[Sylean]

I don't have it yet, I only listened to it in the shop that I will buy it in. They're on their way

 

[Andykong]

i sort of hate Cayin a little now, could Red not have been available at launch.

Interesting, so you went from N6 to mobile phone + Mojo, and then go back to DAP again with N3, that's a very interesting path, will you feel a significant downgrade with N3?

 

[gLer]

Hi @Andykong. Can you shed some light on the aptX discussion. Doesn't seem that the N3 supports aptX reception, only transmission. Is that true?

 

[Andykong]

Just finished reading this entire thread (and the i5 thread AND the X5 iii thread) and I'm curious which would sound better - Spotify Premium direct from my iPhone 7 Plus or streamed via Bluetooth to N3 (iPhone doesn't support aptX). Thank you for your help!

That's a good question, and I have my own variants....

Which would sound better:
(1) Tidal direct from Samsung S7 Edge (exynos) versus streamed via Bluetooth to N3 (note that the S7 does support aptX, but I'm not sure how that impacts things)
(2) Tidal direct from Samsung S7 Edge + Zuperdac versus streamed via Bluetooth to N3

If you're just listening to 128-320k MP3s, you'll be just fine.

When I stream MP3 from my iPod to my Bluetooth 4.1 headphones, they sound no different than when hard wired to the same headphones. Lossless files are a different story.

Now, if you're asking about the N3 vs iphone 7, I can't answer that because I don't own either. But I can say that I would take a purpose-built high-res DAP over a cell phone any day of the week. In almost every case, the dedicated DAP is going to have better components, lower noise, more power, and superior features. But again, if you're only listening to 128k MP3, just save your $ as you're not going to benefit from a high-res player.

I have responded to the issue of iphone vs N3 back when N3 was first introduced, unfortunately the new HeadFi site has taken away the "search within thread" function, making is almost impossible to trace it back.

From digital decoding point of view, the iPhones are restricted to 24bit/48kHz (if I remember it right) while N3 has a much higher upper digital resolution, ceiling at 32Bit/384kHz.

For analogue output of iphone 6, please refer to the following link:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8554/the-iphone-6-review/11

We can compare the 33ohm rating of iphone 6 against the N3 specification:
Rated outupt: 26.39mW vs 130mW,
Dynamic range : 92.281 dB vs 108dB,

From technical point of view, the N3 should offer some advantages over the iphone and the different should be easily audible.

I am comparing the numbers and specification instead of audio impression as that can be subjective and I don't feel comfortable to comment on subjective issues of our "competitors", I shall leave this to our experience users.

 

[Andykong]

I wish I could get away with 1 card. In my xduoo X3, I have (1) 256GB with literally 30MB free, plus (1) 128GB that's about halfway filled up. It's really nice not having to swap around cards, which both increases the chance of card getting lost or damaged, but also prevents wear on the delicate microsd slot.

NOT having dual slots is the only thing keeping me from getting a different DAP. I'm hoping this is a feature we'll see a lot more of, because we're going to be waiting at least 2-3 years before 512GB microsd cards are an affordable reality. I mean, if a bottom feeder like xduoo can add dual slots to multiple DAPs, the big boys certainly can.

I believe the real challenge is coming from the file size of Hi-Res music, When the percentage of Hi-Res file is growing fast, the 256GB cards will run out of space a lot faster then you'll anticipated. My guess is, sooner or later, you'll need to swap cards even when you have two TF slots.

 

[Andykong]

I've had my N3 for a week now and it has exceeded my expectations by leaps and bounds. It's light years better than my Nexus 6. The Nexus 6 is thin in the low end and the upper mids and treble sound hard and brittle. Even with an EQ I just couldn't get it to sound good. On my Desktop I was using a Fulla which itself was much better than the Nexus 6 but still had limitations. In a brief N3 as a DAP vs. Fulla, the N3 wins. I plan to do a real comparison of the the N3 as a DAC vs. Fulla but my time is pretty limited.
What I'm totally amazed about is even with the Fulla, some of my Library wasn't very enjoyable. In Flames, Dark Tranquillity, Amon Amarth, some Opeth and Amorphis. Many of these aren't sonic gems by any means but on the N3 they have come to life in a way I haven't heard in before. The N3 has given them a drive and depth that I'm really digging. It's a great match for my Thinksound TS02 and Thinksound ON1.

Consider its price and size, the Schiit Fulla is a worthy little wander, it should be significantly better the the Nexus 6 unless you are using the original Apple earpod

The advantages of Fulla over N3 is much stronger current, so if you are using a planar headphone to compare these two , Fulla should win N3 headphone down. So it really is a matter of choice of music and headphone to certain extend.

