[digger945]

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Originally Posted by Coreyk78 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I felt like posting an update on my build progress, I have most of my parts gathered for my 6N23P high-voltage 24V Aikido (oxymoron? hehe)

Hey that's what the thread is for and I've been wondering how you were coming along.

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I have my order in for a PS-1 kit and am just waiting for the next set of PCBs to be in stock.

Yea I noticed that it looks like maybe 2 more weeks for the PS-1's to be ready to ship.

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So far I have 3.3uf Solen PPBs that I'm going to bypass with some russian pios and .47uf multicaps for C1 and C3, and some 1uf Solens for C12 and C13. I also got some 2200uf 35V Nichicon HEs for the heater caps, a 33uf 200V Nichicon PW for C11 and some rather huge sized 470uf 200V PWs for C4, they are almost bigger than some 10000uf 50V Panasonics I have. I also have a bunch of nos ERO-Roderstein KP caps in various sizes on their way to me. Resistors are a mix of Holco, Allen Bradley, Ohmite and Vishay, using the high quality ones in the critical positions. I have an Antek 150-0-150/6.3-0-6.3 toroid in the mail, so I'm close to having all the parts collected.

What's the lead spacing on those 2200uF/35V Nich. heater caps, I show about 3.5mm or so on my pcb? Hey I ordered some nice looking Cornell Dubilier 470uF 450V caps from a military surplus guy on ebay and can't wait to try them out as headphone coupling caps. I also got a fair deal on some Holco resistors. It will be interesting to listen to them as well.
If I may, how did you order the Antek, do you just use PayPal and put the traffo number in the info box when paying? I sent an email about a week ago and have yet to recieve a reply. Maybe I should use the phone

.

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I forgot to get the heatsinks and FETs on my last mouser order, (doh!) but I need a couple other odds and ends for a different project so I'll get those soon.

I'm glad I'm not the only one to do this.
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I'm still unsure of what voltage I'm going to use for B+, 100V is suggested for 6DJ8s in the manual, but I've been able to email JB and discuss that a little bit, and he said his favorite amp for his HD650s uses a 150V B+ with 6DJ8s. Being a total high voltage tube noob I look at the 6N23P datasheet and it says 100V anode voltage, but 300V max anode voltage, pretty much the same as 6DJ8. Am I going to shorten the tube life by running somewhere around 150V B+? Also I haven't seen the manual for the PS-1 yet, but I think it should be able to drop the 300VCT from the transformer to 150VDC without any problems right?

Just be aware that whatever your B+, each triode will only be getting half(or less that half) of that B+ Voltage, so if you run 150V B+, then each triode in each tube of the Aikido circuit will only have ~75V or less on the plate.
The two triodes of one tube on the Aikido schematic are in series from B+ to ground. This is how they "share" the PS noise, making this a design with good PSRR.
If JB says that his fav is 150V B+ using 6DJ8's then I would say you could probably take that to the bank.

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I'm spending more money than I had planned to,

LOL. Welcome to the club friend, I'm glad I'm not alone LOL

 

[Coreyk78]

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Originally Posted by digger945 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What's the lead spacing on those 2200uF/35V Nich. heater caps, I show about 3.5mm or so on my pcb? Hey I ordered some nice looking Cornell Dubilier 470uF 450V caps from a military surplus guy on ebay and can't wait to try them out as headphone coupling caps. I also got a fair deal on some Holco resistors. It will be interesting to listen to them as well. If I may, how did you order the Antek, do you just use PayPal and put the traffo number in the info box when paying? I sent an email about a week ago and have yet to recieve a reply. Maybe I should use the phone .

I pulled up the datasheet, and it says 7.5mm on the lead spacing, I'll have to check and see how those fit the pcb when I get home, they're still sitting in the bag.
As for ordering from Antek, I actually got this one off their ebay store, saved 3 bucks, haha! But I ordered a pair of toroids for my monoblock chipamp and called them to order, but the woman on the phone actually told me to just send paypal and put your part numbers in the comments because that was the best way to order from them, so thats what I did.

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Originally Posted by digger945 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just be aware that whatever your B+, each triode will only be getting half(or less that half) of that B+ Voltage, so if you run 150V B+, then each triode in each tube of the Aikido circuit will only have ~75V or less on the plate. The two triodes of one tube on the Aikido schematic are in series from B+ to ground. This is how they "share" the PS noise, making this a design with good PSRR.

Oh, thats good to know, I didn't realize it worked that way, so it should actually be quite conservative at 150V B+, my minimum cap rating is 200V so I have plenty of headroom there.

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Originally Posted by digger945 /img/forum/go_quote.gif LOL. Welcome to the club friend, I'm glad I'm not alone LOL

Thanks, happy to be a member

but hey, I could think of worse ways to spend money.

 

[digger945]

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Originally Posted by Coreyk78 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I pulled up the datasheet, and it says 7.5mm on the lead spacing, I'll have to check and see how those fit the pcb when I get home, they're still sitting in the bag.

