[pnoble]

.

Imo USB-C is an example of ‘design by commitee’. An improvement over the past for sure, but its still not there yet. And I suspect Apple would love to dump both lightning and usb-c. Less (cables) is more. By the time the USB-Committee does arrive, we don’t need ‘m anymore.

In the mean time, the percentage of Apple PC’s ( ) and iPad Pro is probably dwarfed by iPhone and regular iPad users, Tim C will have done the math.

Lightening clicks into place, USB-C does not. The former seems particularly better suited to headphone use, if ever needed. (In my case only if I’m connecting to an in-flight entertainment system.)

I have USB-C on my MacBook and more than once it has lost power connectivity for no mechanical reason. Never happened with Lightening or, of course, MagSafe.

I have to agree that USB-C seems ‘designed by committee’. Not having a positive locking mechanism just seems a gross design fail. Ubiquitous for sure but inferior to Apple’s design(s) functionally speaking.

 

[Bompah]

.

Imo USB-C is an example of ‘design by commitee’. An improvement over the past for sure, but its still not there yet. And I suspect Apple would love to dump both lightning and usb-c. Less (cables) is more. By the time the USB-Committee does arrive, we don’t need ‘m anymore.

In the mean time, the percentage of Apple PC’s ( ) and iPad Pro‘s is probably dwarfed by iPhone and regular iPad users, Tim C will have done the math.

There are perfectly understandable reasons why they did it, not least the cut they get from every MFi device/cable, and the massive outcry when they changed from the 30pin.

I'm just very entitled and want everything my way, for my convenience. I consider it a massive imposition that I now have to carry four cables (A->C, A->L, C->C, C->L) with me when I travel instead of two (A->C, C->C). /s

 

[CharlesL]

The lighting port is offensive as a design choice. Anyone who has invested any real money in the Apple ecosystem doesn't really use lightning, we have iPads pro and Mac Books with USB-C, wireless charges for our Airpods (pro) and iPhones. The fact I've had to make special accommodations to charge the headphones is a PITA, they really need to dump this port and get on the USB-C train fully.

Really? I consider myself fairly invested in the Apple ecosystem. Three laptops (USB-C, another older), four iPhones (personal, company, testing devices), Apple TV, Watch, couple iPads (one pro with USB-C), 2 airpods, airpod pro and some homepod minis. I have a few wireless chargers sitting around and I use none of them. I've tried, but I don't see the appeal. They are slow. I can't charge while using the phones. Things fall off them. The devices on them can be pushed off so they aren't charging. I prefer cables to charge everything. Am I one of the few that still prefers they came with lightning over USB-C? I'm more likely to have access to a lightning cable when I need to charge them.

I guess it just doesn't bother me much. I'd still have to carry around the same number of cables regardless of if everything was USB-C or Lightning. I'm not trying to criticize you, I just find it interesting how different one's experience can be, even inside the same Apple ecosystem.

 

[angelom]

Devin Townsend – Deadhead (Live from the Royal Albert Hall

A great track recoded live in one of the greatest music venues on earth. The mix is difficult to get sounding right, and prefers speakers over headphones, so a good test for enjoyment.

The Albert Hall is a beautiful venue, yes, but for many, many years with terrible acoustics. I think they doing some work only very recently because of the 6-7 times I going to this venue in 25 years, only last year I hearing better acoustics (still not great/the best but very better than before).

I was also very disappointed with the dials. If they had just said "nice convenient dials for fine-tuned volume and ANC control" it would have been fine. But they compared them to the focus ring of a high quality camera lens. I happen to own several high quality cameral lenses and the experience is far from it. On a camera lens you get decent resistance allowing you to make minute adjustments with a satisfying feel, on the H95 they just spin with very little resistance. So a failure of marketing really, they are fine as is, but not what was sold to us.

We really have very different opinions about the APM and H95. Isn't only about the sound that we aren't agree, but now too about the user experience.

The only 'problem' with the h95 dials is that isn't so exact like the volume crown of the APM. BUT with the H95 the trick is doing a very quick action if you wanting small changes in volume, going (very) slowly isn't good. For this the APM crown is better, yes, but the (quick) reachability of the dial in h95 is very better in h95 because is instant and when you knowing the 'trick' is working (almost) perfect. Until today I don't having more satisfying experience in this aspect with the many bt/anc headphones I trying before.

