[up late]

I agree. I think Tyll sometimes uses objective measurements to give more weight to his subjective taste. You need to take what he says with a grain of salt. For example, he can praise a headphone that gives unnatural soundstage, inaccurate punch in the bass and uneven frequency response. See his love for the Audeze sound signature or Sennheiser veil. In the case of Audeze LCD2/3 you can subjectively describe the sound as glorious, soundstage as intimate and more personal, say that the treble is warm and the overall sound is yummy and say the bass hits tight and visceral, which is all true and characteristic of some planar magnetic headphones. But you can take all those qualities and say that they are objectively bad in terms of realistic presentation of the music.

there's a distinct difference between misusing objective measurements in order to validate subjective impressions and describing correlations between objective measurements and subjective impressions. i think that tyll hertsen does the latter. tyll found the audeze lcd-4's treble problematic btw and i don't recall him ever describing the "sennheiser veil" in positive terms. you can "take what he says with a grain of salt" but try to refrain from misrepresenting him as well.

this is one of two headphone threads that i'm familiar with where a critical review from tyll hangs over it like a spectre. i find it puzzling that folks continue to dwell on it when they obviously disagree with his assessment. the review is almost four years old now and there are other positive reviews of the k812 out there. just move on and enjoy your k812.

 

[486892]

...got the k812 for half an hour now.
First of all, musically.
The treble or upper mids a kind too soft for me, but maybe should get better after a while running.
Body is full and realistic.
The interaction of the instruments, vocals etc. is very good (musically).
Stage ok.
Timbre: i think realistic.
The Neutrality (and i love neutrality) is very good. perfect for me for listening and mastering .)

Later some more thoughts

You also have to feed them a lot of music to loose their nerve, which is a quite tight from the beginning, but will get better after few 100’s of hours + with the proper DAC they are just something you wont find anywhere else, unique. No need any of EQ.

Then the supreme detailed ultra stereo sound will be too attractive to hear, if you know what i mean.. do not eat too much candy, though, like those few in opposite. I know the sound they are after and it is way too simple comparing to K812, in which true sound fidelity lovers will prefer for that reason; the artistic side of sound.

 

[K 240 DF]

hm...some hours later:

good cans, optimal in Bass and interaction, musicality is also very good. Best of AKG, i would say.
But i miss some open mids or treble. Is this normal to this cans?
I cant stand this missing treble..
K 812 is not so dark as the K712, but...

There is no music or tracks which are not good with this cans...good or not good? I am not used that every track is sounding very good. Maybe my ears are not used to listen relaxed

 

[mmwwmm]

hm...some hours later:

good cans, optimal in Bass and interaction, musicality is also very good. Best of AKG, i would say.
But i miss some open mids or treble. Is this normal to this cans?
I cant stand this missing treble..
K 812 is not so dark as the K712, but...

“Missing treble”? “Not so dark as the K712 but...”?
I am a bit puzzled with your impressions. My K812 is worlds away from the K712 in clarity, transparency and treble extension. I never think of the K812 as dark or missing the slightest treble although I feel the 812 has a bit of overall warmth in its sound compared to other very neutral cans. Do you feel the K812 darker or equally dark and or with equal or less treble extension than the K702?
If so I think there is some problem over there...

 

[K 240 DF]

“Missing treble”? “Not so dark as the K712 but...”?
I am a bit puzzled with your impressions. My K812 is worlds away from the K712 in clarity, transparency and treble extension. I never think of the K812 as dark or missing the slightest treble although I feel the 812 has a bit of overall warmth in its sound compared to other very neutral cans. Do you feel the K812 darker or equally dark and or with equal or less treble extension than the K702?
If so I think there is some problem over there...

..ah, thx for reply.

The K812 is not so dark as the K712, but much darker than K702.
K 702 is for me in some special areas very like lupe glasses, but missing bass and overall musicality.

Please don't miss understand my listen experience - the K812 is for me after some minutes definitely reference!
But my ears are very special - maybe broken - and i love the very open from the K702.
In Sound signature the 812 is more open than the 712, but not so open than the 702.

