701/2 Good, detailed, harsh review from a head fi member with tons of experience
Mar 17, 2010 at 6:42 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 137

kool bubba ice

Headphoneus Supremus
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Pros: Soundstage, good level of detail, overall instrument separation & clarity
Cons: Needs good headphone amp & source, limited applicability with multiple music genres

I think the user reviews preceding mine have sufficiently covered the pros of the K702 - yes, it's a pretty good headphone and I'll admit that if you've never heard headphones remotely close to this price range before, it may very well even sound great (depending on how you like the sound, of course). We all had to start somewhere and the K701 (the K702's precedent) was actually my first expensive headphone too.

But enough of the praise because the K702 isn't what I'd call stellar in every aspect. I'll start first by saying that the K702 is identical in sound quality to the K701 - I did own both at the same time to find out for myself. The main reason to get the K702 instead is for its cool midnight-blue color and detachable cable - however, unlike the K701 the K702 *cannot* be re-cabled to balanced.

I've been fortunate enough to hear lots of headphones over the last 3+ years (mostly by traveling to meet lots of like-minded headphone listeners who have had some seriously crazy gear stashes), most of which are considerably more expensive than the K701/K702 ("K70x" from here on out), so I'll try to put these headphones into proper context.

Sure, they're detailed, obviously more than headphones that are cheaper, but the level of detail is really nothing special when you compare them to similarly priced competitors, and of course more expensive headphones. In the same approximate price range I found both the Sony SA5000 and Beyerdynamic DT880 to have an extra degree of detail (well they're also very treble-tilted but that's beside my point). The SA5000 and DT880 simply have a more "clear" sound that masks the entire frequency spectrum less and just allow you to hear more densely-packed subtleties.

The K70x are also moderately fast in terms of their impulse response but in order to get the best possible impulse response, you need to amp them with a really good amp and even then they won't take home any awards for their speed, even at their price - the Sony SA5000 for example is considerably faster, as are other headphones from Audio-Technica and Grado, and there are also a few electrostatic headphones in this price range too. The K70x doesn't really "blur" fast & incisive notes but neither does it make them "pop" with clarity, it's sort of in between.

The soundstage is a double-edged sword - it's very large and open with a killer vanishing effect (instruments can sound like they're literally suspended around and in front of you), but the K70x imposes this soundstage on everything regardless of the recording. It can work for music like classical and jazz, but probably the last thing you want if you're an avid rock or metal listener.

The sound quality is also somewhat of a double-edged sword. The overall sound is quite laid-back (compared to notably the Senn HD600/HD650 and especially Grados) and there isn't that much mid-range either (except in the female vocal range), so full-range instruments and voices won't exactly exude a ton of body and weight, which can come off as sounding a bit "disembodied." This makes the K70x less than ideal for genres like prog rock, metal, & some electronica where a lot can depend on driving bass & mid-range, but it's not as bad with genres like classical, jazz, folk, even some classic rock.

To boil it down, I think the K70x is at best an "average" headphone for the price. It's not terrible in any one area but not really outstanding in any either. Not that it's "bad" per se, I just don't think it's great - but on the other hand, you really have to spend serious money to get something better-sounding (like $1.4K for the Sennheiser HD800, for example). Also keep in mind that the K70x needs both a high-quality source component and headphone amp to perform its best - in fact, I would suggest not buying these if you intend to use them straight from a computer or portable DAP. That said, it's still probably the headphone to get if your budget is under $500 and you don't mind a general "neutrality" to the sound quality (with a large soundstage to boot), and you have a good source & amp too (or plan to acquire them).

I agree about the detail part.. Never understood the 'great detail' that the 701 has.. Very good, yes! But SA5000/DT880/DT48 are more detailed with a heightened sense of resolve. In general, I feel the review is fair, but a bit harsh in a way..

I DID NOT WRITE THIS REVIEW.. a hEAD fI MEMBER DID.
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 6:45 PM Post #2 of 137
I was under the impression you actually had pretty limited experience, especially with high end headphones. Could you list some of the high end headphones you've heard for some perspective? I know you've heard the K1000.
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 6:54 PM Post #4 of 137
Nice write up! I can't fully agree with some of your comments, but overall well done. It's nice to hear another side to these very controversial headphones.

You comments on detail retrieval match up with The Absolute Sound's findings if I remember correctly.

Personally, I think they are a steal at $259 new and I did prefer them to the DT880/HD600/HD650. One has to spend at least 2-4x to out perform them (but then the law of diminished returns kicks in).
I really did enjoy them very much with Prog Rock (Pink Floyd, Rush), but for Sabbath, Metallica and Zeppelin, I would go with the SR225s in the same price range. Actually these two are great complimentary headphones IMO.

Nonetheless, I think this should be a very interesting thread and that everyone does not take this review personally (unless of course you were the AKG product design engineer).

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Now, waiting for....
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 6:58 PM Post #6 of 137
Great write-up, which has now tempted me to try the DT880s for myself.

I won't compare my knowledge on this subject to yours - you win hands down, but some of the things you (and many others) don't like about the K701s, are the things I like about them - strange as that may seem! That certainly doesn't mean they are better headphones, more accurate, detailed, etc. than those you have compared them to in your review - just a personal preference sound wise based on what I have tried to-date. I also owned Stax SRx headphones for many years - they killed my ears with their forward presentation!