BUT the one aspect is still a surprise for me is that almost nobody speaking of the design flaw of the placement of the anc/ambient and volume buttons in the APM. Is very, very easy hitting this buttons and activating something accidentally, or changing volume a lot when adjusting the headphone or taking off or putting on. The only reason I seeing for this that is not mentioning is some hype or honeymoon period where people can't admitting the APM isn't so perfect.

I'm a person very sensitive with small volume changes and I love the APM crown but the h95 is clearly better, for me. And even the changing of tracks (next/previous) feature is instant in the h95. In the APM you must first finding the button correctly AND needing pressing correctly because, in my case, many times I want next track and getting previous instead, and this clicks also making more noise when pressing than the swiping in h95 (not important but this but is happening). For me the constant volume changes and the changing of tracks I needing very constantly, and for this features the h95 is many better, and I'm, personally, happy paying a premium of 150€ extra only for this.

 

[striker]

the one aspect is still a surprise for me is that almost nobody speaking of the design flaw of the placement of the anc/ambient and volume buttons in the APM. Is very, very easy hitting this buttons and activating something accidentally, or changing volume a lot when adjusting the headphone or taking off or putting on. The only reason I seeing for this that is not mentioning is some hype or honeymoon period where people can't admitting the APM isn't so perfect.

While I agree it is easy to accidentally press the buttons, considering where they're placed and how one usually grabs the headphone's earcups, I find it not really worth mentioning because it's a matter of habit: you just get used to reaching for the cups in a way that avoids their upper side.

 

[Bompah]

Really? I consider myself fairly invested in the Apple ecosystem. Three laptops (USB-C, another older), four iPhones (personal, company, testing devices), Apple TV, Watch, couple iPads (one pro with USB-C), 2 airpods, airpod pro and some homepod minis. I have a few wireless chargers sitting around and I use none of them. I've tried, but I don't see the appeal. They are slow. I can't charge while using the phones. Things fall off them. The devices on them can be pushed off so they aren't charging. I prefer cables to charge everything. Am I one of the few that still prefers they came with lightning over USB-C? I'm more likely to have access to a lightning cable when I need to charge them.

I guess it just doesn't bother me much. I'd still have to carry around the same number of cables regardless of if everything was USB-C or Lightning. I'm not trying to criticize you, I just find it interesting how different one's experience can be, even inside the same Apple ecosystem.

We are all different in how we use things, I only really charge my phone over night, and find it a blessing to just drop it on the wireless charger next to my apple watch and APP. If I needed a quick charge I'd of course plug it in with an 18W plug but don't tend to find myself with a need to quick-charge. I think I'm mostly upset because I had to go and install a new cable next to my charging station just to charge the APM where before there was a single USB-C plugged into a 60W brick.

I also have three cable sets, one for each bag I have: daily work bag, travel cable bag I throw in suitcases, and my overnight/weekend backback, just so I don't have to keep re-packing. So removing lightning from my life would cut down on a lot of cables. But it doesn't annoy me enough to go back to Android!

 

[Bompah]

I think you completely missunderstood my point. I don't think there is anything wrong with the dials themselves, what i take issue with is their marketing. Don't tell me I am getting something which feels like the focus ring on a high quality camera lens, and then deliver the surface headphone dials. Although "having to know the trick" feels a bit like "you're holding it wrong" from the iPhone 4.

The Albert Hall is a beautiful venue, yes, but for many, many years with terrible acoustics. I think they doing some work only very recently because of the 6-7 times I going to this venue in 25 years, only last year I hearing better acoustics (still not great/the best but very better than before).



We really have very different opinions about the APM and H95. Isn't only about the sound that we aren't agree, but now too about the user experience.

The only 'problem' with the h95 dials is that isn't so exact like the volume crown of the APM. BUT with the H95 the trick is doing a very quick action if you wanting small changes in volume, going (very) slowly isn't good. For this the APM crown is better, yes, but the (quick) reachability of the dial in h95 is very better in h95 because is instant and when you knowing the 'trick' is working (almost) perfect. Until today I don't having more satisfying experience in this aspect with the many bt/anc headphones I trying before.

