[CreditingKarma]

Were the Phi that much better than the 4Z?

16K for magico.

Based on my research.. Genelec 8341 + 2 Genelec 7360A subs will entirely annihilate the system you are getting. this system will run about 12k and save you 4k.

with the above you are IN the music... cosmic. probably outperforms systems 10x.

@mightyKyn

I am not sure why you would say that the genelec would annihilate the Magico speakers. Could you expand on why they would be so much better? I am intrigued by the possibility that they are that much better. Do you currently have the genelec? Have you had a chance to listen to Magico speakers before? They are not a studio monitor like the genelec. I found the magico to be much better than my current dynaudio c1. They are incredibly good and built like tanks.

Lets just say that I am not paying 16k for the magico speakers. Plus I already have money invested in the front end of the system I have a hegel h360 for an amp that would be unused.

In regards to the Diana I found them better than the LCD4Z in regards to sound stage and resolution. The tonal balance is debatable basis the fit. I really liked the 4z and miss it still.

I will be sure to check out the genelec if I get a chance to in the Chicago area.

 

[CreditingKarma]

The Phi is definitely not better than the 4z, not sure what people are smoking. Phi's are more trebly and fatiguing and surprisingly a bit more uncomfortable in the way they fit my head (at least for myself).

I didn't claim that the Diana Phi is better than the LCD4Z. Only that it was more resolving and lighter than the 4z ( it is also brighter than the audeze but I find the hd800 and 800s much brighter). I really like my 4z but sold it to start my journey into 2 channel speaker setups with my dynaudios.
I did say that the AB-1266 Phi TC is a better headphone. Which I will stand by it is a faster headphone and the bass is on the same level with both it and the 4z. It really outshines the 4z in terms of resolution and sound stage. I know it will sound strange but I also find it more comfortable due to the lack of clamp. It is hard to get an impression of them at a show. It is important to get the correct fit which can take some trial and error. You might even need to bend the frame a bit to get it just right for people with a larger head ( I had bend it slightly).

In the end it comes down to preference. I have grown to enjoy the more revealing sound signature of the 1266. I found the same with my iems and ended up selling my jh roxannes after getting the noble Khan.

Enjoy the music.

 

[protoss]

No, I would say the biggest disgrace for Audeze is not that they failed to list the weight, but do something about that weight and come out with lighter models throughout their line.

I agree and disagree

Audeze hid that weight specification for 10 years! For 10 bloody years they never mentions it and people guess and bought a 600g + Headphone without knowing.

And when I question dozen of times on the weight. Audeze fanbois cried wolf about how a person neck is weak and stuff.

Eventually Audeze LCD 5 and so forth and revisions in the future will be all light.

 

[Dinrog]

just did some A/B with LCD 4Z (silver cable) and Z1R (copper cable) on the Kann Cube . both balanced
interesting

there is some music that the LCD4Z outperforms the Z1R on... Pentatonix type vocals...

BUT

although the soundstage is larger on the 4Z... vocals seem to get lost in more complicated mixes... something seems to be missing.

the soundstage on thr Z1R is great but you get a more intimate soundstage... which overall seems to sound better... vocals more forward.

with 4Z found I was turning up the vol to bring out vocals but the accompanying music too loud.

the Z1R seems to be a much better generalist on the Cube and the best I have ever heard them.

Comparing now with MQA.

LCD4Z CLEARLY wins on MQA...

very interesting... lower quality recordings fall apart with expanded soundstage.

most redbook unless exceptionally recorded will sound better on Z1R with smaller soundstage.

MQA and above 4Z SHine.

goddammit... need to drop 3k for this.

so without exception Z1R sounds better on cube for redbook in 90% of cases.

MQA and above 4Z wins and is stellar substantially better than Z1R.... really interesting how it looses its mojo with most under MQA.

literally if you have a 4k tv you need 4K content... this is 4Z.

we need computational DACs. way ahead on photos here... i see a new era of dacs that will literally usher in a new era of music will most likely take 5+ years as demand is not there like photos in smartphones. NONE of the current DAC makers have the engineering talent to currently do this.

