[Mython]

No doubt we could continue to discuss this, back-&forth, for several pages, but, in the interests of getting the thread back on-topic, I'm going to step back from this side-discussion now.

 

[purk]

Lol whether you like it or not, this is how the world/business works. There will be a market for both AK and others.
It's not like the SQ for AK is poor, it is actually quite good. Whether they are worth the price or not is subjective.
HM901 is around the same price as 120, although they might sound better there are compromises such as poor battery life, brick size and their UI which AK does better. I don't see many complaining about the pricing for HM901 compared to the 120.

And these are businesses. They market for a wider global coverage to earn more revenue. It's only normal marketing strategy for businesses as to what they are doing. FiiO and iBasso should do the same IMO.

 
Why should they do the same?  They can sell less with more quantity and arrive at the same profit margin if not more, while building up their brands reputable image.  Pretty soon AK will be known for their pricing policy rather than the sound.   No one will complain much about the 901, b/c to most their price/performance is justify.  Yes, you make compromises on their design but you are getting a truly reference device with a true working line out.

 

[Don Lehrer]

Hm... I didnt know they are charity organizations. My wallet hasnt grown ears

LOL Charity organizations. 
 
 
Quote:

  Tough competion coming in the High-End market with the  CALYX M  and the Astell & Kern AK240, booth expected to be announced in & week at the CES
 
The Astell & Kern AK240 !  : In the February 2014 issue of The Absolute Sound there's an ad for the new Astell & Kern AK240.  There's not a lot of info so I'm hoping they'll show it at CES next month and.... that it has a true line-out...

 
More Charity organization´s raise funds projects?? Damn, I need to get my own Charity organization, otherwise I can´t fund my hobby

 

[Mython]

DX90 is said to contain 2 x ES9018-2M DAC chips.
 
I can't be absolutely certain of precise comparative scale, but here's an approximate Photoshop comparison, with mobile version of the DAC on the right, for anyone curious:
 
 

 

[CosmicHolyGhost]

Levanter, are you saying that ibasso and fiio should spend more money on marketing?
 
ibasso's flagship product DX100 speaks for itself for the sound quality alone and their various portable amps are all well received and love. They are a bit low profile and just quietly improving their products in the background. Fiio is keeping it modest by producing best bang for buck products and moving one tier up slowly only after they understand what the customers want. They have clear product philosophy. I am really impressed with their flagship portable amp E12DIY after the amp is burned in. If either of this company releases a high-priced product in the future, I will be sure to purchase to check it out myself.
 
I cannot say the same for AK.
 
 
 

 

[Levanter]

Why should they do the same?  They can sell less with more quantity and arrive at the same profit margin if not more, while building up their brands reputable image.  Pretty soon AK will be known for their pricing policy rather than the sound.   No one will complain much about the 901, b/c to most their price/performance is justify.  Yes, you make compromises on their design but you are getting a truly reference device with a true working line out.

Like I said, their pricing is up to them. If you don't like it you don't have to buy it or continue to flame them.
HN901 has price to performance only on SQ however with a 6+ hrs battery life, brick sized for a portable, lesser UI, build quality and storage.
While this might not be an issue for you, it is for some. Both caters to different segment.

I'm not defending any one company. I'm only being reasonable and rational. Pricing in audio industry is subjective but from what I've observed is full of biasness as well.

Anyway I think we have strayed from the thread topic enough. Soon a mod will clear out the previous posts

 

[Levanter]

Levanter, are you saying that ibasso and fiio should spend more money on marketing?

ibasso's flagship product DX100 speaks for itself for the sound quality alone and their various portable amps are all well received and love. They are a bit low profile and just quietly improving their products in the background. Fiio is keeping it modest by producing best bang for buck products and moving one tier up slowly only after they understand what the customers want. They have clear product philosophy. I am really impressed with their flagship portable amp E12DIY after the amp is burned in. If either of this company releases a high-priced product in the future, I will be sure to purchase to check it out myself.

I cannot say the same for AK.

Yes I want them to spend more on marketing. As a business I want to see them grow and earn more. And marketing is the best way to do it as what AK demonstrated. With growth their funds for r&d will increase and better quality products will be funded.
Even if they do produce best bang for buck, I'm curious to see what they will produce given a hefty budget.