BUT the one aspect is still a surprise for me is that almost nobody speaking of the design flaw of the placement of the anc/ambient and volume buttons in the APM. Is very, very easy hitting this buttons and activating something accidentally, or changing volume a lot when adjusting the headphone or taking off or putting on. The only reason I seeing for this that is not mentioning is some hype or honeymoon period where people can't admitting the APM isn't so perfect.

I'm a person very sensitive with small volume changes and I love the APM crown but the h95 is clearly better, for me. And even the changing of tracks (next/previous) feature is instant in the h95. In the APM you must first finding the button correctly AND needing pressing correctly because, in my case, many times I want next track and getting previous instead, and this clicks also making more noise when pressing than the swiping in h95 (not important but this but is happening). For me the constant volume changes and the changing of tracks I needing very constantly, and for this features the h95 is many better, and I'm, personally, happy paying a premium of 150€ extra only for this.

 

[obsidyen]

I hate to say it but tweets like this make me really question whether I can rely on DMS’s opinions going forward.

First of all, the way he despises the M50X seems completely unwarranted to me. I understand the audiophile world has been pretty critical of it, particularly after it was overhyped by people like MKBHD, but it’s not a bad headphone. It’s not spectacular, but it’s not horrible, either. The amount of derision it receives is unwarranted, in my opinion.

But then on top of that, he compares the APM to the M50X in a negative way, as if he doesn’t view the APM as being any better. And given how much he hates the M50X, that showcases his views of the APM.

I understand everyone has their own opinions and it’s okay to disagree, but I think his view of the APM is so off base here, that it makes me question whether I can rely on his other headphone opinions and reviews, as his opinions deviate so vastly from my own.

Doesn't he get paid by Abyss?.. Admitting that APMs sound good is not good for his business. He's not really an audio journalist anyway, just another guy trying to make money from his hobby.

 

[angelom]

I think you completely missunderstood my point. I don't think there is anything wrong with the dials themselves, what i take issue with is their marketing. Don't tell me I am getting something which feels like the focus ring on a high quality camera lens, and then deliver the surface headphone dials. Although "having to know the trick" feels a bit like "you're holding it wrong" from the iPhone 4.

I think the dials aren't obviously like in cameras, but aren't so bad like you suggesting, in my opinion, and aren't like in Surface headphone (where you can't really adjusting for small increments in volume). The 'trick' I mentioning is very easy for noticing/learning after little using the headphone. Isn't necessary asking about this or reading some instructions. You saying you almost never using your h95 so maybe this is why you don't having the time for discovering exactly how this dial is working for small changes in volume.

 

[Gweeds]

Does it matter. One of you likes them and is keeping them. The other doesn’t and isn’t.

 

[Heyyoudvd]

Step aside Orpheus, we have a new king!

https://www.macrumors.com/2020/12/28/caviar-pure-gold-airpods-max/

 

[tkddans]

Impressions from a Layman
AKG K361 and K371 / Drop Panda / AirPods Max

Ok, nothing major or so formal, but I wanted to share some quick anecdotes from my wife's sister, who is not an audiophile at all.

Wife's Sister. Non-audiophile. Layman. Blind Test
(I placed headphones on her head, she didn't know which was which; hasn't heard any before)


Song: Santa Tell me
Artist: Ariana Grande

She proceeds to go back and forth between them as I place them on her head, while I type notes as shown in her commentary below.

APM (fourth headphone tried): With the last one [APM], the voice and the other instruments came through sparkly. I could hear all of them. It sounds like...three layers of sounds. The beats from the bass...kind of reverberate in the background. They linger after they are hit. It's nice, because it creates another layer of sound. It's almost like...surround sound?

Panda (third headphone tried): The other one [the Drop Panda] sounded muddled. The headphones also felt heavier.

K371 (second headphone tried): *tries on the K371; shows visible critical 'meh' face*
Static-y [referring to K371 on head]. There's so much static! The other one that sounded like 3 layers, I could hear all the sounds. In this one, it sounds like the static is breaking up the sound of her voice.