I can see some people liking the Z1R for what it is, but i had it at home to compare against an LCD-X, 4z and He1k for quite a while. It was unfair from the getgo because open / closed but still.. There was something really wrong tonally with that thing. EQ also didnt fix it.. and then even for the asking price i paid (1.5k) i was severly dissapointed by the resolution of it. Whole spectrum was hazy and mushy in relation to the cost. Not even close to the other 3 planars, and that was normal flac files. I guess if it was
Like 700 bucks i would recommend it.

The 4z, like all audezes has an uppermids recession with will result in less dominant female voices, but you can remedy that to a degree with EQ btw

 

[mightyKyn]

I can see some people liking the Z1R for what it is, but i had it at home to compare against an LCD-X, 4z and He1k for quite a while. It was unfair from the getgo because open / closed but still.. There was something really wrong tonally with that thing. EQ also didnt fix it.. and then even for the asking price i paid (1.5k) i was severly dissapointed by the resolution of it. Whole spectrum was hazy and mushy in relation to the cost. Not even close to the other 3 planars, and that was normal flac files. I guess if it was
Like 700 bucks i would recommend it.

The 4z, like all audezes has an uppermids recession with will result in less dominant female voices, but you can remedy that to a degree with EQ btw

the z1r is a great set of cans for wjat is is... closed... light... cool ID... break in... kimber cable... very nice.

the LCD 4z should be no more than 2K.

Z1R 1K...

the whole market is overpriced.

want a closed can generalist with some nice musicality Z1R is way to go.

can't compare to open planer! specific use cases... I cant go for a leisurely hike with the 4z... I can with the Z!R.... whic blows away powerbeats and sony ANC cans.

 

[mightyKyn]

A/B'd the Z1R, LCD 4Z and Utopia on a Chord TT + MSCALER AND DAVE + MSCALER today for a few hours.

4Z destroys the Z1R...

4Z WAY better than Utopia... not sure how Focal can price them in same category as 4Z.

FYI MScaler is the real deal ... may get TT and MScaler with 4Z phenomenal...

Dave + Mscaler better than TT + Mscaler.

Did not get a chance to do serious A/B between those 2. Will try at a later date.

Will have TT + MSCALER for three day this weekend with my personal 4Z, IER Z1R and Z1R

If anyone wants me to test some music etc... let me know.

 

[118900]

LCD-4z arrived yesterday. Running through it’s stock cable and a dragonfly red (for the moment). First impressions very worrisome as the high frequencies sounded just too muffled, cotton-woolly. Tracks that I know quite well to have an ethereal quality (which was very well reproduced by my previous Stax 303s) sounded dull and shut in with the LCD-4z (even though the sound-staging was already exceptional). Just two hours into the breaking in process began to show some very noticeable improvements. The ethereal quality was still nowhere near the Stax but beginning to slowly catch up. Mid-range was clear and very well defined and definitely musical (there are tracks that with the Stax sounded too analytical where as on the Audeze’s sound just plain foot-tapping musical). Bass has a wondrous extension, very controlled and does not overbear on the music. Left to burn in all night and a quick listen indicates a continuation of the trend towards improvement. My plan is to burn in non stop and monitor over the next 4 days based on some posts seen here (major improvements are noticed after three days and up to 300 hours needed to remove all colouration) although it remains to be seen whether this is an accurate description of the process or whether it is exaggerated.

Would be nice to know why Audeze have a card indicating that the headphones tested are already run-in and ready for use when just two hours of continuous use demonstrate this is not the case.

Based on the experience of others on the forum is the above normal/indicative of your own LCD-4z?