Having said that. I have to say you got good ears. Cayin DAP are relatively more forgiven, N5, i5 and N3 shared similar sound signature, the major different are driving capability and sound quality issues such as resolution, sound stage and imaging.

 

[JaeYoon]

Hey Andy! I need to ask you, did you intend to make Cayin N3 sound very similar to i5
I really love how such a low price, you can get musicality of higher tier products. just missing Android extras

Consider its price and size, the Schiit Fulla is a worthy little wander, it should be significantly better the the Nexus 6 unless you are using the original Apple earpod

The advantages of Fulla over N3 is much stronger current, so if you are using a planar headphone to compare these two , Fulla should win N3 headphone down. So it really is a matter of choice of music and headphone to certain extend.

Having said that. I have to say you got good ears. Cayin DAP are relatively more forgiven, N5, i5 and N3 shared similar sound signature, the major different are driving capability and sound quality issues such as resolution, sound stage and imaging.

For me I have to try really hard to tell any difference between N5 and N3.

Considering I usually carry my DAPs outside, the difference is going to be none with all cars going around and external noise and loud people talking at cafe and shouting and screaming.

 

[minop]

Yo @Andykong, I saw on the Shanling M2S thread that the M2S is not supposed to support DSD over bluetooth.

With the N3 that has a similar hardware, does it have the same limitation?

 

[Andykong]

How does the Cayin N3 hold up against the xDuoo X10?

Before you all go crazy and shout out "why don't you just buy the Cayin N3 and the xDuoo X10 and compare them yourself", rest assured, I have done just that.

After having a FiiO X1 and wanting a little more, I bought a FiiO X5 on Amazon, but I never received it, so I got a refund and decided to .

Then the xDuoo X10 entered the scene.

Why I bought the xDuoo X10:
- The hype in Heaf-Fi. It was a giant killer. Or so they said.
- It has room for two memory cards (2 x micro SD cards).

Why did I buy the Cayin N3 if I had the xDuoo X10:
- The xDuoo X10 does not play gapless. This is kind of a end game for me, I cannot enjoy the music fully if albums that are gapless are not played that way.

So before I jump into the sound, some comments on both units:

xDuoo X10:

Pros:

- Good sound.
- 2 micro SD card slots.
- Optical out.
- Very solid design.​

Cons:

- No gapless playback.
- No cover art if image is in file tag (can be fixed with external image in folder).
- No equalizer.​

Cayin N3

Pros:

- Good sound.
- Gapless.
- Album art shows from file tag.
- A little bit smaller.
- Equalizer.​

Cons:

- No wheel (for selecting albums, songs, ...).
- Only 1 micro SD card slot.
- Custom charger connector (damn you Cayin!)
- Plastic and flimsy feel.​

On to the sound:

I have been switching units with the same earphones (TFZ series 5S) for the last hour and I cannot for the life of me find a difference in the sound. I can imagine everybody throwing their arms to the air and saying they are night and day, totally different soundstages, bla, bla, bla. But sorry. I cannot hear it.

To my ears, and this is my opinion: The Cayin N3 and the xDuoo X10 sound very similar, I can't say the same, but very close.

Later I will try and compare with the Sennheiser HD-6XX and see how well they can feed the 600 ohm headphones. And tomorrow I will try and bring the Sennheiser in ear momentums and the Kef M200 and give them another spin to see if with other phones I can get any other difference in sound.


Thoughts:

I can see myself happy with both, the lack of gapless playback in the xDuoo is kind of and end game, and the lack of an equalizer can be missed sometimes. But the user interface (the wheel) to quickly scan through a big number of folders or files is a better option than not to have one. Optical out is also a very nice option to have. The

As for the Cayin, it looks better designed (and not made by an engineering team like the xDuoo X10), but the custom connector (damn you Cayin) really bugs me. And the navigation for accessing your beloved music files over hundreds of folders can be a bit annoying. I must say the Cayin N3 looks more premium.

After using both digital audio players, I kind of miss the user interface from the FiiO X1.

After rereading all the verbal diareah I have writen, I notice there is very little on comparing the sound. I other posts you get comparasons of the Highs, Mids, Lows, Soundstage and music separation, etcetera. But as I have mentioned I cannot really hear that much difference.

I guess I will sell one of them,... still deciding on what one I will take home.

If you have any questions please ask. I will do my best to respond them.