Mine measures 7.5mm on the overall diameter, but if your lead spacing will work, you can use a much larger diameter cap here. There is plenty of room.

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As for ordering from Antek, I actually got this one off their ebay store, saved 3 bucks, haha!

I totally didn't know they had an ebay store, must check that out right now.
Thanks!!!

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But I ordered a pair of toroids for my monoblock chipamp and called them to order, but the woman on the phone actually told me to just send paypal and put your part numbers in the comments because that was the best way to order from them, so thats what I did.

I think I will follow suite and call on the phone also.


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Oh, thats good to know, I didn't realize it worked that way, so it should actually be quite conservative at 150V B+, my minimum cap rating is 200V so I have plenty of headroom there.

FWIW, I am doing the 6H30 witha B+ of 150V, mainly because it is in my user's guide that came with the pcb's. Again, I think if JB recommends it you will be more than satisfied with it.


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Thanks, happy to be a member but hey, I could think of worse ways to spend money.

Oh how true.

 

[Coreyk78]

The 7.5mm lead spacing on the heater caps fit the PCB perfectly, at least on my Rev. 3 board.

 

[digger945]

Just put a pair of PCC88/7DJ8(6DJ8 with 7 volt heater) in my 24V Aikido.
They sound absolutely fantastic. Bottom end definition is absolutely out of this world, I've yet to hear anything like this.

TDSL tube data for the PCC88 shows about 90 volts for the plate, I wonder what they would sound like with a little bit more juice.

A very special thank you to my good friend Ludoo, who sent these all the way from Milan Italy.

And thanks to dBel84 for forwarding them to me.
Thanks Ludo.

 

[Coreyk78]

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Originally Posted by digger945 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just put a pair of PCC88/7DJ8(6DJ8 with 7 volt heater) in my 24V Aikido. They sound absolutely fantastic. Bottom end definition is absolutely out of this world, I've yet to hear anything like this. TDSL tube data for the PCC88 shows about 90 volts for the plate, I wonder what they would sound like with a little bit more juice. A very special thank you to my good friend Ludoo, who sent these all the way from Milan Italy. And thanks to dBel84 for forwarding them to me. Thanks Ludo.

Thats good to know, I have my 8 6n23p tubes, and I just got the shipping notification today on my PS-1 kit, and I should have my case from Par-Metal in about a week or so to finish my high voltage build. I'll report back here when its done with what I think of it.

I also have a second 24v board and an H-PS-1 kit so I could try building a low voltage version too with the same tubes and compare, thats if I feel like spending that much money, haha

 

[BoilermakerFan]

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Originally Posted by digger945 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just put a pair of PCC88/7DJ8(6DJ8 with 7 volt heater) in my 24V Aikido. They sound absolutely fantastic. Bottom end definition is absolutely out of this world, I've yet to hear anything like this. TDSL tube data for the PCC88 shows about 90 volts for the plate, I wonder what they would sound like with a little bit more juice. A very special thank you to my good friend Ludoo, who sent these all the way from Milan Italy. And thanks to dBel84 for forwarding them to me. Thanks Ludo.

What? Damn, dB and Ludoo have been holding out on me!

Man, I guess things have been crazy busy for me with home life but work has been too slow so my funds are short now.

Luckily I do have the trafo for the Aikido already so I may have to just build up the MAXes and gainclones sans toroids for the moment and just listen to the MAXes off a wall wart for DB comparisons.

Probably won't be able to make the meet either, but you guys already have the same gear I have, sans the Yamaha YH-3s and SFI orthos I'll be starting in the spring... Oh, and my K601s have just enough differences over the K701s to be audible.

 

[Coreyk78]

Ok, I need some help figuring out if I can use the transformer I already have with the Glassware PS-1 kit.

I have the Antek AN-1T150 which has dual 150v secondaries, and dual 6.3v secondaries. I just got my PS-1 kit yesterday and the capacitors are 400v, which is a problem if I connect the transformer at 300v series with full-wave bridge rectification, since it will rectify to ~420v.

The PS-1 has the flexibilty to do either bridge rectifiers or full-wave center-tap rectifiers. Can I use the two secondary leads that are tied together for series as a center tap? I've never used a CT transformer, so I don't know. Assuming I can use it that way though, how much DC voltage should I expect to get with 300-0-300 on a full-wave CT setup? My target voltage after regulation is ~150V so I think if I can get somewhere close to 200v or more before regulation with the CT setup I should be ok.

I've also considered buying a step up transformer with 230v secondary, but then I need a filament transformer too, so more expensive, or I could upgrade the caps in the PS to higher voltage too I suppose, but I'd like to try and make it work with what I already have first.

Any advice is welcome!

