[deadlylover]

 
but that's the problem man!
 
10 years ago if you had a mac, you're the cool kid.
It used to be THE premium machine for power users and professional work.
now they have to cater for the average user and it's crappy for us.

 
Yeah I do feel for the real pros, Apple with their endless pit of cash should really make an extra product line or two just to satisfy that niche market.....buuuut *inset something about diluting the brand/lineup*

 

[kaixax555]

I think this time round Microsoft is doing better when it comes to targeting niche markets

 

[PCheung]

 
Upgrading storage and RAM is something that 90%+ of PC users don't ever do during the course of the computer's lifetime*. And SSDs and RAM these days virtually lasts forever and probably won't even be in the top 5 things that break if a machine were to break. With laptops, it's usually the lid hinge, screen, HDD, OS or DC jack.
 
On one hand, soldered SSDs and RAM is nearly impossible to replace, but on the other, it enables more compact designs and increased security (e.g. the SSD can't be physically removed from the machine in order to extract data using another machine, and the RAM is basically impervious to a cold boot attack). It's a compromise.
 
*estimate based on data from me making that number up just now, sorry. It's just a guess, anyone want to make a better one?

 
Yep, I agree on that. The Hp dv7 I owned had the option to upgrade HDD and ram with easy access, but I never upgrade it. 

So I'm ok with the soldered SSDs and RAM as trade-off between slimmer, lighter design and service accessibility,
 
but looking at their heat sink and as the review told that the fan won't fully on unless the CPU is really really really hot,
I don't think it is good for those solder and battery also other parts. 

 

 
Yep, definitely, which is really unfortunate because they're so bloody expensive. But alas, there are enough rich stupid people who see Apple products as a status symbol that they'll keep buying the newest model every single year regardless of how good/bad it is.
 
Oh and hey another HKer on the thread! Welcome!!

 
My brother owned a MBP A1286, a year 2011 model I believe?
A nicely build machine and still working! I think Apple is Okay back then. 
 
Hi there! 

 

 

[PCheung]

Hi-res sales on mora.jp just started and the ChouCho ColleCtion "bouquet" is worth checking 
just bought myself a copy 

 
http://mora.jp/special/hirespriceoff_161201?fmid=TOPMAINV01#6

 

[NLNH]

 
Even though this is the Korean version, some parts totally sounds like Cantonese to me.
 

 
that's what i think... and the 10% off mac book lol, so jelly... you should install the nyancat bar 

 

[214324]

  Upgrading storage and RAM is something that 90%+ of PC users don't ever do during the course of the computer's lifetime*. And SSDs and RAM these days virtually lasts forever and probably won't even be in the top 5 things that break if a machine were to break. With laptops, it's usually the lid hinge, screen, HDD, OS or DC jack.
 
On one hand, soldered SSDs and RAM is nearly impossible to replace, but on the other, it enables more compact designs and increased security (e.g. the SSD can't be physically removed from the machine in order to extract data using another machine, and the RAM is basically impervious to a cold boot attack). It's a compromise.
 
*estimate based on data from me making that number up just now, sorry. It's just a guess, anyone want to make a better one?

Probably closer to 98%+.
 
It's mostly the compact designs because most of the attacks are digital rather than having physical access to the machine. The few ones that are physical and common (USB's that load keyloggers and etc. on) are really hard to prevent.
 
Although by compact I really mean fitting in a larger battery (VAIO's Z-Engine is a good example of how small laptop motherboards can get). There's little reason to go lower than 16mm-ish.
 

Have a friend who doesn't much about computers and bought a Mac for professional reasons. She's a bit sad about the performance because the marketing she's exposed to all nudged her towards the impression that Apple is the brand to go to for professional laptops.

They're powerful if you use everything within their ecosystem (ex. Final Cut Pro over Adobe Premier since Final Cut on macOS is optimized extremely well). They've never used very powerful GPUs. They're better off at CPU-heavy tasks.
 

I think this time round Microsoft is doing better when it comes to targeting niche markets

It's more of Apple is unwilling to embrace touch on macOS which I think is kind of strange because a lot of their stuff like application fullscreen and the Dock are fantastic for touch interfaces. They just need other elements to be scaled up for touch now.
 
Probably a good cross between GNOME 3 and macOS would yield a really good touch-friendly desktop OS.
 
Anyways Apple seems to be trying to separate video and photo work between the iPad Pro and MacBook Pro/iMac, or moreso they want people who draw/use a pencil to buy an iPad Pro to use along their Mac because the iPad Pro is really just a companion device unlike the Surface Pro 4 which is a full computer regardless of how much Apple wants to advertise it as a laptop (although the iPad Pro nor the Macs support AdobeRGB since DCI-P3 and AdobeRGB 1998 have a relatively small overlap...70% or so? Anyways since most print/photography is based around AdobeRGB it's an issue).

 

[Tangster]

Lol nobody uses Final Cut Pro unless they haven't got any other option. Even apple's internal marketing dept doesn't use FCP.
 
http://www.theverge.com/2015/12/13/10029498/apple-final-cut-pro-x-assistant-editor-job-adobe-premiere-avid

 

[214324]

Lol nobody uses Final Cut Pro unless they haven't got any other option. Even apple's internal marketing dept doesn't use FCP.

http://www.theverge.com/2015/12/13/10029498/apple-final-cut-pro-x-assistant-editor-job-adobe-premiere-avid

LOL

Some YouTubers do use it if they've invested heavily into the Apple ecosystem. I think MKBHD does although those numbers are really small compared to industry users.

 

[miceblue]

Upgrading storage and RAM is something that 90%+ of PC users don't ever do during the course of the computer's lifetime*. And SSDs and RAM these days virtually lasts forever and probably won't even be in the top 5 things that break if a machine were to break. With laptops, it's usually the lid hinge, screen, HDD, OS or DC jack.

