Akg K701 or Beyerdynamic custom one pro?

[Aaron94]

For home cinema the Magni would do just fine to power any headphone you want it to, after that the you still have the choice of the headphones. 
 
I personally would recommend something like the DT880, DT990, or maybe even one of Audio Technicas newer cans like the ATH-AD900x. There are 2 sides to the argument but I personally find the AKG K7** series of headphones to be very uncomfortable, mainly because of the bumps on the headband, which would get aggravating while watching movies.

 

[Ucronia]

Quote:

Is there any reason why you've limited yourself to those 3 models? Also, what is your budget for headphones? 
 
I really like the K701 - they can be driven from a laptop, but will sound better with an amp. Whether you will like their sound (even driven properly) is up to you.
I prefer the Beyerdynamic DT880 though. Never tried the custom one.
 
The other main contenders in that price range are the Sennheiser HD600 and HiFiMan HE400. 

 
2 models: K701 and C1P
The reason is this: exactly just like you, a lot of people talk to me about how they likes K701, and how those are great, videogames forum mention those usually, and the C1P seems to be a great pair of headphones, in my budget, well done, and with good reference (the eventually third choice could be for me the Beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO).
So the fight between those is caused (for me of course) by the Impedence difference, all the question is Akg k701 with a Good amp (still to be found) or the C1p that naturally have the same impedence audio device output?
 

 

[kramer5150]

The K701, more than any other dynamic can I have yet heard in its price range, sounds like whats upstream of it.  Shouty, edgy, harsh, sibilant amps and sources will sound exactly that way with the 701.  A lot of HD650 amps and setups sound pretty bad with the 701 IMHO, emphacizing and energizing the high frequency stuff through a headphone that really doesn't need emphacis there that at all.   That also includes high voltage / low current OTL tube amps, which IMHO dont have the current reserves to amp/damp these drivers dynamically.  So its slmost more about maintaining spectral accuracy and dynamics...  more so than sheer loudness of sound.  A Sansa clip will play these cans plenty loud (at least for my listening habits).
 
They are the only headphone I own that are neutral, and demanding enough to completely reveal sonic differences in all my amps.  They have a flat, closed-in, one dimensional soundstage under amped with my 18V cmoy (although I think a higher current OP amp than the 2107 would do better).  My 24V Larocco PPA (627-2107-627) is a little "dry sounding".  Upper midrange and vocals  are kind of distant sounding, kind of lacking energy for prog-rock and metal bands.   Ambiently it does the far out stuff very well, clearing center  stage and pushing sounds far out to the sides.  For new age and ambient music it sounds great, Enya sounds like a concert hall.  Its my fave amp for that kind of stuff.  My mister-X pimeta with the same OP amp compliment as the PPA, running at 24V is a little more closed in sounding than the PPA, but also has a warmer overall sound.  A little bassier, and lower midrange / vocals have a more "in the chest" kind of sound.  Pretty cool effect for prog-rock and metal.  Millet hybrid, has similar sonics as the pimeta... except It adds even order THD from the tubes.  I can SAFELY adjust plate bias voltage to either increase or decrease tube-THD.  Really cool design... all the pete Millets are this way.  It also opens up tube rolling possibilities.  Skip the smaller OTL amps like the earmax, morgan jones and the likes.  Not all together bad sounding with output transformer coupling (mod).  Volumes though are a bit limited, and theres a lack of bass impact/extension for those times when you want to play it really loud.  Which is really really strange, because my earmax with Sylvania and telefunken tubes adds quite a bit of bass impact and extension with my koss A250. The A250 like the K701 a 65 ohm can noted for being bass-shy.  I think its the 701s lack of efficiency that throttles its performance with small OTL amps.
 
I think  good K701 starter amps are tube hybrids like the millet and LD1+, for $150-200 they open up tube rolling possibilities and the k701 is neutral/revealing enough to hear the differences in tubes and with the millet different tube bias voltage settings.  Neither will set you back a whole lot $$$.  They have sufficient current reserves from their solid state buffers for low-Z cans like the 701, Denon and Grados.  

 

[Ucronia]

Quote:

The K701, more than any other dynamic can I have yet heard, sounds like whats upstream of it.  Shouty, edgy, harsh, sibilant amps and sources will sound exactly that way with the 701.  A lot of HD650 amps and setups sound pretty bad with the 701 IMHO, emphacizing and energizing the high frequency stuff through a headphone that really doesn't need emphacis there that at all.   That also includes high voltage / low current OTL tube amps, which IMHO dont have the current reserves to amp/damp these drivers dynamically.  So its slmost more about maintaining spectral accuracy and dynamics...  more so than sheer loudness of sound.  A Sansa clip will play these cans plenty loud (at least for my listening habits).
 
