[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Hey. Is it possible to use OOYH or HeSuVi with Roon? Ive became a huge fan of binauarally recorded music and i really like spatial sudio/3d audio etc. What is the difference between OOYH and HeSuVi?

If i could wish my self two things:

1: a small portable device like Smyth Realiser A16 in pocket for and not coating more than 500 usd. That device should make your own music sound extremely convincing in regards of the "out of your head" feeling. Like a lot of the binauarally recorded albums.

2:That most artist also recorded their albums/music binaurally for all the people who use headphones/IEMs. It should be standardized!

What do u guys think? Is there a solution with Roon so i can enjoy my music with that kind of tech? Either hardware or software without coating an arm?

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Clearly any half-serious developer would have fixed a Windows 10 compatibility issue in a matter of days/weeks. Especially for a software that costs so much. Sorry but it's the truth. If Darin Fong can't find a way to make his software work with Windows 10, maybe he should seek external help and pay for it ?

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Hey. Is it possible to use OOYH or HeSuVi with Roon? Ive became a huge fan of binauarally recorded music and i really like spatial sudio/3d audio etc. What is the difference between OOYH and HeSuVi?

Why couldn't you ?
Roon is a music player.
HeSuVi is an Equalizer APO plug-in, and Equalizer APO is a system-wide equalizer. Hence HeSuVi should be compatible with Roon.
As for OOYH, it's seen as an audio interface, so Roon should see it in a list of audio interfaces and be able to output to it.

 

[edwardsean]

Well, I finally caved and tried out Apple Music's Spatial Audio.

I was attracted because I love the idea of engineers having Atmos at their disposal to mix tracks. I was resistant because the downside is that this means that each track has to be manually remixed. Even if takes hold, the chance of any significant portion of my library seeing the Atmos treatment is slim. It's like the situation with Hi-Res or Tidal Masters but much, much worse. (With those you don't need a top-flight engineer, and even the artist, to go back to release a higher sample rate or MQA version.)

Still, I try to listen to every piece of tech that attempts virtual surround, so I had to give it a spin. Well, let me cut to the chase: Yuck. No, that's too harsh. I mean: Ick. Okay, I'm being childish, but with good reason. The reason is that it's kinda gross.

I listened to their "made for spatial audio," "hits in spatial audio," and the one album that even won praise from critics: Norah Jones' "Come Away with Me." Reviewers said that it was this album that showed off the potential of Atmos over stereo. I don't know, give me the 2-channel mix.

You have to understand I wasn't using AirPods or whatever. I was running it through my $30K headphone system (Dave + Upscaler + Sean Jacobs power supply + Innuous Phoenix + Custom built server, etc. etc.). I've never hated the sound from this system.

Don't get me wrong I could not be more impressed with Atmos technology. I believe it is astonishing for what it does for movies. It's why I was mildly excited for Spatial Audio even against my reservations. But, this experience made me feel like we've made such little progress from the cheap, echoey, phasey, mushy messes of the early "3D" algorithms. If you ask me how did Spatial Audio sound? It sounded better than that but still results in that ilk of artificial, hollow imagery.

Anway... I'm writing this (ranting this) here because OOYH setup properly is just incomparably superior. The simplest way I can describe the difference is that Spatial Audio sounds fake. After all that effort, money, and brilliance it doesn't get closer to realism than 2.0. OOYH–if you get it right–sounds real. It is an actual audiophile tool and not a gimmick. It fits in my system and elevates it instead of degrading it. I also mean "real" in the sense that it achieves the goal of audiophile equipment to render a realistic reproduction. I know there are those who may feel that OOYH sounds fake, but it does require work to get it to sound right. There is really nothing to do with spatial audio but to turn it on.

Atmos still seems promising to me in theory, but so far, excepting more esoteric technology: BAACH, the most effective approach is still convolution like Realiser and OOYH.

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

OOYH–if you get it right–sounds real. [...] it does require work to get it to sound right.

Thanks for your insight. And what would you advise ? What work are you talking about exactly ?
I'm asking this for the day OOYH will offer full Win 10 compatibility, because that's a bummer right now.

 

[edwardsean]

Thanks for your insight. And what would you advise ? What work are you talking about exactly ?
I'm asking this for the day OOYH will offer full Win 10 compatibility, because that's a bummer right now.