On one hand, soldered SSDs and RAM is nearly impossible to replace, but on the other, it enables more compact designs and increased security (e.g. the SSD can't be physically removed from the machine in order to extract data using another machine, and the RAM is basically impervious to a cold boot attack). It's a compromise.

*estimate based on data from me making that number up just now, sorry. It's just a guess, anyone want to make a better one?

This. Most ALL MacBook Pros have 8 GB RAM installed. Why anyone would want to "upgrade" their RAM is beyond me. If you even think you'll need 16, in which most people don't, then you would have looked at other laptops from the get go.

Internal storage? Okay maybe? External HDDs are dirt cheap nowadays though, so that's really no excuse; literally on Amazon there's 1 TB HDDs that are less than $60, 5 TB ones less than $150. 512 GB internal SSD has served me well in the past 4 years. Sure, I would have liked more, but that's because I put stupid-large HD music files on my computer, and record with lossless FRAPS in Windows, but without those I'd be just fine, like 99.9% of people out there.



The reduced battery life of the new MacBook Pro seems really idiotic. I have a 4-year-old MacBook Pro (I bought it on Black Friday 2012), and it still gets 6+ hours of battery life. A brand new MacBook Pro getting less than that seems really, really non-Apple. That coupled with the touch strip seems really, really non-Apple. Steve Jobs would not have approved of the touch strip because of how un-ergonomic it is.

The new Trackpad seems really non-Apple too. I don't think anyone complained about the original Trackpad's size. I never liked their wireless Trackpad accessory and now they basically shove that in their laptop; why? Now you get a Trackpad that's so large that palm-rejection is a problem because there's no aluminum to rest your fingers/palm on. Thanks Apple.

 

[akiroz]

This. Most ALL MacBook Pros have 8 GB RAM installed. Why anyone would want to "upgrade" their RAM is beyond me. If you even think you'll need 16, in which most people don't, then you would have looked at other laptops from the get go.

 
I'm one of those people who thought I won't need 16.... now I'm regretting it.

 
Franz (chromium-based multi-chat client) - 3GB
Firefox - 1.3GB
linux + Gnome + basic system stuff - 0.7G
Thunderbird - 0.3G
Shinjiru (AniList client) - 0.3G
 
now I have just over 2GB for actual work, run a few java programs or a virtual machine and *boom*.

 

[214324]

This. Most ALL MacBook Pros have 8 GB RAM installed. Why anyone would want to "upgrade" their RAM is beyond me. If you even think you'll need 16, in which most people don't, then you would have looked at other laptops from the get go.

Internal storage? Okay maybe? External HDDs are dirt cheap nowadays though, so that's really no excuse; literally on Amazon there's 1 TB HDDs that are less than $60, 5 TB ones less than $150. 512 GB internal SSD has served me well in the past 4 years. Sure, I would have liked more, but that's because I put stupid-large HD music files on my computer, and record with lossless FRAPS in Windows, but without those I'd be just fine, like 99.9% of people out there.



The reduced battery life of the new MacBook Pro seems really idiotic. I have a 4-year-old MacBook Pro (I bought it on Black Friday 2012), and it still gets 6+ hours of battery life. A brand new MacBook Pro getting less than that seems really, really non-Apple. That coupled with the touch strip seems really, really non-Apple. Steve Jobs would not have approved of the touch strip because of how un-ergonomic it is.

The new Trackpad seems really non-Apple too. I don't think anyone complained about the original Trackpad's size. I never liked their wireless Trackpad accessory and now they basically shove that in their laptop; why? Now you get a Trackpad that's so large that palm-rejection is a problem because there's no aluminum to rest your fingers/palm on. Thanks Apple.

^
 
There are Thunderbolt ports on the device for a reason as well. And it's not like any laptop manufacturer has matched Apple in their SSD speeds either (2000 write 3000 read...I mean I guess Samsung is there but nobody uses the 960 Pro in laptops right now).
 
I blame Jonathan Ives for that one. Ives is obsessed with thinness (a little too much) and that's permeated all aspects of Apple design.
 
Yeah first thing I always hear about the trackpad is failed palm rejection.

 

[214324]

   
I'm one of those people who thought I won't need 16.... now I'm regretting it.

 
Franz (chromium-based multi-chat client) - 3GB
Firefox - 1.3GB
linux + Gnome + basic system stuff - 0.7G
Thunderbird - 0.3G
Shinjiru (AniList client) - 0.3G
 
now I have just over 2GB for actual work, run a few java programs or a virtual machine and *boom*.

I mean the MBP 13 isn't exactly meant to be a workhorse even though it has a Pro moniker.

 

[Tangster]

Wasn't the MBP 13 2012 pretty damned good for it's form factor (back in 2012) so long as you picked up an 8GB model? The new generation kinda suffers from bugs, some weird design decisions and much, much stiffer competition on the windows ultrabook side. All those together make the 2016 MBP look much more underwhelming and worse value than it really is (not that it isn't still poor value for money, the 13" less so than the 15" with touchbar models).

 

[miceblue]

Yeah first thing I always hear about the trackpad is failed palm rejection.

Seriously though, it's a freaking terrible idea.


That's where my palms rest on the 2012 MacBook Pro Retina Display; the red outline is where my palms would rest with the bigger Trackpad.

 

[214324]

It kind of feels like them trying to flaunt their Force Touch Trackpad and then having it backfire because you can't get a usable diving board trackpad that large since the clicking is so inconsistent from top to bottom (technically the discrepancy is more noticeable on smaller diving board trackpads so I guess diving board trackpads would actually be better if they were taller/larger).