[Currawong]

I didn't like the controls on the 901. I wasn't joking that I had to use a thimble to turn the scroll wheel. 
 
I just read a comparison of the Lotoo PAW Gold with the RWAK240 in the Lotoo thread if anyone is reading this and hasn't been following that thread.
 
Shameless cross-post from the Hugo thread: 
 

Anyhow, a nice little New Year's story: I was browsing in a bookstore here killing time before a family lunch when I found that this month's copy of Stereo magazine here in Japan included a USB noise isolator. I hadn't gotten around to buying the Wyrd to try with the Hugo's USB so I bought it and decided to give it a run. I'm powering it using an Aurorasound USB Bus Power Pro and while it isn't dramatic, the sound does seem to be a tad smoother and more pleasant compared to using a cable direct to the Hugo itself.

 

[John Culter]

Hello everyone in 2015!
 
Just a short questions which I'm not able to find anywhere - is there in any of those flagship DAPs (AK240, HM-901, PAW Gold, Cowon P1, DX90.. etc) support for:
 
- computer DAC mode WITH COMPUTER ADJUSTABLE VOLUME? So I can use for example AK240 as my DAC for the Macbook Pro and have the computer system volume used (including the volume keys on the apple keyboard). Because it seems the volume controls are grayed out in OSX for most of the audiophile DACs.
 
- direct deletion of any files from the SD card? (not just the deletion from the playlist). 
 
- from all the youtube videos I just see, the UI of any DAP is kind of slow and not so responsible compared to iOS in iPod / iPhone. Only really fast operating seems to be the Lotoo. Is that true, or it is just my wrong feeling?
 
- why there is USB 2.0 on the all DAPs in 2014/2015? I went through the specs and only Lotoo supports USB 3.0, so you don't have to move out the SD card for fast transfer of the files.
 
- anyone tried to use audio recorder instead of the real DAP ?  They seems to have the file delete functions, UI are much faster and the recording function is a big plus (at least for me)... (Sony PCM-D100, Zoom H6, Tascam.. etc). 
 
Thanks for any feedback from the owners

 

[audionewbi]

Th only thing that lotoo paw offers is usb 3.0 at 90mb/s, the rest of what you look for lacks in paw gold.

I never use any my dap as usb dac but I do regularly change file in hence for me the trade of pays off.

 

[jono454]

Tried to run a search for the QLS QA360 but couldn't find much on this thread....
 
Anyone have any input on the QLS vs others in this thread?

 

[Mimouille]

Dear All,
 
Following a conversation I had on this thread, I decided to test a bit between some of my DAPS, namely my Ipod Classic 6th Gen, my RWAK240, my Cowon P1 and my HM901 Minibox card. I did not include the Tera because it only pairs well with the SE5 and it is a PITA to navigate in a test.
 
I spent roughly an hour doing this, using FLAC on all DAPs, except 256 VBR MP3 on the IPC. The two iems I used are Spiral Ears SE5 and Hidition NT6. I was very careful to do some volume matching, which was no so easy on the 901, and preferably with low volume, because this is often how I listen.
 
The results are quite simple: the differences are quite small. I doubt I could differentiate in a blind test. The most obvious was 901 vs. IPC, more crisp sound, but I am still not sure I could differentiate in a blind test.
 
The 901 is a bit more powerful than the others, and thus drives even iems with slightly more authority.
 
The 901 and P1 vs. the IPC have slightly better dynamic range.
 
The boutique all have very slightly better clarity, and a deeper soundstage (main difference overall).
 
The top performer is still is the 901, but by a very small margin.
 
As a side note, on my iems, I hear absolutely no difference between the balanced and unbalanced mode of my RWAK240.
 
Conclusion, if I had to rate sound, from this test I would say:
 
HM901 Minibox :95/100, Cowon and RWAK240: 93 and IPC : 90.
 
If I rate them by value (price vs. SQ and ergonomics) then IPC > Cowon P1 > HM901 > RWAK240 (HM901 is less ergonomic but much cheaper than RWAK240 and slightly better sounding).
 
