the back and I think that helped, but I need to do some more testing tonight.
 
Dec 1, 2020 at 8:29 PM Post #2,488 of 5,890

trellus

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Firmware is software, yes, but more specifically it's firmware, a specific subset of software.
When you say "software" it gives an end user the impression they may have to install something. When you say "firmware", the specific type of software being used here, it's made clear the installation is on your end, not the end user's.

And it sounds like they barely did any research, certainly not enough hands-on time with competing products, if their conclusion was that it would somehow be simpler to have to use software you install on each device you own than to have it just automatically work, or more platform support friendly to rely on software they develop for maybe two pc platforms at best than a truly universal system that works on every single operating system even if it's something so niche Audeze wouldn't even know it exists. Unless they mean simpler FOR THEM and not FOR YOU, which is just lazy. It's hard not to come to that conclusion when they're practically outright admitting it with keeping things simple on their end as the excuse for the missing feature.

Uh, yes, they meant it is simpler for them -- that was clear from their answer, when he said that "time" and complexity was a consideration. But your logic is unsound, when you say, therefore it's "just lazy," that's simply a leap of logic that is unsupported. There are a number of other reasons that can explain the decision to not implement that in hardware for this product, which have to do with resources and pricing, and the overall package. From the responses they've given, it's clear they made an informed, purposeful engineering, marketing, and business decision, and it just happens to that it means the product they created here is not right for you.

I assure you that they were not attempting to feature-load the Penrose so that it had every single feature of every headset on the market, but you are approaching it with that premise, which explains your frustration.

As I said, I'd love for it to have that feature, too, but it is not at all critical for me, audio quality is paramount, and it meets my needs. I'm confident there are many others like you for which the chat mix feature is critical -- and those people likely will also have the same unhappiness with Penrose, and that's totally fine -- but it doesn't therefore follow that Audeze is "just lazy," that's the thing. :)
 
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Dec 1, 2020 at 8:43 PM Post #2,489 of 5,890
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Various wireless gaming headsets I've used that don't have voice/chat mix. It's not a feature that every single headset needs or has. It's great when it's there, but anyone pretending all major headsets has it, well, that's just silly.

There are so many avenues to adjust between voice/chat (like in game settings), that it really isn't essential. The convenience is nice, but if including it gets in the way of other things or eats to the costs... it's fine if it's not there, personally.
 
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Dec 1, 2020 at 8:45 PM Post #2,490 of 5,890

undbecks85

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I’ve also been experiencing crackling/popping, along with the disconnects. I tried moving the USB dongle from the front of the console to the back and I think that helped, but I need to do some more testing tonight.

Try using a usb extension cable or hub. There’s a chance it could be interference from them being usb 3.0 ports. I have mine plugged into a small usb 2.0 hub and don’t experience and crackling/popping now. Not sure if it’s a sure fire fix, or if that’s what’s really going on, but it seemed to work for me.
 

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