Astell&Kern AK380
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Eroica4th
Banned: Multiple incomplete trades. Previously known as Exhuman93
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Why dont i see people complaing about tom fords suits or prada's bags or whatnot.... everyone has his limits .... they are targeting special customers ...
U r wrong... when a&k asks for a certain price others will not get affected...
Compare H&M.. zara and other brands that are meant for average income ppl, now compare that to high end brands LV TF, Chanel etc etc.... the very fact that ppl complain about ak prices and not those brsnds price is just strange.... i know this is waaaaay off topic but i cant help but to get involved ( hint: cars also count here Maybach is asking for too much but why dont we see ppl complaining for crying out loud!.........
If u dont have the money and u r too dreamy and willing to spend whatever u have just to get totl products i know ur feelings other than that it is irrational what u r doing in here.
Whateverrrrr
Thank you Bernie....i am listening it right now...only can say wooooooowwwwwCongrats, Dinis!
ChrisSC
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<deep breath>
One last time and then I swear I'm out.
My issue with A&K is that they are bringing other manufacturers to overbill their TOTL products. A&K gets away with it and everyone else follows.
This is bad for us.
Simple example: I want the new Effect Audio Arthur IEM. In an alternate world where A&K had never come along and jacked up their prices, I think it would've been marketed around $2,000 instead of $3,500. $3,500 has become the new norm and this is not good.
Nobody's complaining here about the price of Tom Ford suits or Maybachs or whatever off-topic luxury brand you brought up because this is an audio forum. To that point though, A&K isn't a luxury brand- it's ak70 is decidedly in the midfi market.
I can't understand what you were trying to communicate in your last sentence, but it seems like an unnecessary personal attack- also weird that you called me dreamy. While I am ruggedly handsome, maybe think a bit before you type?
This isn't getting anywhere and I don't want to clog the thread, so please don't respond to this.
xxx1313
500+ Head-Fier
I know that the AK380 amp improves the sound of any full-size headphone, even those easy to drive (such as Oppo PM-3 for example). But does it also improve the sound with your IEMs?
i only try with the ie800 so far , in single ended and low gain i am very pleased because the sound didn't loose is caracter, but in high gain wooooowwwwww ...i will try the balanced mode with my oriolus mk2 tomorrow
Jazzi
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IMHO, yes, definitely. I listen with EE Zeus XR and the amp provides a better depth and bass punch than without it. Again, IMHO.
Just realized how ****ty the balanced channel of my AK380Cu is comparing to the single ended. Hopefully, balanced will be better with AmpCu.
twelvebears
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So folks are noting their concerns regarding A&K's pricing, but are those concerns really justified?
I don't own an AK380 but just picked up a new (other than a torn cellophane wrapper) AK300 for £630, which is basically twice what I paid for my DX80. So given that the DX80 is a typically competitively priced product from iBasso, does this make the AK300 overpriced?
I would say absolutely not. It offers a level of build, fit and finish that totally justifies the price difference, not to mention the vastly more sophisticated UI and functionality, especially with AK Connect.
Yes the AK240, 320 and 380 cost vastly more, but each offer ever increasing levels of functionality and technical capabilities. Whether they justify the cost by being fully exploited is for the user to decide.
The R&D cost behind a product of the standard A&K is significant, and while they are big players in the DAP world, they are not shifting iPhone volumes of players and the costs have to be recovered.
In reality I think that the lower end A&K players AK JR, 70 and 300 are good value for the build and UI quality they offer compared to iBasso and Fiio, and that is partly possible because of the higher end 240, 320 and 380 for those prepared to pay the premium.
The one thing that A&K really do need to sort, and which is at odds with the premium brand and cost, is the crappy file transfer experience for Mac users. AFT is rubbish, and frankly A&K should offer a decently full featured application for both Mac and Windows users
I don't own an AK380 but just picked up a new (other than a torn cellophane wrapper) AK300 for £630, which is basically twice what I paid for my DX80. So given that the DX80 is a typically competitively priced product from iBasso, does this make the AK300 overpriced?