They are the only headphone I own that are neutral, and demanding enough to completely reveal sonic differences in all my amps.  They have a flat, closed-in, one dimensional soundstage under amped with my 18V cmoy (although I think a higher current OP amp than the 2107 would do better).  My 24V Larocco PPA (627-2107-627) is a little "dry sounding".  Upper midrange and vocals  are kind of distant sounding, kind of lacking energy for prog-rock and metal bands.   Ambiently it does the far out stuff very well, clearing center  stage and pushing sounds far out to the sides.  For new age and ambient music it sounds great, Enya sounds like a concert hall.  Its my fave amp for that kind of stuff.  My mister-X pimeta with the same OP amp compliment as the PPA, running at 24V is a little more closed in sounding than the PPA, but also has a warmer overall sound.  A little bassier, and lower midrange / vocals have a more "in the chest" kind of sound.  Pretty cool effect for prog-rock and metal.  Millet hybrid, has similar sonics as the pimeta... except It adds even order THD from the tubes.  I can SAFELY adjust plate bias voltage to either increase or decrease tube-THD.  Really cool design... all the pete Millets are this way.  It also opens up tube rolling possibilities.  Skip the smaller OTL amps like the earmax, morgan jones and the likes.  Not all together bad sounding with output transformer coupling (mod).  Volumes though are a bit limited, and theres a lack of bass impact/extension for those times when you want to play it really loud.  Which is really really strange, because my earmax with Sylvania and telefunken tubes adds quite a bit of bass impact and extension with my koss A250. The A250 like the K701 a 65 ohm can noted for being bass-shy.  I think its the 701s lack of efficiency that throttles its performance with small OTL amps.
 
I think  good K701 starter amps are tube hybrids like the millet and LD1+, for $150-200 they open up tube rolling possibilities and the k701 is neutral/revealing enough to hear the differences in tubes and with the millet different tube bias voltage settings.  Neither will set you back a whole lot $$$.  They have sufficient current reserves from their solid state buffers for low-Z cans like the 701, Denon and Grados.  

With a great shame to myself i have to say that most of what you have said is ancient arab for me.
i'm a beginner, not a wannabe or an hipster, i'm just making myself a present, a little luxury, but before this post i don't know anything about amplifiers except for most famous guitar amp, reading what you wrote i can easly immagine why you are a "headphoneus supremus", there aren't doubt about.
Just because this is my first "serious" pair of headphones, and is a little present to myself, i'm not ready to spend a luck in an amp.

So, Supremus, with a good convenience (Bravo audio series are around 60/70 euro, totally in my budget) and remembering the home use, that need clear effect and noises sound, what you definitely advise me to buy ?

 

[nsingh]

For gaming and home cinema, AKG is going to be your best bet, followed by Sennheiser 5xx or 6xx series, and then by Beyerdynamic. AKG and Senn share a very similar, wide sound stage but Senns have been less bassy than AKG. The tradeoff is that Senns are a bit more mid-forward than AKG. Beyerdynamic has slightly less sound stage and mid-rage, but more bass and treble. Take my opinion on Beyerdynamic with some caution because I've only tried their 770 and 880. Though I have the 990s coming in a couple days

 
From what I've read, the Custom One Pros are closed.  Beyers 770 are definitely closed. From my experience, closed headphones are usually inferior to open or semi-open headphones, with respect to sound stage. Since you're going to use for gaming/movies, I assume sound stage is important. If you want Beyers, the 880 are a better choice than the Custom One Pro, albeit a slightly weaker bass.
 
As for the 701 (or almost any Senns and Beyers that are 250ohms or less), the FiiO (specifically e07k, e9, e10, e11, e12, e17) amps are adequte to drive them, though you won't get full potential. Schiit Magni is a better choice and safeguards you for any future upgrades because the Schiit amps allow a lot of headphones to work well. Schiit generally makes very good amps for lower cost than what they should be. cMoy makes a cute little Altoids case amp that's fairly decent, also.
 
Someone also mentioned the Audio Technica AD-900. I haven't heard the 900, personally. But AT 900, as well as the 700, are excellent refferals from gamers. Many even do a mic-mod for them.

 

[kramer5150]

Quote:

With a great shame to myself i have to say that most of what you have said is ancient arab for me.
i'm a beginner, not a wannabe or an hipster, i'm just making myself a present, a little luxury, but before this post i don't know anything about amplifiers except for most famous guitar amp, reading what you wrote i can easly immagine why you are a "headphoneus supremus", there aren't doubt about.
Just because this is my first "serious" pair of headphones, and is a little present to myself, i'm not ready to spend a luck in an amp.

So, Supremus, with a good convenience (Bravo audio series are around 60/70 euro, totally in my budget) and remembering the home use, that need clear effect and noises sound, what you definitely advise me to buy ?

Sorry to be so wordy...  The key-point here is the K701 will sound like whats upstream of it.  Its revealing and demanding enough to clearly demonstrate (at lease to my ears) sonic differences between tubes, tube THD levels, op amps, and circuit designs.  So you can really fine tune its sonics to your liking depending on the amp and tubes you chose.
 
Keep in mind too a more forgiving headphone like the K240s-55 might be a better choice for those not wanting to invest $$$ in amps and sources.  The 240s is no where near as finicky, picky as the 701.  it also has a very good sounding gentile "V" curve overall, I think it does a nice job warming up bright / stale sounding amps and sources.

