[surfgeorge]

You hit the good enough wall quick with DACs, it’s relatively cheap now days to build a good one. The main limitation is actually our hearing. So once you have something your happy with I would argue headphones are where the money should be spent hardware wise as long as the amp is properly powering them.

I don't know where the "good enough" price level is for you, since "cheap" has a very different meaning for different people.
When I built my stereo system the rule of thumb in high end was to split the budget to 1/3 source, 1/3 amplification and 1/3 speakers.

For me personally, the $500 Mojo is a good investment for any speaker or IEM from $250 to $1000 and even above.
So if $500 is in the cheap territory I fully agree. I had cheaper DACs but did not find them anywhere close to the Mojo, or even a very good investement.
Even my $1200 Sony ZX2 DAP is arguably not better, it's different and I prefer the Mojo.

Bottomline is that the DAC plays a big role in musical enjoyment IMO, and you are absolutely right - amazing performance can be had for relatively little money today.
Cheers!

 

[castleofargh]

I don't know where the "good enough" price level is for you, since "cheap" has a very different meaning for different people.
When I built my stereo system the rule of thumb in high end was to split the budget to 1/3 source, 1/3 amplification and 1/3 speakers.

For me personally, the $500 Mojo is a good investment for any speaker or IEM from $250 to $1000 and even above.
So if $500 is in the cheap territory I fully agree. I had cheaper DACs but did not find them anywhere close to the Mojo, or even a very good investement.
Even my $1200 Sony ZX2 DAP is arguably not better, it's different and I prefer the Mojo.

Bottomline is that the DAC plays a big role in musical enjoyment IMO, and you are absolutely right - amazing performance can be had for relatively little money today.
Cheers!

your examples are a DAC+amp combo and a DAP. so already the goalpost is moved and you're probably not talking about just the DAC section and how it sounds. even with your 3 evenly cut parts' budget, those devices would have to count as 2/3 of it ^_^.
but I also happen not to share that 1/3 approach. not judging, you do what you want with your money and your stuff. I just never considered something like that TBH. I guess I tend to have spent most audio money on music(although it's hard to estimate how much that can possibly be over time??? IDK), second in expense ranking would be transducers. because I believe that's where most of the sound is altered, or simply because I bought many just to find the few I really enjoyed using(there's a clear cost to that, sadly). and whatever remains went to amplification for those loads, DACs or some DAPs if on the go. then at the bottom I suspect that IEM tips and headphone pads might have passed cables at some point. but I'm not totally sure as I did spend a lot on "audiophile cables" when I didn't know any better. so maybe I do work with a split budget where a good third would be labelled "mistakes".

 

[boomhaur]

To vaguely reply, I intentionally left what I consider cheap out as people can argue that all day. So I left that out to let you decide on your own.

Basic point was that once you hit a certain point which can be relatively quick for DAC's you can be paying for performance you most likely can't even hear unless you have super hearing. And if there is a performance increase you can detect you may have just paid significantly for a small improvement. Than there is the placebo effect, we hear improvements because we want to. I see that with a lot of hobbies and not just this, its just that audio is a lot more subjective.

It's why I would argue that after you have a good enough DAC and an AMP that can properly power what you are using headphones are the best place to put your money.