I would say absolutely not. It offers a level of build, fit and finish that totally justifies the price difference, not to mention the vastly more sophisticated UI and functionality, especially with AK Connect.
Yes the AK240, 320 and 380 cost vastly more, but each offer ever increasing levels of functionality and technical capabilities. Whether they justify the cost by being fully exploited is for the user to decide.
The R&D cost behind a product of the standard A&K is significant, and while they are big players in the DAP world, they are not shifting iPhone volumes of players and the costs have to be recovered.
In reality I think that the lower end A&K players AK JR, 70 and 300 are good value for the build and UI quality they offer compared to iBasso and Fiio, and that is partly possible because of the higher end 240, 320 and 380 for those prepared to pay the premium.
The one thing that A&K really do need to sort, and which is at odds with the premium brand and cost, is the crappy file transfer experience for Mac users. AFT is rubbish, and frankly A&K should offer a decently full featured application for both Mac and Windows users
jonstatt
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Really? There were issues early on with some firmware revisions for the balanced output. These are fixed now. There are two ways you get balanced out on the AK380...via the top headphone socket 2.5mm, and at the pin-out at the bottom which feeds the amp or cradle. With my IEMs that support balanced like the SE846 and oBravo EAMT-1C, I can hear a positive benefit with balanced. There is slightly greater detail, particularly at the mid-range, and improved soundstage. What issues are you having with your balanced output?
jonstatt
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Pricey or not AK are really pushing out some innovative stuff!
I have the AK recorder for my AK380 and recently tried an experiment of recording a record using it's innovative vinyl record ripping, cutting and labelling feature and then A/B switching between the record and the AK380. This is from my high-end system which consists of
Rega RP10 with Apheta 2 cartridge
Creek Wyndsor phono amp
Lexicon MC-12 in analog bypass
Bryston power amps
Kef Reference 4.2 speakers
AK380 using cradle and balanced output connections
I set the AK recorder to DSD 128 mode.
With a couple of friends over, I then proceeded (after level matching) to compare (blind to the friends) the record (Eagles Hotel California) with the AK380. They could not tell one from the other at all. I find this very interesting because the recording of course has gone through an ADC and DAC process albeit DSD 128, and it remains so transparent. Neither of these processes added colouration to the sound. This also goes to show that when I compared the Oppo 105D playing a CD vs the AK380 playing the same content, that the AK380 (which won my comparison) is the more "true", as tonally the AK380 sounded brighter against the Oppo.
In my own non-blind comparison I would give the record directly the edge but I am splitting hairs and probably convincing myself because of course I want the pure analogue path to be better, justifying the highly contentious opinion that pure analogue sounds better than digital.
I have the AK recorder for my AK380 and recently tried an experiment of recording a record using it's innovative vinyl record ripping, cutting and labelling feature and then A/B switching between the record and the AK380. This is from my high-end system which consists of
Rega RP10 with Apheta 2 cartridge
Creek Wyndsor phono amp
Lexicon MC-12 in analog bypass
Bryston power amps
Kef Reference 4.2 speakers
AK380 using cradle and balanced output connections
I set the AK recorder to DSD 128 mode.
With a couple of friends over, I then proceeded (after level matching) to compare (blind to the friends) the record (Eagles Hotel California) with the AK380. They could not tell one from the other at all. I find this very interesting because the recording of course has gone through an ADC and DAC process albeit DSD 128, and it remains so transparent. Neither of these processes added colouration to the sound. This also goes to show that when I compared the Oppo 105D playing a CD vs the AK380 playing the same content, that the AK380 (which won my comparison) is the more "true", as tonally the AK380 sounded brighter against the Oppo.
In my own non-blind comparison I would give the record directly the edge but I am splitting hairs and probably convincing myself because of course I want the pure analogue path to be better, justifying the highly contentious opinion that pure analogue sounds better than digital.
