[whitedragem]

It's common to hear about worse pc ports no matter what spec now a days. Console versions has been much more reliable these days. You hear about stutters on pc a lot. When Elden Ring came out, the most stable version was PS5. PC players would complain about stutters. Facts are facts.

the big issue is people who feel that just because one game runs well, ie a competitive shooter designed to have everyone play it (all hardware) and hit super high framerate ISN'T the same as story games (designed for graphical fidelity) that many other games aim for (pun incidental)

some games put much more burden on streaming assets, and many open world games even demand RAM bandwidth and faster storage.
8GB VRAM won't cut it against modern consoles.. and worse, Microsoft consoles typically use more VRAM than standard PC graphics cards. (can bottleneck and smash framerate performance when you run out of VRAM)

my nephew, whom I put together a nice wee x99 build a few years ago games at super high refresh rates and wanted an Nvidia card (his friends dads' seem to all have gtx3060s, but this was beyond his price point).
I nabbed him a 6700xt (with 12GB of VRAM) fully believing it would be overkill for 'low resolutuon gaming', and then a half year later, turns out it was 'the right move'. (he paid a lot less than a 3060 and typically gets 3070+ performance)
now obviously head-fi is a cashed up community- I have said this if this thread previously, we are not representative of 'the norm' here...
13 year old kids cannot really afford 600$ graphics cards... so 'last years model/clearance pricepoints' is a thing and naturally those parts will have, likely, reasons for being retired (eg 'low VRAM').

now, his VR rig has legs, and will do him for awhile... but, he also has discipline to not just set everything to Ultra (I had him gaming in cyberpunk on his old rx570, a stop gap at system build time until he could spend equal money to his whole PC (x99 6c12t @4.5ghz, 32 GB quad channel RAM, nvme and SSD and 120hz screen etc..$600) just on a graphics chip.
of course his rig does everything needed...

but,..

many 'children' (or perhaps those new to the hobby) do not understand cycles.
last gen consoles didnt push any tech and so bringing their games to PC was easy..

now?
not at all.
as the Playstation 5 gets second gen games, PC gamers are either going to have to drop resolution (from 4K, down to 1440 or 1080), or give up Ultra (everything) settings...
the other option is devs simply curtail Ultra settings and not get backlash (this is the easy route and doesnt generate widespread negative press). (at which point PC games dont look significantly better)

or buy an upgraded GPU, again more costly than the entire console package (that comes with bluetooth receiver/controller/operating system etc - things often not factored into system build prices).

some of us work, and many understand that 'time is money' and PC downtime- troubleshooting and 'random other stuff' will often eat into play time.

I fully understand Personal Computers are a hobby.
great to learn a toolset (eg troubleshooting and research to solve issues etc)

but gaming isnt about money,.. shouldnt have to require huge time investments, and should be quick to get into.

console games can support keyboard and mouse (per title dependant or things like hori keyb+mouse setup), but provide a unified platform where you dont have to wonder if 'the other guy' had his foliage set to basic and could see you through the bush you thought you were hiding behind....

for the lack of cheating alone that mostly escapes the console multiplayer gaming space, that network cost per annum (that comes with about 40 games a year on the playstation 5) isnt such a bad taste..

I know we will see a lot more issues ahead now present gen gaming consoles equate well to a mid tier gaming PC (xbox series s sets a very low bar for 'everything needs be compatible with this').. so any given title might run 'really well' when brought to PC, or be hugely troublesome (if only for some), but many devs are starting to realise "vs Playstation 5" 'potential sales' and hardware capability, supporting PC users is hardly worth the development time heartache.. (and is why Ultra settings are sometimes simply depricated to stop the news headlines).

of course it doesnt help when highly optimised PS5 hardware can near match an Nvidia 3090 in some new VR titles (rendering high refresh rate to 2x monitors can push GPUs) like Pavlov, and devs make headlines like PS5 GPU outperforms a 3090 by 10%.
the xbox series x is at nowhere near parity to the Playstation 5 when it comes to advantages that will be netted from hardware customisation.

now, in the case of Pavlov VR - I'd like to think that is a misrepresentation (maybe its a foveated rendering trick that benched an equal/+10% to PC test run?)
-and GT7 was built from ground up for VR (levels are basic in the same way that Forza7 was 4k60 on an xbox)..
the thing is, when a dev CAN build a game level fully knowing hardware capabilities they can do some gnarly 'suspension of disbelief' stuff and make paultry capability parts (eg xbox) look impressive.