I guess I will have to buy more headphones before I can even give a reasonable opinion on this. My wallet thanks you!
atsmile.gif
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:03 PM Post #7 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by ecclesand /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Someone certainly thinks highly of himself...


I think that is a very unfair comment about the OP, as he is only passing on his impressions from his own, not inconsiderable, experience and I think, trying to be helpful to fellow Head-Fiers. Why would you say something like this? You should defend your position if you have a rationale for this.
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:03 PM Post #8 of 137
I find the K701's to be extremely revealing, possibly even too revealing for most material. If your claim is that the DT-880's are even more revealing than that, I'm not sure I'd be interested in them.

Needless to say (or maybe some people need to hear this) there is no reason to be spending more than maybe 100-200 dollars on headphones if you don't plan to properly amp them, and if your source isn't very good. That'd be like buying a Ferrari, putting regular gas into the tank, and then complaining when it doesn't quite go as fast as a Ferrari should.

The only problem I've ever had with the K701's is the comfort (specifically the bumps on the headband). As always, headphones are a matter of personal taste, and I can understand that you didn't like them as much as I did, but I wouldn't say that they aren't equally as good as any competitors in their price range. Having said all of that, I sold my pair due to the comfort (which I now have back...darn you Canada Post), so they aren't worth much to me when I can't even wear them without getting a headache after ten minutes. Sonically though, I find them to be excellent.
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:05 PM Post #9 of 137
Very good review. One of the studios I work at has 3 pairs of K701s, so I've spent a fair share of time with them. First, their main strength: If you've ever needed to fully evaluate a female vocal performance, nothing out there is quite as good. One project I was working on was piecing together a live song for a female vocalist from several different recordings. My main job was to pick out the best vocal parts out of 35 different performances to piece together a single coherent song. At first I was using DT770's and switched over to the K701's and my life was made immediately easier. I could clearly hear every single imperfection. The singer was in fact a fantastic singer, so that was no small task. With the DT770's everything sounded about the same. With the K701's at times she didn't sound like the same singer at all.

But as far as reproducing music the way the producer/engineers intended it to sound, I couldn't think of a HQ headphone that does a worse job of that. Everything just sounds way off and overly thin to me. The difference is so stark that pink noise almost sounds closer to white noise than true pink noise. Honestly, I'd take my AD700 any day of the week for normal music listening over the K701. And as far as the AD900 v. the K701, I don't think there is a comparison. The AD900 sounds miles more balanced, smoother, just as refined and detailed. Both are bass light, but the AD900 doesn't sound as thin to me as the K701. And the AD900 doesn't cost a fortune to properly amp.

I know some will disagree with me, but I just don't see the argument for choosing the K701 over the AD900. Unless you just want something that's expensive to amp.

edit: 1000th post!
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:10 PM Post #10 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by fjrabon /img/forum/go_quote.gif
At first I was using DT770's and switched over to the K701's and my life was made immediately easier. I could clearly hear every single imperfection. The singer was in fact a fantastic singer, so that was no small task. With the DT770's everything sounded about the same. With the K701's at times she didn't sound like the same singer at all.


I completely agree, but I would suggest that the better comparison would be with the DT880 (600ohm) version. Congrats on your 1000th post!
bigsmile_face.gif


FWIW, I still preferred the K701s to them, but they were more in line with regards to vocals (especially female vocals). The reason I preferred the K701s was that the mids seemed less recessed than the beyer offering (though not by much).
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:15 PM Post #12 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ridleyguy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Oh no! Now I have another headphone to try! I hope it stops there.
biggrin.gif



It only will if you try them and never come back to Head-fi.
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Otherwise, as they say: "Sorry to your wallet".
wink.gif
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:17 PM Post #13 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ridleyguy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Oh no! Now I have another headphone to try! I hope it stops there.
biggrin.gif



It never stops. I have multiple pairs of perfectly fine headphones, and I still crave a pair of custom IEM's, despite really having no use for them. I've got a decent source, and I still bought a uDac, just so I could see what all the fuss is about (I'm a FOTM sucker apparently)

I'm sorry about the top of your head in advance! (Those bumps really hurt >_<)
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:17 PM Post #14 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by MacedonianHero /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I completely agree, but I would suggest that the better comparison would be with the DT880 (600ohm) version.
bigsmile_face.gif


FWIW, I still preferred the K701s to them, but they were more in line with regards to vocals (especially female vocals). The reason I preferred the K701s was that they seemed less recessed than the beyer offering (though not by much).



yeah, I've actually never been able to try out DT880's, though its been a headphone I've been curious about for a long time. The DT770 is all over the place in recording studios because its so great for vocal tracking due to isolation. The K701 is also pretty popular in nicer recording studios. You're also starting to see a lot of the new shures in recording studios as well. I'd actually guess part of the main reason there are so many shures and akgs in recording studios doesn't have as much to do with the quality of the headphones as it does that most nicer recording studios already have large contracts with Shure and AKG for microphones.
 
Mar 17, 2010 at 7:21 PM Post #15 of 137
Quote:

Originally Posted by MacedonianHero /img/forum/go_quote.gif
It only will if you try them and never come back to Head-fi.
very_evil_smiley.gif


Otherwise, as they say: "Sorry to your wallet".
wink.gif



You've tempted me with your comments on the HD800s and T1s too, but I want to have more experience with my HD650s and K701s before deciding whether I need to move up further. I just bought some IE8s and have been very impressed with those too ....and then there are the JH-13s ..
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