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@Jonstatt, thanks for the impression and sharing. That is really nice to know and is consistent with my experience. The other thread is full of people who do not have the ownership experience of either any AK product or the 380 in specific and just jump on AK for the sake of bashing and make some cheap shots because it is easy target. The rule on Headfi has always been if you do not own the product, you really cannot comment on its worth. It got so negative to the 380 users that I have to call folks out. To me, in the dap market, the 380 especially the 380cu is really at the top in terms of sound and UI and design. Yes they have their shortcomings and I have pointed them out on this thread and you guys knew that. I am not a fanboy and try to be straight and call it as it is. To place the 380cu in its place, I have the Sony Wm1Z and have been burning it in for almost 180 hours now. Even though I can not as yet give the final words on it as I don't feel like I own the Sony sound yet, but this much I can say I am not selling my 380cu nor can I say the 1Z beat the 380cu hands down. It will take some detail or critical listening to point out the differences.
Rei87
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I agree that the CU is an extremely overpriced product. Heck,I see little purpose in even paying more than a hundred for a player when modern phones do a reasonably good job as a dap, and I can enjoy music from a sub 100 off the shelf iem too.
The issue however, is that I 'want' something that sounds better. I understand that to some, the idea of 6k for a device that does nothing but plays music sounds ludicrous, and I fully agree. However, one must also consider that while 6k is an absolute value, its relative value differs from people to people. Some of us are fortunate enough to have a career that allows us to comfortably accept 6k within our finances, and that changes our perspective of the player.
So, while I do agree that thr CU should cost less, I am still none the less able to and willing to fork out said sum for it. But to diss owners of it as being gullible sheeps is a little harsh. Heck, to some people here, 6k can even be seen as pittance. In short, elitist as it sounds, this escalation of prices matters way less than you might imagine to some. AK isn't here to provide customers with good audio; they are here to profit from customers through selling good audio products. If customers are willing to pay an arm and a leg for it, and that model nets them the best profits, then that is what they will take.
If you can't afford what you want because it is 'artificially' overpriced beyond your limits, then, too bad. That is the way the world sound. I want a exotic car too, but I can't afford it. Life is just such.
P.S. Anyway, judging from recent trends we can all expect that the next AK flagship will probably make the CU and SS look cheap in comparison lol.
P.S. I'm not rolling in the notes either. I had to spend a couple of weeks thinking through my decision of putting the buck down for the CU. its just that, I find alot of these 'overpriced' argument, to be very myopic at best, or salt at worst.
The issue however, is that I 'want' something that sounds better. I understand that to some, the idea of 6k for a device that does nothing but plays music sounds ludicrous, and I fully agree. However, one must also consider that while 6k is an absolute value, its relative value differs from people to people. Some of us are fortunate enough to have a career that allows us to comfortably accept 6k within our finances, and that changes our perspective of the player.
So, while I do agree that thr CU should cost less, I am still none the less able to and willing to fork out said sum for it. But to diss owners of it as being gullible sheeps is a little harsh. Heck, to some people here, 6k can even be seen as pittance. In short, elitist as it sounds, this escalation of prices matters way less than you might imagine to some. AK isn't here to provide customers with good audio; they are here to profit from customers through selling good audio products. If customers are willing to pay an arm and a leg for it, and that model nets them the best profits, then that is what they will take.
If you can't afford what you want because it is 'artificially' overpriced beyond your limits, then, too bad. That is the way the world sound. I want a exotic car too, but I can't afford it. Life is just such.
P.S. Anyway, judging from recent trends we can all expect that the next AK flagship will probably make the CU and SS look cheap in comparison lol.
P.S. I'm not rolling in the notes either. I had to spend a couple of weeks thinking through my decision of putting the buck down for the CU. its just that, I find alot of these 'overpriced' argument, to be very myopic at best, or salt at worst.
Mm...very interested in difference in performance of ak380 cu vs. wm1z. There's no demo unit here for the top Sony dap to compare with my cu.
The cu has important advantages though: line-out, tidal, more common 2.5 mm balanced, optical out and an add-on amp.
It will take a whole lot of superior performance over the 380 cu (and the upcoming successor totl) to convince me to get the Sony but we'll see....
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