I was also thinking of posting this same message on the xDuoo X10 thread, but I do not want to duplicate posts (unless a moderator sugests an alternative).

Thanks to all for reading me and have fun.

The momentum of Type-C connector is indeed slower then we expected. We expect it will become widely popularly once the mobile industry start to put the Type C connector into their product, we are still optimized for that but it does take longer hen anticipated.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C

If you don't hear the different between the two player, then just be happy and settle with whatever that suit your need. My advice to my customers are simple, if you don't hear it, don't pay for it. There is no point to pay for a more expensive product because "someone" has heard the different that don't bother you. On the other hand, I do encourage you to try out the X10 and N3 with more choice of earphones, bring both DAPs to headphone shops, that's the quickest way to explore the potential of these players.

 

[Andykong]

So i was in a crunch, my primary dap has something wrong with it, and isn't allowing me to utilize the shuffle option (preferred method of listening to my collection, as i sit on my arse, on my office chair)... Was utilizing an old smartphone, but wasn't too keen on the audio quality, so i was browsing head-fi (wallet was crying) for a secondary dap. The reviews seemed to be good, and hey its only $150!!

Navigating the ui is no issues, really like the physical buttons (added bonus while jamming while doing yard work)

Sound quality is good. I don't bother with eq settings on my primary, but found that if i'm listening to EDM, i need to utilize dance eq, for that punch on the low end. Otherwise rock, indie, folk, country, Bluegrass/jamgrass, all sounds good with no eqing.

I haven't tinkered any with the Bluetooth capabilities, yet.

I've only used iem's so far, and the spdif out for listening to my music, with my ht system...

Quite impressed, so far...

This is actually a very typical scenario with DAP, the Bluetooth is a new direction, and 80% standalone + 20% expanded setup (adding a portable amp or connect to desktop system) is what we have in mind when we set off to develop our N series DAP, so if you happen to fall into this scenario, there is a very good chance that you like our DAP.

 

[Andykong]

Hello, maybe anyone know how to use cayin n3 as an usb dac for Windows 10 , i just got the driver from cayin website but it doesn't recognize the N3 as a dac.
THANKS in advance

First of all, make sure you downloaded the correct USB Driver.
http://en.cayin.cn/download/show?id=13481

The USB-C to USB-A cable and Type-C to micro adapter are charging accessories, they cannot be used as for OTG or USB Audio application. Please acquire another cable/adapter when you connect a computer to N3 for USB DAC feature. We are surprised by the % of N3 users who might attempt to use the player as USB DAC, we might upgrade the USB-C cable in our next procurement exercise.

Last advice, the sequence to connect the N3 and the computer also matters, I'll suggest you connect the Type C to N3 first, power on the DAP, and then connect the USB cable to the computer. If you connect the cable first and then power up the N3, the connection cannot be established.

 

[Andykong]

Our US Distributor is giving away TWO Red N3:

http://www.musicteck.com/giveaway

If you are in the market to buy a N3 DAP, or thinking of buying a second N3 with a different color, that's your opportunity, check it out.

 

[BetterLate]

Got my red N3 Saturday. Listening with 1More triple and loving the sound! I've left it running full time with 1Mores attached and it seems to be opening up quite a bit (???). Sounds glorious with wide soundstage. Got my $6 USB-C to USB-B cable today and it's feeding my desktop rig no problem. Love this little guy!

 

[velasfloyd]

First of all, make sure you downloaded the correct USB Driver.
http://en.cayin.cn/download/show?id=13481

The USB-C to USB-A cable and Type-C to micro adapter are charging accessories, they cannot be used as for OTG or USB Audio application. Please acquire another cable/adapter when you connect a computer to N3 for USB DAC feature. We are surprised by the % of N3 users who might attempt to use the player as USB DAC, we might upgrade the USB-C cable in our next procurement exercise.

Last advice, the sequence to connect the N3 and the computer also matters, I'll suggest you connect the Type C to N3 first, power on the DAP, and then connect the USB cable to the computer. If you connect the cable first and then power up the N3, the connection cannot be established.

Didnt understand this point. So, if I want to use the N3 as a dac with my computer I need to purchase a cable? Which one? Someone has already bought it and can help me with this?

 

[Andykong]

Hi @Andykong. Can you shed some light on the aptX discussion. Doesn't seem that the N3 supports aptX reception, only transmission. Is that true?

In short, you are correct, N3 supports aptX on transmission only, we are working on reception part of the aptX and there is a possibility that we can add this through a subsequent firmware update. I wasn't aware of this until recently and will follow up with the discussion on the aptX topic in more detail.