The potential of the k812 is really big and i think i will not give it back..

 

[mmwwmm]

The K812 is not so dark as the K712, but much darker than K702.


In Sound signature the 812 is more open than the 712, but not so open than the 702.

Definitivetely something weird is happening here. I owned at the same time (I compared both A/B) and to my ears and with my own gear (listen to them extensively with my Chord mojo and Chord Hugo 2 and tried both ocasionally with some borrowed Burson Soloist SL and Marantz HD1 units too) and K812 sounded everytime a lot more open than the K702 and with a lot more clarity and treble extension too... I am just really puzzled with so different impressions from you comparing same headphones.

Cheers.

 

[K 240 DF]

hm...treble is really missing, and the treble has something like a phaser effect. So the sound signature has something i cant find in reality. Is this something what the k812 will loose after burning in?
And, the impulse is more laid back, so i am missing in a way the action of reality in the music.

 

[K 240 DF]

Definitivetely something weird is happening here. I owned at the same time (I compared both A/B) and to my ears and with my own gear (listen to them extensively with my Chord mojo and Chord Hugo 2 and tried both ocasionally with some borrowed Burson Soloist SL and Marantz HD1 units too) and K812 sounded everytime a lot more open than the K702 and with a lot more clarity and treble extension too... I am just really puzzled with so different impressions from you comparing same headphones.

Cheers.

Do u compare the 702 vs 812?

 

[mmwwmm]

Do u compare the 702 vs 812?

Yes, I owned both at the same time during a couple of months. I have borrowed a K701 too during that period. Now I only own the 812.

 

[K 240 DF]

hm, nothing noticed about the silly treble, and the phase effect on that, and the too laid back action?

 

[mocenigo]

hm...treble is really missing, and the treble has something like a phaser effect. So the sound signature has something i cant find in reality. Is this something what the k812 will loose after burning in?
And, the impulse is more laid back, so i am missing in a way the action of reality in the music.

This sounds very strange. Indeed, you may have a defective K812 (but is the effect on BOTH left and right channels?)

Roberto

 

[486892]

Yes, I owned both at the same time during a couple of months. I have borrowed a K701 too during that period. Now I only own the 812.

I have the K701 with 500+ hours and their sound is more far away and natural than K812, by ’openess’, when K812 sound is more close but a lot better stereo image and detail, but treble has some tension from beginning and it is not definitely missing, so in a way the sound stage is more ’boxy’ compared to K701, but the overall K812 is much more interesting and attractive, but do not forgive any of poorly mixed/mastered tracks, like some of older electronic music for example can give a big headache..

 

[FritzS]

I have the K701 with 500+ hours and their sound is more far away and natural than K812, by ’openess’, when K812 sound is more close but a lot better stereo image and detail, but treble has some tension from beginning and it is not definitely missing, so in a way the sound stage is more ’boxy’ compared to K701, but the overall K812 is much more interesting and attractive, but do not forgive any of poorly mixed/mastered tracks, like some of older electronic music for example can give a big headache..

You force me to unpack my old k701 too - and compere them with K812.

 

[Quadfather]

Was toying with selling the QP1R, then I listened to Fleetwood Mac Rumours on AKG K812 and said, "He'll no!"

 

[486892]

You force me to unpack my old k701 too - and compere them with K812.

Yeah, me too again. And imo the K701 are more airy and breathes deeper in upper range, but low end is missing. With K812 the dynamics of sound are relatively easy to detect, like the reverb tails and compressor adjustments of individual instruments, which K701 cannot deliver and their sound is more thin in that sense. K812 are already decent active studio monitors which are revealing the weaknesses of the tracks dynamics and of course the bass is just right there, doing what it supposed to do, work its own. Still i will use the K701 fine upper range to check the balances while i know the cans pretty well since spending a lot of time with them. All hours with them are enjoyed together, hand in hand, while with K812 i had to put them play alone to get more relaxed and to loose the most sharpness.