I'm waiting on Win10 compatibility too. In the meanwhile I'm staving off Win updates though it's causing problems with other parts of my system. Luckily on the Mac side, OOYH works on the current builds without an update. Still, I'm not taking chances and I've stopped updating there too. Monterrey will really force a decision for me, but I am doing whatever I can to keep using OOYH.

As for "work," the essential effort goes into finding the preset that fits your HRTF and hearing. It takes time to test different presets properly allowing yourself to adjust to each one. One day, I still hope for my Realiser to be delivered and I can make a custom preset for Darin to convert.

Once you've settled on the preset, I find you still have to tune with good quality parametric EQ software. I've also found upscaling with HQPlayer to 768KHz–after–OOYH improves the OOYH processing along with the information on the source wav file.

From there, you do have to work on the level of system building. I thought as my gear improved I would find OOYH would become a bottleneck. Instead I found that the limiting factor was my gear. With each upgrade of the system OOYH's processing became more natural and precise. So, I've chosen and tested my components, hardware and software, with OOYH in the chain. I've treated it like any other component and factor it into the overall system synergy.

I love euphonic, romantic sounding gear, but I know that my OOYH preset is also adding some of that through the IR of sampled gear. So, I've shifted to more pristine, neutral sounding hardware/software. If I didn't do that I might blame OOYH entirely for sounding too soft and warm. If I were set on a very clean, bright preset I would do the opposite.

When I work on my system, whether adding a new piece, or tuning with cables, I listen with OOYH. For example I use Audeze Reveal with my Audeze headphones. I calibrate it with OOYH in the mix. If I set it without OOYH and then switched it on, it would sound off, and I would be tempted to think it was a problem with OOYH. I'm also using a complicated upmixing processing chain to send 2.0 into OOYH's surround speakers. It is amazingly effective.

This may just be common sense, but I initially thought of OOYH as an effect that gets put on top of my established system. I thought I could I just install it and dial in any preset I like. I had to shift into thinking of it rather as a component of the system. This has required my willingness to not just adjust OOYH to my system but to adapt my system to it. The effort has been truly well rewarded.

 

[audiohobbit]

good quality parametric EQ software

What software do you use here, freeware or paid?

 

[edwardsean]

What software do you use here, freeware or paid?

I have a raft of pro-level EQs. Fabfilter, Sonnox, Equilibrium may be a bit pricey, but are great. There was a cheap alternative Apqualizer that was very transparent and good quality, but I don't know if it's still around.

 

[mammal]

Anyone using macOS Big Sur? I am getting an error installing OOYH on it, something with legacy extensions no longer being supported or has the development of this amazing software (Realiser A16 replacement) stopped? Thanks

 

[edwardsean]

I’m using OOYH on Big Sur. It didn’t work and then with one of the updates, it started to work again. I’m on 11.3.1 and scared to move. I’m still not sure what I’m going to do once Monterey hits.

 

[Benny-x]

I'm waiting on Win10 compatibility too. In the meanwhile I'm staving off Win updates though it's causing problems with other parts of my system. Luckily on the Mac side, OOYH works on the current builds without an update. Still, I'm not taking chances and I've stopped updating there too. Monterrey will really force a decision for me, but I am doing whatever I can to keep using OOYH.

As for "work," the essential effort goes into finding the preset that fits your HRTF and hearing. It takes time to test different presets properly allowing yourself to adjust to each one. One day, I still hope for my Realiser to be delivered and I can make a custom preset for Darin to convert.

Once you've settled on the preset, I find you still have to tune with good quality parametric EQ software. I've also found upscaling with HQPlayer to 768KHz–after–OOYH improves the OOYH processing along with the information on the source wav file.

From there, you do have to work on the level of system building. I thought as my gear improved I would find OOYH would become a bottleneck. Instead I found that the limiting factor was my gear. With each upgrade of the system OOYH's processing became more natural and precise. So, I've chosen and tested my components, hardware and software, with OOYH in the chain. I've treated it like any other component and factor it into the overall system synergy.

I love euphonic, romantic sounding gear, but I know that my OOYH preset is also adding some of that through the IR of sampled gear. So, I've shifted to more pristine, neutral sounding hardware/software. If I didn't do that I might blame OOYH entirely for sounding too soft and warm. If I were set on a very clean, bright preset I would do the opposite.