 

[BoilermakerFan]

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Originally Posted by Coreyk78 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ok, I need some help figuring out if I can use the transformer I already have with the Glassware PS-1 kit. I have the Antek AN-1T150 which has dual 150v secondaries, and dual 6.3v secondaries. I just got my PS-1 kit yesterday and the capacitors are 400v, which is a problem if I connect the transformer at 300v series with full-wave bridge rectification, since it will rectify to ~420v. The PS-1 has the flexibilty to do either bridge rectifiers or full-wave center-tap rectifiers. Can I use the two secondary leads that are tied together for series as a center tap? I've never used a CT transformer, so I don't know. Assuming I can use it that way though, how much DC voltage should I expect to get with 300-0-300 on a full-wave CT setup? My target voltage after regulation is ~150V so I think if I can get somewhere close to 200v or more before regulation with the CT setup I should be ok. I've also considered buying a step up transformer with 230v secondary, but then I need a filament transformer too, so more expensive, or I could upgrade the caps in the PS to higher voltage too I suppose, but I'd like to try and make it work with what I already have first. Any advice is welcome!

I'm not following your train of thought, if 150VDC is your target, then why would you series connect the 150VAC secondaries on the CT? Parallel the 150VAC leads, which be about 210VDC after rectification with double the current, regulated down to 150VDC is fine, that's a 25% delta through the reg so you should be fine in most cases. Check the data sheet for your v-reg just to make sure though, but I don't see the problem. If you are trying to regulate down to 250VDC or 300VDC, then you would need to bump those caps up past 500VDC rating...

Keep it as simple and clean as possible. That's the Aikido mantra.

 

[Coreyk78]

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Originally Posted by BoilermakerFan /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm not following your train of thought, if 150VDC is your target, then why would you series connect the 150VAC secondaries on the CT? Parallel the 150VAC leads, which be about 210VDC after rectification with double the current, regulated down to 150VDC is fine, that's a 25% delta through the reg so you should be fine in most cases. Check the data sheet for your v-reg just to make sure though, but I don't see the problem. If you are trying to regulate down to 250VDC or 300VDC, then you would need to bump those caps up past 500VDC rating... Keep it as simple and clean as possible. That's the Aikido mantra.

Duh, sorry, I've been sick the last couple days haha. For some reason that hadn't occured to me to just parallel the secondaries, I got it stuck in my head that since there were only 2 AC pads on the board that I needed to series connect them so that I had 2 wires, if that makes any sense of what I was thinking

the secondaries are yellow/white, yellow/white. So I should just be able to tie the 2 yellows and 2 whites together and connect that way? Just want to verify since my brain apparently isn't at full function today(or most other days), haha!

 

[BoilermakerFan]

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Originally Posted by Coreyk78 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Duh, sorry, I've been sick the last couple days haha. For some reason that hadn't occured to me to just parallel the secondaries, I got it stuck in my head that since there were only 2 AC pads on the board that I needed to series connect them so that I had 2 wires, if that makes any sense of what I was thinking the secondaries are yellow/white, yellow/white. So I should just be able to tie the 2 yellows and 2 whites together and connect that way? Just want to verify since my brain apparently isn't at full function today(or most other days), haha!

Grab the wiring diagram form AnTek's site to make sure, but that should be correct, tying both yellows and both whites together. You can add a third wire for a single lead at the maximum gauge the PCB will accept and solder the three wires (the 2 secondaries and tail) together, then bring just the tail to the PCB. Or you can use screw terminal blocks and run the two primaries for each leg into one block, the bring a single lead out of the terminal block, but make sure all the lead points are common and not isolated...

I'll be using some neat DIN rail mounted miniature terminal blocks for my AC distribution on the PSU side of the Nabu case only because I have gobs of them left over from a failed industrial project and I was giving the hardware. Some neat stuff that I can "repurpose" for audio gear.

 

[Coreyk78]

Good stuff, problem solved, I just mocked it up that way quickly and that should work just fine, thanks for steering me back onto the simple path.

Unfortunately the board has 7.5mm spacing on the AC pads, and me terminal blocks are 5mm, so I'll just hardwire it.

I should now have all the parts to finish my build now, my case from par-metal arrived today, I got gold alodine instead of the clear that I thought I ordered, but I'm gonna use it anyway. Alot of casework and wiring ahead of me now!

 

[Coreyk78]

Also interesting, is that the Antek schematic is not accurate. It shows two 6.3v secondaries, but its actually a 12.6v and a 6.3v.

 

[digger945]

I show the same thing on my 1T150 Corey.
Bummer, I need at least 4amps 6.3volts for my heaters.
I think you'll be OK with the 6n23's. Tubedata shows .365 per.
I bought this from his ebay store because it was advertised as having two 6.3 secondaries, making it flexible to use with both 6.3 and 12.6.
I'm gonna send an email and see what's up.

 

[looser101]

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Originally Posted by Coreyk78 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also interesting, is that the Antek schematic is not accurate. It shows two 6.3v secondaries, but its actually a 12.6v and a 6.3v.

Very strange. Have you measured it?

I found these two and they are different, so...

http://www.antekinc.com/AN-1T150.pdf

http://www.toroid-transformer.com/AN-1T150.pdf

I wonder which one is right.