Pavlovs headlines (ps5 beating gtx3090) was impressive to me, GT7 running unlocked up to 240hz 'not so much' (both demand a little further reading I feel)


having to brute force unoptimised for the PC platform products requires owning overkill hardware.
its hard to 'overkill a PS5'.
most would rather own a nice car, or a 'car and a Playstation5' vs a PC that runs PS5 titles at native 4K vs 'dynamic resolution and 'less accurate shadows'.

I run Fortnight (first time recently due to UE5 engine upgrade(just to see UE5 in action)) and on PC I get better reflections and 16x the math for the Raytracing calculations (vs the console Raytracing)..
I wont argue FOR the console version (ie haptics and resistive triggers etc), and I am a 'high refresh rate gamer' (for decades, 'so what'?!)..

but nothing is going to change facts based on the way money flows..
Playstation 5 is the platform most will target first (if they want the $),.. and sadly, I saw a lot of super high end PC gamers slash and burn their simulator rigs and high end setups after PSVR2 came out cause GT7 'just works' (easily, consistently, and 'equally for all competitors')

I understand how cool bragging rights can be (actually I simply prefer USING said 'overkill' PC hardware),.. but for the vast majority of world, and not representative of 'head-fi' forum goers, most would rather a simpler more cost (/time) effective platform. (especially when that is where majority 'plays')

I do believe a combo PS5 and PC will have all bases covered (those xbox exclusives are generally PC as well, Ark2 not included, apparently)

If Hogwarts Legacy is anything to go by (and a few other titles, recently) a working console version is all anyone really cares about.
stories are stories at 30 or 60 frames per second...
but having PC Ultra settings crippled badly cause people who dont spend 2000$ on a GPU feel entitled to whinge when Ultra runs at lower res or less frame rate:
either
PC version stop pushing better more advanced graphical fidelity
or worse
dont get much focus at all.

we havent hit second gen software on new consoles yet, so most of this is 'theorhetical', but certainly writing is on the wall for PC as a value proposition (beyond learning a skillset/'hobby'), and the super high cost of adoption (eg PCVR vs PSVR) will not be a thing 'for the masses'.

most of this wouldnt be an issue, except, "Xbox" -Microsft has to recoup 100billion dollars, and that cannot happen on PC so, 'rocky road ahead for PC users as a way to get some of them onto consoles' (some will buy xboxs).

Observation, not "selling this", I don't WANT any of this to play out and would have been happy simply running a PC for all my gaming wants/'needs'.
As a PC gamer since my 'turbo mode' 8086 (yes, pre 80286/386/486/'pentium') which ran at 9mhz, having cut teeth on the first Mac and 'other early PC hardware',.. the present PC gaming space is vastly too high cost vs the return.
if the market wasnt filled with consumerism bs (and if we used low level 'to the metal APIs well optimised for that realised our hardwares potential) then I might feel differently.

watching the two-three market leaders in the PC space (many users buying from all three companies to build their PC) force hardware updates, we have a 'very elite few' who simply pay the money.
hence the problem gets worse.

it is hard to feel positive to PC gaming when it mostly exists to steal (your) time and money.
for brute forcing Ultra/benchmark bragging rights and (anti) competitive shooters (be faster than the next guy?) PCs are a great project.
just dont hope they are in any way reliable (like any other time previously), MS (and Nvidia/Intel etc) want your repeat business.