When I work on my system, whether adding a new piece, or tuning with cables, I listen with OOYH. For example I use Audeze Reveal with my Audeze headphones. I calibrate it with OOYH in the mix. If I set it without OOYH and then switched it on, it would sound off, and I would be tempted to think it was a problem with OOYH. I'm also using a complicated upmixing processing chain to send 2.0 into OOYH's surround speakers. It is amazingly effective.

This may just be common sense, but I initially thought of OOYH as an effect that gets put on top of my established system. I thought I could I just install it and dial in any preset I like. I had to shift into thinking of it rather as a component of the system. This has required my willingness to not just adjust OOYH to my system but to adapt my system to it. The effort has been truly well rewarded.

What's your chain like?

I have Roon, HQPlayer, and OOYH, but I have never thought of how they could be connected together.

 

[edwardsean]

My hardware chain basically is: Custom server (+modified Farad LPS) > optical (+LPS1.2)> Innuos Phoenix>SRC-DX dual BNC> Chord Dave (Sean Jacobs PS)

My software chain is complex because of all the preprocessing/remastering I do. I use OOYH in that process. I take 44.1 wav files and run them through a matrix where I EQ, apply Reveal, upmix via Nugen to quad channel output to OOYH and then upscale to 768KHz. For the last part I used to use HQP-Pro, but now I’m on the new PGGB, which is just stellar.

I’ve become convinced that upscaling (via HQP, PGGB) the results of OOYH not only upscales the source file but also OOYH’s effect. I’ve been stunned by the results. Of course, you can only upscale/upsample after OOYH (48Khz), which is how I stumbled on to it.

I use preprocessing for all of it because that gets me around the noise generated by live processing. However, if you are willing to take the hit there is no reason you can’t do it live, as long as your computer can handle the load. You would need something like Rogue Amoeba’s Audio Hijack or Loopback, but I think you can also just set it up through free extensions like Soundflower or IShowU.

You would set Roon to output to OOYH then set OOYH to output to, e.g., IShowU, and then select IShowU as the input for HQPlayer and then output HQP to your DAC as normal.

It’s worth experimenting. Good luck!

 

[Benny-x]

It still kills me that the developer called it Pan Galactic Gargle Blaster.

That's cool to hear that you've got the DAVE, the real target of PGGB, and you've tested all these other combinations and you still ended up with PGGB.

I have a T+A DAC 8 DSD, so DSD512 is my delivery format.

That's for going into the details on the chain and recommending how I could swing it. I appreciate it

 

[edwardsean]

It still kills me that the developer called it Pan Galactic Gargle Blaster.

That's cool to hear that you've got the DAVE, the real target of PGGB, and you've tested all these other combinations and you still ended up with PGGB.

I have a T+A DAC 8 DSD, so DSD512 is my delivery format.

That's for going into the details on the chain and recommending how I could swing it. I appreciate it

Yeah for DSD especially, Jussi (HQP) really knows what’s he’s doing!

If you have time though PGGB does have a free trial. It really is out of this world, galaxy, even.

 

[Virtualizerman]

Has there been any news or progress on further development of OOYH? I hope Darin F. is doing well. Having used Hesuvi with the recommended Genelec preset from Mega Switcher's developer, I was very impressed. The trial I thought was very honest and I picked up on a few presets that I wouldn't mind paying for to support the developer, but it is not fully functional (crackle, hissing and pops because of latency due to OS changes) and apparently the Windows version has not been updated since 2017. The site is also a bit of a ramshackle affair as of 2021 and I wouldn't feel comfortable handing over payment information or other details through the portal at this point.

I understand with the events of the past few years things have been difficult for everybody and maybe things have changed entirely in some people's lives. I also hope that none of the brands associated with the various presets have seen fit to put a halt to the program for various reasons, because this is probably some of the best advertising available for big ticket items that most people will never even know of or be able to hear otherwise (though some may feel the presets don't do their products justice). If that is not the case, I think Darin could move to a more mass market approach and have the program added to Steam or other marketplaces once it is fully functional.

In any case, I'd like to thank the developer for contributing to the popularization of room-effect HRTF and the idea of speaker emulation which seems at this point to be superior to most of the generic output from most of the competing algorithms. Please allow it to continue if you are still able.