Astell&Kern new flagship A&Ultima SP2000
Mar 13, 2020 at 9:02 PM Post #2,866 of 5,856
It is called “Drift Parameters”, and any electrical engineering designers should have known it as it is a very basic knowledges. These parameters changes and drift away upon operational circumstances. Over a period of time, these parameters with a constant applicable circumstances becomes more stabilized due to the tolerances and the whole operation Of the systems including Temperature coefficient, ESR, DF....etc...

These Operational drift parameters are different from “Degradations overtime” or “shelves life degradations”. It is only found by applying a constant voltages in and out at a constant ambient temperature over a long period of time. Until the present or modern date that it became so pronounced with better high precision tolerances components, that it had to be disclosed in data sheets
For example this one from Vishay and pay attention at this.

Once again, it is from within Basic Component engineering designs, and if any engineers who don’t acknowledges....is likely a low grade engineers or the know nothing...because they can’t even read data sheets....unless “denying the facts” for business/financial purposes

Can you hear the differences ? That is out of the questions

Even Sony have to published it so. However, not all people can comprehend the Facts, and accept the facts, or both

Right, that gives a really helpful frame on what's generally going on during certain aspects of burn in, but what exactly accounts for this drift effect?

I'm sure you have "a few" ideas (grin)!

I think you may have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am referencing some of today's best audio engineers. They assume what you are describing. They're on "our side" (grin). They believe in burn in. What I wrote was that they don't claim to–"fully"–understand what goes on during burn in. There is debate among world class engineers as to what precisely is going on to cause parameters to drift, and why/how that can improve sound.

There is large scale agreement that caps and dielectrics need to form, but for e.g., some theorize about the directional alignment of impurities in the conductor metal that improve over use. Others who believe in burn in, dispute this and think it has to do with various other electrochemical reactions over time.

A lifetime of engineering experience in these guys has grown a wealth of scientific understanding, but also a sense of how much there is always more to understand. They measure and benchmark and produce data sheets, but they also listen.

They don't "deny the facts" and they don't deny their ears.

I'm encouraging us to do the same. For those that don't believe in burn in, my hope is that they can be humble about what they know, and don't know, about the science, and listen with an open mind. I think you would agree.
 
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Mar 14, 2020 at 5:14 AM Post #2,867 of 5,856
This is a PSA of sorts. It looks like we're looking at a new FW (1.20) maybe in April. Whenever that goes live, you will no longer be able to get a copy of 1.19. We may not be able to easily go back to previous FW versions, but we can keep our own personal libraries from this point on.

It's pretty easy to copy the current firmware to your computer. Just initiate the system update process and connect your unit via USB. It will download a file named "update.hex" into the root directory of the SP2K's internal storage. Don't go through with the actual update. Just copy that file onto your computer and cancel the update.

At least going forward you'll be able to go back to previous versions if you like it better than the current FW.
 
Mar 14, 2020 at 11:42 AM Post #2,868 of 5,856
I wish SP2K has a counter like the Sony to keep track of the hours the unit is running. It just helps to know how many hours has been on for many reasons like burn in.
 
Mar 14, 2020 at 2:33 PM Post #2,869 of 5,856
After 2 botched attempts Fedex finally got the delivery done...

My sp2000 comes with fw 1.16, but based on Jason's recommendation I just upgraded to the latest version...
 
Mar 15, 2020 at 6:44 AM Post #2,872 of 5,856
Behold!

Message_1584215579260.jpg
Message_1584215655053.jpg
Message_1584215777563.jpg
Message_1584217856186.jpg

The difference between 1.16 and 1.19 is day and night...
All I know is 1.19 and it sounds fine to me
 
Mar 15, 2020 at 6:45 AM Post #2,873 of 5,856
Behold!

Message_1584215579260.jpgMessage_1584215655053.jpgMessage_1584215777563.jpgMessage_1584217856186.jpg

All I know is 1.19 and it sounds fine to me
Thats all that matters plus no matter how good you going to be buying a new dap very soon.
 
Mar 15, 2020 at 6:57 AM Post #2,874 of 5,856
Mar 15, 2020 at 7:15 AM Post #2,875 of 5,856
Right, that gives a really helpful frame on what's generally going on during certain aspects of burn in, but what exactly accounts for this drift effect?

I'm sure you have "a few" ideas (grin)!

I think you may have misunderstood what I was getting at. I am referencing some of today's best audio engineers. They assume what you are describing. They're on "our side" (grin). They believe in burn in. What I wrote was that they don't claim to–"fully"–understand what goes on during burn in. There is debate among world class engineers as to what precisely is going on to cause parameters to drift, and why/how that can improve sound.

There is large scale agreement that caps and dielectrics need to form, but for e.g., some theorize about the directional alignment of impurities in the conductor metal that improve over use. Others who believe in burn in, dispute this and think it has to do with various other electrochemical reactions over time.

A lifetime of engineering experience in these guys has grown a wealth of scientific understanding, but also a sense of how much there is always more to understand. They measure and benchmark and produce data sheets, but they also listen.

They don't "deny the facts" and they don't deny their ears.

I'm encouraging us to do the same. For those that don't believe in burn in, my hope is that they can be humble about what they know, and don't know, about the science, and listen with an open mind. I think you would agree.

I think I can be humble and say in all my 30 years working in professional recording studios no manufacturer supplying the studio with electronic equipment ever advised “burn in time”. I humbly suggest that recording studios are a place where critical listening is the norm for their staff on a daily basis. Ijust don’t get how it could ever be a different case for hobbyists and miniaturised electronic equipment that sits in the palm of a hand.
 
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Mar 15, 2020 at 7:16 AM Post #2,876 of 5,856
I think I can be humble and say in all my 30 years working in professional recording studios no manufacturer supplying the studio with electronic equipment ever advised “burn in time”. I humbly suggest that recording studios are a place where critical listening is the norm for staff on a daily basis.
And so many albums comes out sounding so bad.
 
Mar 15, 2020 at 7:35 AM Post #2,878 of 5,856
Because the last 30 years we lived in iPod low-fi....now we are moving onto hi-res :beyersmile:

burn in makes no difference for 128kbps MP3

the market of vinyl and picky audiophiles has always been there though. It is just like you mentioned 90% may not care about burn-in 10% May care, and within this 10% there probably is another 2% that really care too much.... then usually an industry or any products, they are likely coming from these 2%

It is the same as geniuses, 99% of human population are the typical low-fi....and only 1% is hi-res....however the masses can only move on with the innovations from the 1%.

It only take 1 Einstein to get us here

Onto a side note....not all recording studios are equally good btw...there are also good and bad recording
 
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Mar 15, 2020 at 7:53 AM Post #2,880 of 5,856

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