Android resampling
Oct 25, 2019 at 8:45 AM Post #46 of 124
You, and others, took the time to share your knowledge and help the OP to understand his resampling query. Amazingly, rather than understanding what you wrote, he replied rudely and yet still expects you to make further efforts to educate him. What a dude.

First day on the internet? :beyersmile:

Of course, everything in your post is accurate and reasonable, but who didn't see this coming? Gregorio could have posted Meyer & Moran and I doubt it would have been read, let alone understood.
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 11:54 AM Post #47 of 124
Posting the link to it appears to have made him go away. I think there are people that actually think that because they don't know much about something, the rest of the world must not know either.
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 12:48 PM Post #49 of 124
He’s got a direct link to the study he wants, and all it costs home to learn is $33. If it isn’t worth that to him to know what he’s talking about, then I guess he’s gotten all of his other ideas from spurious sources for free too. Even the Wikipedia article on bit depth would be enough to point him to the truth and he hasn’t bothered to look at that. Whatever....
This paper is too old
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 12:59 PM Post #51 of 124
And most of you guys just say bull without any supporting proves answer my question why does 25years old resampler had losses but now doesn't


The answers were provided. Your lack of understanding or willingness to pay for the research paper you requested doesn’t invalidate them. It doesn’t appear that you’re willing to make much effort, as much of that study would be easily available via a Google search.

How can you state that Meyer and Moran is too old when you haven’t read it? Not very impressed with your approach here,
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 2:00 PM Post #52 of 124
Well I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you weren’t a troll, just a non native English speaker. I’ll admit my error there. Your trolling skills are as good as your spelling.

The paper is too old followed by a “proof” based on 25 year old consumer equipment... You aren’t serious at all.
 
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Oct 25, 2019 at 2:28 PM Post #53 of 124
Gregorio could have posted Meyer & Moran and I doubt it would have been read, let alone understood.

I did, back in post #31, which he completely ignored and just carried on with the same nonsense!

And most of you guys just say bull without any supporting proves answer my question why does 25years old resampler had losses but now doesn't

Same hypocritical nonsense which just proves the indication you’ve given previously. That you can’t read what has been written and that you’re either trolling, unbelievably ignorant or both.

Supporting evidence HAS been supplied for the answers you requested. You however, have supplied NO supporting evidence for your FALSE claims. Therefore YOU are the one “saying bull” and being a hypocrite, AGAIN!

G
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 3:14 PM Post #54 of 124
Well I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you weren’t a troll, just a non native English speaker. I’ll admit my error there. Your trolling skills are as good as your spelling.

The paper is too old followed by a “proof” based on 25 year old consumer equipment... You aren’t serious at all.
The paper that you gave to me was about blind testing 16/44.1 and upper and now I'm asking about 25years old resampler. Now a day we use digital resampling and in digital resampling if you resample in to different factors it losses part of kbps and someone said in 2019 there is no problem about resampling in to different factors and no losses on kbps and i want sources for that i don't care how you guys criticize me because i know there is many non educated people's and i understand that so now i want sources about resampling has NO LOSSES
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 3:30 PM Post #55 of 124
The paper that you gave to me was about blind testing 16/44.1 and upper and now I'm asking about 25years old resampler. Now a day we use digital resampling and in digital resampling if you resample in to different factors it losses part of kbps and someone said in 2019 there is no problem about resampling in to different factors and no losses on kbps and i want sources for that i don't care how you guys criticize me because i know there is many non educated people's and i understand that so now i want sources about resampling has NO LOSSES

https://lmgtfy.com/?q=lossless+audio+resampling+for+dummies&s=g
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 3:49 PM Post #56 of 124

Again, he doesn’t even need to search Google, I already gave sources which answers his questions in post #31.

[1] The paper that you gave to me was about blind testing 16/44.1 and upper and now I'm asking about 25years old resampler.
[2] Now a day we use digital resampling and in digital resampling if you resample in to different factors it losses part of kbps and someone said in 2019 there is no problem about resampling in to different factors and no losses on kbps and i want sources for that
[3] i don't care how you guys criticize me because i know there is many non educated people's and i understand that ...

1. That paper is reliable evidence that high resolution audio resampled to 44/16 is inaudible. This is contrary to YOUR claim, YOU MUST NOW provide reliable evidence to support your claim!!!

2. Already asked and answered, WITH SOURCES!!!

3. Yes, there are many uneducated people and you’ve PERFECTLY demonstrated that you’re one of them! And if that’s not bad enough, you ARE TROLLING, repeatedly asking for sources which have ALREADY been given to you and just making up more nonsense!

ENOUGH NOW or you will be reported for your trolling!