 

[davidsh]

I'd say you should either get the dt-990 or k701. But if you get the k701 do yourself a favor and invest in something decent amping. 

 

[Ucronia]

Ok i'm seeing from your comments the difficult to have an amp that valorize the headphones with a middle/low budget, and more over, that i think in most cases people ask for sound quality thinked to music (bass, high instead of middle).
Anyway i can immagine the important of this, in origin infact is the impedence difference that made me considering the alternative to thev AKG, but considering that anyone are talk to me in such great therms about this headphones, and expecially when we considering home cinema and gaming (first use) i'm now convinced in to buy the K701.

For me now the question is the amp, that for a noobie like me is pretty difficult question, more over considering the cost limit.
Anyway there's a thing that i want to expose you that still made me confused:
While asking there i'm also seeing in some other forum that i attend, exposing the same problem (the same peoples that made me discover the 701 and convinced me in to considering to buy them) and what they say about really confusing me:
In pratic they say that the original sound of akg is natural and analytical, and so work great for the noise quality about games sound.

Of course i'm not replicate to you opinions, also them says that amps is necessary, but recummended for music use.

Can you give me some explanations about?

#Shiit magni is pratically impossible to find on ebay or amazon. And more over, is it really most recommended for my use?

 

[nsingh]

Quote:

For me now the question is the amp, that for a noobie like me is pretty difficult question, more over considering the cost limit.
Anyway there's a thing that i want to expose you that still made me confused:
While asking there i'm also seeing in some other forum that i attend, exposing the same problem (the same peoples that made me discover the 701 and convinced me in to considering to buy them) and what they say about really confusing me:
In pratic they say that the original sound of akg is natural and analytical, and so work great for the noise quality about games sound.

Of course i'm not replicate to you opinions, also them says that amps is necessary, but recummended for music use.

Can you give me some explanations about?

#Shiit magni is pratically impossible to find on ebay or amazon. And more over, is it really most recommended for my use?

I'll agree that AKG sound is more natural and analytical. more so than Beyerdynamic.
 
Amps are generally required for any headphone that needs the power. It doesn't matter whether you're using them for games, music, movies, studio-use. 
 
The Schiit amps are usually bought directly from their website. If you get the 701, Schiit would be a better match to drive them. FiiO does a respectable job for the beginner. Cost-wise, you'd be spending about the same whether you chose FiiO or Schiit. With that said, I personally say the Schiit Magni would be your best choice for the 701 if you're not wanting to spend too much.
 
 
 
Quote:

The 240s is no where near as finicky, picky as the 701.  it also has a very good sounding gentile "V" curve overall, I think it does a nice job warming up bright / stale sounding amps and sources.

 
While I agree with the fact that the 701 is revealing about amps, I must disagree here. The 240S has a very flat frequency response, more so than the 701. Definitely not a V curve. The 240S isn't forgiving. It's flat. It's a studio monitor, so there is a very analytical sound to them. I wouldn't call them forgiving. Due to their flat curve, I would call them relaxed. If OP is going to invest in something engaging for gaming/cinema, the 240S headphone is an inferior choice to the 701, in my opinion.

 

[Ucronia]

Ok, helpfull. Right now i'm seeing Audio Technica ath-A900X, i haven't consider them before because the high price, but they are know on sale, and i can buy them, what about this fight: Akg K701 VS Audio Technica ATH-A900X? Always in therms of natural and analytical sound?

 

[KetchupNinja]

I had the A900X for a little while.  I really didn't think of them as analytical at all.  To me, it sounded musical; balanced with a little warmth.  I ended up returning them because they would always slide off my head.
 

 

[kramer5150]

Quote:

I'll agree that AKG sound is more natural and analytical. more so than Beyerdynamic.
 
Amps are generally required for any headphone that needs the power. It doesn't matter whether you're using them for games, music, movies, studio-use. 
 
The Schiit amps are usually bought directly from their website. If you get the 701, Schiit would be a better match to drive them. FiiO does a respectable job for the beginner. Cost-wise, you'd be spending about the same whether you chose FiiO or Schiit. With that said, I personally say the Schiit Magni would be your best choice for the 701 if you're not wanting to spend too much.
 
 
 
 
While I agree with the fact that the 701 is revealing about amps, I must disagree here. The 240S has a very flat frequency response, more so than the 701. Definitely not a V curve. The 240S isn't forgiving. It's flat. It's a studio monitor, so there is a very analytical sound to them. I wouldn't call them forgiving. Due to their flat curve, I would call them relaxed. If OP is going to invest in something engaging for gaming/cinema, the 240S headphone is an inferior choice to the 701, in my opinion.

 
 
K240S and newer MKII are marketed as monitors for the recording industry, however they most definitely are not spectrally flat (compared to a K701/2).  Just because something is marketed for or popular in the recording studio, does not mean it has a spectrally flat FR curve.  This is probably the biggest fallacy (or one of them) I have seen on HF.  Perhaps a "V" curve was the wrong choice of wording.  My personal K420s has a pronounced  bass boost over my K701, its a clear night/day difference between the the two cans.