K361 (first headphone tried on track): Her voice is the most prominent part. I guess people might like that more. I like the bass. It doesn't linger, like you don't feel it. I like that [with the APM] you feel you're in the song. In this one though, her voice feels more forward than anything else.

*I proceed to tell her that some critics prefer K361/K371 as I point to them*
*She responds with a shaking head and grimace of disapproval*



Not blind testing anymore. She continues choosing tracks, but now picking up each whichever headphone she wants as she goes.


Song: Tatooed Heart
Artist: Ariana Grande

APM (first headphone tried on track): *bobs head back and forth*
Goosebumps! I've heard this song a lot before [I haven't heard it this way before]! This song sounds...really good on these! You should try these *tells my wife to put them on*
So this song has violins in there...and there are drums...it builds...it feels like you're right on the stage with them.

Panda (second headphone tried): Didn't get goosebumps with this one. *proceeds to move on to K361*

K371 (fourth headphone tried): These aren't as comfortable. Like, the weight is all on top. Wow, that's like...*scoffs* That part of the song that builds, that was really nice on the Apple ones, were flat. It didn't build the way the Apple ones did. The end point was just not...exciting. It doesn't do the song justice.

K361 (third headphone tried): Definitely less bass. Doesn't sound as grand as on the Apple ones. With those, it felt like you were on stage and the percussion was on you. It was so present and just so good. You can hear it in this one but it doesn't give you the same feel. But I liked these headphones more on this song than I did on the Santa tell me song.


Song: Bring Me Love
Artist: John Legend

APM (second headphone tried on track): *see K371 notes*

Panda (third headphone tried): The bass drum isn't prominent on this one either. It's not very clear on this one either [like the K371 wasn't clear]. I just like that bass to be prominent in my music. That's how you keep tempo.

K371 (first headphone tried): *no notes at first; places APM on head before saying anything*
I think this has to do with the pads themselves and how it fits I your ears. With this one, you know how when in a movie someone is listening to headphones and the camera pans out from them listening to music, to showing the audience a scene? Where the character is still listening to the music, [the K371] sounds like how you still hear that character's music but you're also listening to the scene sounds. The music sounds distant, like you're not really hearing the sound yourself. Maybe this is because the pads sit on your ear a certain way? When I listen to the Apple ones, it feels more immersive.

The bass is very muddled. For a song like this, the bass kind of like grounds the song? In a way that just like...it's just very nice to listen to on the Airpods.

K361 (fourth headphone tried): It's just very voice forward. Yea...so with these two *points to K361/371*, it feels like they take the bass away, like in a movie, when they want you to move your attention away from a song. It sounds like you're listening at just a surface level.



Her Summary
In short, my preference is the AirPods, for my taste. I can see someone who just wants to listen to the voice of the artist, would choose these two..the "k's."

The Panda are more comfortable than the K's, they have a nicer weight to them. Very comfortable.

The AirPods, I think because they completely surround my ear, but not touching my ear...they're just very comfortable. They also have a very nice bass to them. Personally I would get the AirPods, not knowing anything about their prices.

*I tell her the prices and ask which one she would get*

That makes sense.

*I ask her "so what do you think?"*

I would have to listen to these [the Pandas] a little bit more. At that point, at $400, I would pay $550 for the AirPods, because the overall listening experience was just so nice for me, for what I listen to. I like that immersive bass feel. And they're really comfortable and they have good weight to them. I personally don't use headphones that often, so I can see having a pair of headphones for a very long time. I would buy a pair of these.

 

[Bompah]

Does it matter. One of you likes them and is keeping them. The other doesn’t and isn’t.

Indeed, I am quickly getting to the understanding that engaging with angelom is a waste of energy.

 

[geardoc]

So, what's the concensus. Are the AirPod$Max good for bassheads? Is there a wired set of cans that you might compare them with? (Beyerdynamics come to mind, maybe)

 

[Bompah]

So, what's the concensus. Are the AirPod$Max good for bassheads? Is there a wired set of cans that you might compare them with? (Beyerdynamics come to mind, maybe)

In my view:

Mid-bass
Sub-bass

Afraid I can't think of a wired with the same tuning which I've heard recently.