 

[mightyKyn]

LCD-4z arrived yesterday. Running through it’s stock cable and a dragonfly red (for the moment). First impressions very worrisome as the high frequencies sounded just too muffled, cotton-woolly. Tracks that I know quite well to have an ethereal quality (which was very well reproduced by my previous Stax 303s) sounded dull and shut in with the LCD-4z (even though the sound-staging was already exceptional). Just two hours into the breaking in process began to show some very noticeable improvements. The ethereal quality was still nowhere near the Stax but beginning to slowly catch up. Mid-range was clear and very well defined and definitely musical (there are tracks that with the Stax sounded too analytical where as on the Audeze’s sound just plain foot-tapping musical). Bass has a wondrous extension, very controlled and does not overbear on the music. Left to burn in all night and a quick listen indicates a continuation of the trend towards improvement. My plan is to burn in non stop and monitor over the next 4 days based on some posts seen here (major improvements are noticed after three days and up to 300 hours needed to remove all colouration) although it remains to be seen whether this is an accurate description of the process or whether it is exaggerated.

Would be nice to know why Audeze have a card indicating that the headphones tested are already run-in and ready for use when just two hours of continuous use demonstrate this is not the case.

Based on the experience of others on the forum is the above normal/indicative of your own LCD-4z?

Dragon fly red!!’

cmon

read my recent posts. High quality source these things fly... crap in crap out

 

[118900]

Dragon fly red!!’

cmon

read my recent posts. High quality source these things fly... **** in **** out

I know I know but this is just for burn in as it doesn’t need a separate power supply like the Oppo Ha2-SE. I gave them a quick listen (about 30 mins) a little while ago on the Oppo after approx 16 hours non stop burn in and the sound has changed dramatically. To my ears the initial strengths of the low and mid have definitely resolved themselves even further and the highs are sounding as sweet as my previous Staxs. Basically I’m already beyond what I had before (for mids and lows) and easily on a par for highs so any improvement (and these things are supposed to require at least 3 days to really sing) is all uncharted and decidedly mind blowing new territory for me.

Next steps are the arrival of a nordost Heimdall 2 cable and yes, an upgrade to at least the Hugo 2 as a DAC.

Which DAC/HP amp would u recommend in a similar price bracket to the Hugo 2?

 

[sahmen]

LCD-4z arrived yesterday. Running through it’s stock cable and a dragonfly red (for the moment). First impressions very worrisome as the high frequencies sounded just too muffled, cotton-woolly. Tracks that I know quite well to have an ethereal quality (which was very well reproduced by my previous Stax 303s) sounded dull and shut in with the LCD-4z (even though the sound-staging was already exceptional). Just two hours into the breaking in process began to show some very noticeable improvements. The ethereal quality was still nowhere near the Stax but beginning to slowly catch up. Mid-range was clear and very well defined and definitely musical (there are tracks that with the Stax sounded too analytical where as on the Audeze’s sound just plain foot-tapping musical). Bass has a wondrous extension, very controlled and does not overbear on the music. Left to burn in all night and a quick listen indicates a continuation of the trend towards improvement. My plan is to burn in non stop and monitor over the next 4 days based on some posts seen here (major improvements are noticed after three days and up to 300 hours needed to remove all colouration) although it remains to be seen whether this is an accurate description of the process or whether it is exaggerated.

Would be nice to know why Audeze have a card indicating that the headphones tested are already run-in and ready for use when just two hours of continuous use demonstrate this is not the case.

Based on the experience of others on the forum is the above normal/indicative of your own LCD-4z?

You have ironically given away your own "red-flag" bottleneck : The Dragon-fly red! i do not think there is any amount of "burn-in" that could get rid of that bottleneck (see @mightyKyn 's post too, above)

Dragon fly red!!’

cmon

read my recent posts. High quality source these things fly... **** in **** out

My sentiments, exactly!

 

[118900]

You have ironically given away your own "red-flag" bottleneck : The Dragon-fly red! i do not think there is any amount of "burn-in" that could get rid of that bottleneck (see @mightyKyn 's post too, above)



My sentiments, exactly!