 

[whitedragem]

It's common to hear about worse pc ports no matter what spec now a days. Console versions has been much more reliable these days. You hear about stutters on pc a lot. When Elden Ring came out, the most stable version was PS5. PC players would complain about stutters. Facts are facts.

nice headlines.

sure, some outliers (eg hardware unboxed looked at Last of Us; it was hugely problematic on 8GB VRAM when trying to run everything Ultra)(otherwise, 'not so bad')

Elden Ring was a sad situation.. (friends with 3k$ PCs who loved the 'series' but went PS5 for the better experience at launch)

I'd like to think in many cases it is simply typical PC gamers are sensitive to refresh rate (due to experience and 'eye training') vs most console users,..
but yeah, first time in many many years that PCs are up against 'nice hardware',.. it is going to change some perceptions.

in a years time when second wave (somewhat optimised) titles hit Playstation 5, then the PC market will have more users on cards significantly better (in a brute force it kind of way)..
a pc is a lot more than just a GPU, and Playstation 5 buses do things that no standard PC (yet) does..
when written for, will lead to more PC gamers at 1080-1440 and 'high' settings to compare (or have alighly higher framerate).
framepacing on the other hand- no contest- when either platform is pushing its limits, only the console has hardware consistancy developers can tweak for...
high pricepoint overkill rig users will seldom experience issues, but they are not 1% market share of the smallest gaming market... (nobody cares)

 

[Whitigir]

Oh well, when you can afford both, there is no need to debate which is better than which.

Just so you know, the price of a 4090 is 4X the PS5 bundles. Hence IMO, desktop is very expensive to game right on it. It is worth every pennies thought. So, whoever can afford such PC system, will have Zero problem whatsoever in obtaining a PS5.

Now, on the other hand, which do they prefer most ? It depends. I don’t care about cheaters, because IMO, cheating just to win ? They have already lost it even before it begun. I play game to just enjoy the games and that is that. Each system has it pros and cons. Also, I don’t know who cares about benchmarks and showing off their stuff, I know I don’t, I will be happy as long as I can tune/tweak/over clock my PC to the limits and with different tiers of it prowess.

IMO, I would think a high end desktop can be very handy at many many tasks. So my answer to the thread topic is that I am a PC gamer rather than console and a high end PC can easily last 8 years before upgrades.

 

[whirlwind]

New one coming out isn’t it ? And wait til you can do 200+ FPS with 240Hz refresh monitor

This was the biggest upgrade for me personally.

You think 60 FPS is pretty smooth until you get a 240Hz monitor

 

[hifi nub]

thats one sick build

 

[SilverEars]

 

[Grimros]

I am sadly a PC gamer running with a RTX 3090.
With the newer AAA titles being horrendeous on release lately (Performance-wise).

Aside from most games being released are actually unfinished and full of bugs. The performance on consoles is atleast a whole tad better than on pc. Almost makes me want to switch to console gaming if I didn't have some older games that I play together with friends on pc.

 

[SilverEars]

 

[Hyperfluxe]

PC first and foremost, but I also have a PS5/XSX/Switch for exclusives even though they're sparse and some of them can be run better on PC like the new Zelda and Metroid Prime Remaster @4k60. There's a lot of doom and gloom going on with PC gaming and the state of the industry lately - it's reasonable because ports are indeed getting worse and the hardware required poses a barrier to entry for most in terms of cost. That being said, it's not dissimilar to this hobby (audiophile/gear) and there's very easy fixes with mods or using the proper hardware/settings for optimization. For example, I've had no issue running RE4/Dead Space/TLOU/Hogwarts/Jedi with max settings @4k138hz in HDR with RT on with my OLED panel. There's so many easy quality of life fixes that console players don't get. The issue is the cost of GPU's - I have no problem spending $3k on a yearly GPU upgrade and selling my previous one but most can't, it's a poor FPS/dollar in terms of ROI right now because Nvidia GPU's command a certain demand in deep learning/AI/ML fields - more so than gamers now. The CEO had a talk a few weeks ago at that event saying as much. Anyway just random thoughts on my end, here's my build if anyone's curious (I've upgraded the cooling substantially since): https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/b/LYLPxr

 

[Rodmunch]

I'm mostly a PC gamer these days but only racing sims. I just bought a new desktop for the racing sims (Lenovo Legion Tower 7i), it was the most expensive PC I've ever bought but figured I would get some future proofing out of it. I was introduced to FPS games on PC in college but hardly play those anymore. I also play some PS4 but I find I'm only playing reboots of older games on it, mostly Neo-Geo re-releases. I tend to prefer the 16 bit era of games I guess.