G
 
Oct 25, 2019 at 7:57 PM Post #57 of 124
The paper that you gave to me was about blind testing 16/44.1 and upper and now I'm asking about 25years old resampler. Now a day we use digital resampling and in digital resampling if you resample in to different factors it losses part of kbps and someone said in 2019 there is no problem about resampling in to different factors and no losses on kbps and i want sources for that i don't care how you guys criticize me because i know there is many non educated people's and i understand that so now i want sources about resampling has NO LOSSES
there is never no losses. playing the original file at the original sample and bit depth will not be perfect. because nothing is. at least in the analog domain. even between 2 so called bit perfect streams, you can usually measure differences at the lowest level. not that it's very relevant when noises and distortions will surely swamp the all thing with much bigger differences(which is why we so easily disregard small errors). the idea of perfection in music playback is a fantasy. which is why people usually prefer to care about what's audible or not. which is something we demonstrate with listening tests.

now resampling can turn out to make some audible difference on some gears, because the resampling solution really sucks, or because maybe the extra high frequency content destabilized the playback rig a little. or maybe because the DAC's filter for 44kHz is rolling off the trebles a lot more than at other freqs. none of the effective cases really have anything to do with your idea that we're causing errors or loss in the redrawing of the analog sine waves. because those errors simply are so tiny in the first place that you shouldn't expect them to be audible.
in real life, anything is possible, but possible exceptions shouldn't be taken as the norm. as gregorio told you, the album you're playing has content that was most likely resampled several times(because many audio plugins work best at a specific sample rate, so they convert the signal to that rate before doing what they do. what you can deduce from that very common plugin behavior(and we're talking pro stuff used in studios), is that the guys making them considered that the resulting sound with resampling is going to be better than without. that should give you some idea about how destructive they consider resampling to be.
now that example is usually about taking a sample rate and increasing it. so we don't discard any information. taking a high sample rate file and reducing it to 44 or 48kHz means objectively discarding information and that is a fact. mainly we can treat that as discarding the frequencies at sample/2 and above. which begs the question, are you going to miss ultrasounds? most controlled listening tests suggest that you won't. but of course the best answer relies on taking your own gear, your own ears, and test it out under controlled conditions. then you have a reliable answer about your circumstances(which is probably all you really care about, and you wouldn't be wrong^_^).
your last question about something at 44kHz being turned into 48kHz, as pretty much any increase in sample rate it is probably not something to be concerned about. by going to 48kHz you now have a little extra room for the final low pass filter in the DAC, so even if it's some extremely cheap extremely badly implemented solution, by pushing it a little farther in the ultrasounds we reduce even more the chances to get some audible impact. so I'd argue that overall, it could be seen as an improvement because what you may lose, is outweighed by what you might gain(which is really the entire reasoning behind all resampling).
as for something at 48kHz being converted to 44 by a cellphone, again, the 2 concerns are:
the ultrasound range you discard. will you miss it? will you hear it? probably not.
and also the DAC's filter if it's one that is known to be audibly different at 44kHz(relatively rare nowadays, but could still happen).

now about resampling in general, any DAC worth something will apply massive oversampling to the signal before going to analog(for various good reasons). it has become very hard to act paranoid about resampling because of it, as it now kinds of equals being against digital audio. we still find that "a small village of indomitable Gauls still holds out against the invaders" in audio forums and keep purchasing NOS DACs(mainly for the wrong reasons). but the rest of the world has moved on about this matter.

as I was saying before, this in no way means that you shouldn't go for hires files and playback that respects the file's sample rate if that's what you want to have. objectively it's not a mistake, and some DACs will measure better when fed with a hires file(or a normal 16/44 converted to 24/96 before being sent to the DAC. my old ODAC is like that. I can't tell the difference by ear, but I can measure it. what to do of such an information is the user's prerogative. I'm surprisingly not interested in measured fidelity and always pick what's more practical over what measures best. but that's me. someone else may have other priorities. but you have to keep in mind how that desire for fidelity, and the notion of audible consequences, might not agree all the time(or if your gears do a proper job, ever).
 
Oct 26, 2019 at 3:09 AM Post #58 of 124
What a colossal waste of time this is. This forum is getting overrun with this kind of excelsior. One person can grind a thread to a halt. Put four or five of them in a forum and the whole thing stops dead.
 
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Dec 9, 2019 at 1:03 AM Post #59 of 124
don't worry. you're a cool cat.

It's ironic that sound science would be the place where people go to get the most basic of basic information. I guess it shows how devoid of information the rest of Head Fi is.

After reading a few of the threads on this forum, I have a better sense of the lack of information/knowledge exhibited in some parts of Head-fi. I always had a sense that there was a lot of BS going on, simply from my own experience with audio gear rather than from any knowledge I had. However, the level and amount of BS is increasingly becoming apparent. It is quite astonishing.

Would I be right to conclude from what has been said in this thread, that from the perspective of what is audible, Andriod resampling is a non-issue, i.e, in the normal course of events, the effects of Andriod resampling cannot be heard by the listener?
 
Dec 9, 2019 at 3:43 AM Post #60 of 124
If there is an audible difference, the problem probably isn’t resampling. It’s probably something more serious.
 

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