I fully agree but the DF red is simply being used to burn them in. Listening is done with the Oppo and the idea is to move to hugo2 or equivalent next month, give an old man some time to catch up . All I can say is that if this is how they sound already on a DF red and an Oppo HA2-SE with only 16 hours burn in then I will have reached my limit with a hugo2/Heimdall/LCD-4z set up.

 

[sahmen]

I fully agree but the DF red is simply being used to burn them in. Listening is done with the Oppo and the idea is to move to hugo2 or equivalent next month, give an old man some time to catch up . All I can say is that if this is how they sound already on a DF red and an Oppo HA2-SE with only 16 hours burn in then I will have reached my limit with a hugo2/Heimdall/LCD-4z set up.

Understood.

 

[CreditingKarma]

I fully agree but the DF red is simply being used to burn them in. Listening is done with the Oppo and the idea is to move to hugo2 or equivalent next month, give an old man some time to catch up . All I can say is that if this is how they sound already on a DF red and an Oppo HA2-SE with only 16 hours burn in then I will have reached my limit with a hugo2/Heimdall/LCD-4z set up.

Not sure if it is out of your budget but the LCD4Z sounds really good out of the sp1000 as they don't need much power to be driven. The sp1000 amp is also out and people seem to really like the pairing with that as well. You then would have an awesome portable source that you can use with iems too.

 

[tjwb84]

Is anyone aware of an update where the mesh color changed (more copper than yellow gold) and it looks less finely woven? This unit looks different from the other photos I've seen. Also wondering if a less fine weave would change the soundstage.

Since I'm about to take the plunge and purchase an LCD-4z (after a long series of auditions), and since I'm obsessing over every detail, I decided to ask Audeze about this. They are incredibly quick and thoughtful in their responses - big thumbs up. They told me the new mesh is a recent cosmetic change aimed at improving resistance to tarnishing, and that it has no impact on the sound signature of LCD-4z.

 

[mightyKyn]

I know I know but this is just for burn in as it doesn’t need a separate power supply like the Oppo Ha2-SE. I gave them a quick listen (about 30 mins) a little while ago on the Oppo after approx 16 hours non stop burn in and the sound has changed dramatically. To my ears the initial strengths of the low and mid have definitely resolved themselves even further and the highs are sounding as sweet as my previous Staxs. Basically I’m already beyond what I had before (for mids and lows) and easily on a par for highs so any improvement (and these things are supposed to require at least 3 days to really sing) is all uncharted and decidedly mind blowing new territory for me.

Next steps are the arrival of a nordost Heimdall 2 cable and yes, an upgrade to at least the Hugo 2 as a DAC.

Which DAC/HP amp would u recommend in a similar price bracket to the Hugo 2?

Here is the problem with the 4z and probably anything in this range....

after hours of a/b on the mojopoly, kann cube and Hugo tt2 + mscaler.... testing Z1R and 4z

here is the conclusion.

a generalist can is best for hiend portable... so Z1R and kann cube great... go for a walk.

very well recorded red book... MQa and above sound great on 4z. Much better than Z1R. However 90% of red book falls apart in 4z... something to do with the revealing nature causes havoc.

this is where the mscaler comes in. Transforms all red book to hirez to the extent that the 90% of the music will sound phenomenal.

in other words to get the most out of the 4z you are really going to need to spend 10k. Forget Hugo 2 plus mscaler you can’t go dual bnc and get the magic highest output.

so where Does this leave us. Z1R + kann cube or hugo2+2go for out and about

4z with mscaler and tt2 for the magic at home. You will spend hours a day so 10k is worth it.

Issue with 4z on a kann cube is When you hit the duds you will be annoyed and wonder why the f you paid 4K for these. With mscaler tt2 there is no doubt.

fyi my 4z going back. Trying to get lcd 24... for what I am hearing better than 4z and 500 cheaper but only sold by audeze