 

[Sanaycasino]

To be PC gamer in 2023 is much more expensive than before
So, i am become the console gamer

 

[TrollDragon]

I used to be strictly a PC gamer way back in the day. When Fallout 4 came out I pondered upgrading my then ancient PC with $1500+ worth of parts so I could play it or just picking up a PS4 and start playing that weekend. So I grabbed the PS4 and evolved from a PC to console gamer.

I have since moved onto the PS5 and I also own a Switch for mobile gaming. Despite the hardware limitations my Switch gets serious ton of gaming time and was a worthwhile investment IMHO.

A few years ago I picked up a MSI prebuilt desktop (I5-9400F/GTX1660) and that suits me just fine. Its far from cutting edge but it plays the handful of PC games that I own quite nicely. I pondered the option of building a PC when I picked up the MSI, but having to chase parts down across multiple online retailers was something I didn't really want to deal with. I'm retired so the amount of disposable income is limited, I was never a look at what I have type of person and being in the top benchmark percentile never interested me. It's all about having a good time playing and not having to worry about tuning, tweaking and constant upgrading.

We moved 6 months ago and I finally got around to unpacking my PC. I wanted to install F.I.S.T Forged in Shadow Torch on it, after a hour worth of upgrading Windows 11 and the various drivers (since the PC was disconnected for so long) I was finally able to jump in and play.

 

[SilverEars]

I used to be strictly a PC gamer way back in the day. When Fallout 4 came out I pondered upgrading my then ancient PC with $1500+ worth of parts so I could play it or just picking up a PS4 and start playing that weekend. So I grabbed the PS4 and evolved from a PC to console gamer.

I have since moved onto the PS5 and I also own a Switch for mobile gaming. Despite the hardware limitations my Switch gets serious ton of gaming time and was a worthwhile investment IMHO.

A few years ago I picked up a MSI prebuilt desktop (I5-9400F/GTX1660) and that suits me just fine. Its far from cutting edge but it plays the handful of PC games that I own quite nicely. I pondered the option of building a PC when I picked up the MSI, but having to chase parts down across multiple online retailers was something I didn't really want to deal with. I'm retired so the amount of disposable income is limited, I was never a look at what I have type of person and being in the top benchmark percentile never interested me. It's all about having a good time playing and not having to worry about tuning, tweaking and constant upgrading.

We moved 6 months ago and I finally got around to unpacking my PC. I wanted to install F.I.S.T Forged in Shadow Torch on it, after a hour worth of upgrading Windows 11 and the various drivers (since the PC was disconnected for so long) I was finally able to jump in and play.

We are so alike. My last PC was an MSI, and my new one as well since my first MSI was so reliable. I use my PS5 for games that are more stable on release or exclusives. I don't build PC either because the chances of issues from custom build. I've had bad luck with custom build pcs, and the stress I had to endure in order to debug them is not worth it.

Anyway, the issues with the PC ports is the launch condition. Eventually, they will patch it up in due time. For example, The Last of Us Part I is running much better now than at launch. Took some time to get to this point. Shader cache only takes 10min for me now. Another issues of PCs is the graphics cards drama. I should have just stuck with my 1080 gtx. The cards are just gigantic and overpriced for not that much of a performance boost these days.

And like you say, the benefits to consoles are just pick and play. You save time. Not much messing with settings. It's convenient, and games are optimized better to the hardware at launch.

 

[SilverEars]

My gaming desktop PC uses whopping 500watts peak when playing Last of Us Part I, and look at the Xbox series X.


Jesus, my PC on idle eats more power than PS5 running COD warzone.

 

[Shawnb]

PC gamer. Only bought a console for sports games since EA and 2k give us inferior products.

My current rig

https://imgur.com/a/TjQcfWY