 

[CosmicHolyGhost]

Yes I want them to spend more on marketing. As a business I want to see them grow and earn more. And marketing is the best way to do it as what AK demonstrated. With growth their funds for r&d will increase and better quality products will be funded.
Even if they do produce best bang for buck, I'm curious to see what they will produce given a hefty budget.

I agree to your point and it is up to them to decide. For one thing I am sure is that both of these companies have achieved way more than AK thus far.

 

[purk]

 
I agree to your point and it is up to them to decide. For one thing I am sure is that both of these companies have achieved way more than AK thus far.

Hopefully so. Thanks for an interesting discussion everyone.

 

[sardar17]

at least cater to india,the second most populous country in the world,,,it does make sense

 

[Retrias]

I don't think population count matters in being a sales target, eligible market is the one that counts the most

 

[sardar17]

  I don't think population count matters in being a sales target, eligible market is the one that counts the most

u can believe what u want but with 300 million middle class alone u will have a very very good market at least for products like x1,e07k,e11 etc.
 
agreed x5,x7 will be an overkill but ppl are buying note 3,iphone 5s without even thinking twice.all i am saying is fiio should release the budget stuff here through more distributors.high end stuff which costs more than 300-400$ won't sell,that much i know.
 
this thinking has led to the drowning of sony,htc,blackberry etc.
samsung is very wise to tap into the budget market and take over completely,sales number can compensate the lack of sales of highend product of the company.even nokia lumia 520 did the same.nokia is afloat thanks to lumia 520 only,its lumia 920,1020 haven't sold very well.

 

[Retrias]

I think thats for something mainstream like a phone , not exactly something niche like an audiophile player compared to say ipods or other apple product. Both samsung and apple have a larger ammount of people that knows and trust their branding , compared to them fiio is well... tiny and unknown. You can't compare both them , market base is not decided by the amount of population , if they are , india would be more attractive than say america, but the truth is they are not most company prefer to actually make a supply chain and find US distributor 

 

[sardar17]

  I think thats for something mainstream like a phone , not exactly something niche like an audiophile player compared to say ipods or other apple product. Both samsung and apple have a larger ammount of people that knows and trust their branding , compared to them fiio is well... tiny and unknown. You can't compare both them , market base is not decided by the amount of population , if they are , india would be more attractive than say america, but the truth is they are not most company prefer to actually make a supply chain and find US distributor 

 
all i am saying is if they have to grow they need to tap the developing market,everyone is doing that for a reason.
 
ppl have plenty of cash but there is nothing available,any indian here will confirm what i am saying.ppl are buying skullcandys for 70-80$,lol.same goes for sony xb90,xba-h1 because they are available as opposed to philips fidelio s1 or eph-100 which are not.
 
i am not even competing with eu or usa but ignoring a growing market is just not sensible enough,,it just is not.
i never said this before as the audiophile daps cost a lot and yes ppl are unwilling to spend 300-400$ here(generally speaking) but for the budget amps and players like x1 this will be an excellent market.
 
i will agree with u that higher end stuff will not work here(for the time being) but increasing distribution now will reap the benefits in say next 5 years,no harm in doing that.

 

[Sorensiim]

Yes I want them to spend more on marketing. As a business I want to see them grow and earn more. And marketing is the best way to do it as what AK demonstrated. With growth their funds for r&d will increase and better quality products will be funded.
Even if they do produce best bang for buck, I'm curious to see what they will produce given a hefty budget.

This reminds me of a story:
An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Greek village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellow fin tuna.
The American complimented the Greek on the quality of his fish and asked, “How long does it take to catch them?” The Greek replied: “Only a little while.”
The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Greek said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “But what do you do with the rest of your time?”
The Greek fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play cards with my friends, I have a full and busy life.”
The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat with the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats.
Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution.
You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Athens, then London and eventually New York where you will run your expanding enterprise.”
The Greek fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?” To which the American replied, “15-25 years.”
“But what then?” The American laughed and said that’s the best part. “When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions.”
“Millions … Then what?” The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play cards with your friends.”

Now can we PLEASE get back on topic and let Ibasso, Iriver, Fiio and Stax run their businesses as they see fit?