I buy boutique DAPs also for other reasons than SQ, which is why I am not so shocked : capacity, getting out of itunes, and mostly just because I am a geek who likes new pretty and nicely sounding stuff.
 
People do not yell at me:

1. What I consider insignificant differences might be huge to you
2. I do not listen to "audiophile" music on HD or DSD. I just listen to music, so it might be different for you

 
It has been a while since I wanted to clear some gear....well I suppose the HM901 might go. I was waiting for the 901S but I do not like the look. I like the P1 and the 240 is nice looking to me, plus it pairs very well with the REF1.
 
But honestly if there was a 256GB Flac playing IPC, I might let them all go. And I might still buy the Lotoo because I like it

 

[jelt2359]

 

Nice comparison, thanks!

 

[eke2k6]

  Dear All,
 
 
People do not yell at me:
 

 
I ALWAYS KNEW I LIKED YOU!
 
 
I could barely believe my eyes when I read this. I had to read it twice. You've shocked me, Mim. Thanks for actually doing it.
 
Now imagine if you had used a more recent device. Every iphone and itouch since the 4th generation is improved over the iPC in amp and DAC quality.
 
If you want a FLAC playing iPod, get one of those 128gb iphones. There are apps in the store that allow you to play flac. Plus, I hear the phones have some pretty decent features.

 

[Mimouille]

   
I ALWAYS KNEW I LIKED YOU!
 
 
I could barely believe my eyes when I read this. I had to read it twice. You've shocked me, Mim. Thanks for actually doing it.
 
Now imagine if you had used a more recent device. Every iphone and itouch since the 4th generation is improved over the iPC in amp and DAC quality.
 
If you want a FLAC playing iPod, get one of those 128gb iphones. There are apps in the store that allow you to play flac. Plus, I hear the phones have some pretty decent features.

I'll stick to my DAPs as I still like them, but would only recommend the Cowon P1. I got it on sale so at 750 euros it is still good value. Plus I dislike iphones, because I am an Android User...and I like to have a separate DAP...otherwise I am sure my Oneplus One would sound good too!

 

[eke2k6]

  I'll stick to my DAPs as I still like them, but would only recommend the Cowon P1. I got it on sale so at 750 euros it is still good value. Plus I dislike iphones, because I am an Android User...and I like to have a separate DAP...otherwise I am sure my Oneplus One would sound good too!

 
A promise is a promise
 

   
 
.
 
Do me a favor, Mim. Head to an Apple store. I say Apple because they are the best selling phones on the market, and their phones are now virtually ubiquitous. Load up a song on one of your DAPs, then try to find it on Spotify (320kbps if you can) on the demo phones. Try to equalize the volume as best as you can, because many an audiophile has spent serious cash due to volume-induced differences. A/B the two using the same phones, then ask yourself if you think it's worth it or not. If you still do, I promise to leave you alone 

 

[T.R.A.N.C.E.]

I agree with Mims findings, especially when using iems, which are sensitive enough to not trouble a mobile phones amp, the differences in actual sound quality between a high end dap and a good mobile phone like IP are extremely minimal. Most people just hear the small sound sig difference between the devices rather than any quality difference, then the rest is their "mind" telling them one is better than the other, and mostly because of different bias' more than their actual preferences (which are influenced by bias lol).
 
Honestly I hate using anything apple though, makes me feel like a sheep/prisoner for some reason lol. So I'll just stick to my ZX1 for iems, and DX90 for slightly more demanding portable HP's which like the extra power. Plus I'm a tech head and enjoy buying stuff for the hell of it 

 

[Mimouille]

  I agree with Mims findings, especially when using iems, which are sensitive enough to not trouble a mobile phones amp, the differences in actual sound quality between a high end dap and a good mobile phone like IP are extremely minimal. Most people just hear the small sound sig difference between the devices rather than any quality difference, then the rest is their "mind" telling them one is better than the other, and mostly because of different bias' more than their actual preferences (which are influenced by bias lol).
 
Honestly I hate using anything apple though, makes me feel like a sheep/prisoner for some reason lol. So I'll just stick to my ZX1 for iems, and DX90 for slightly more demanding portable HP's which like the extra power. Plus I'm a tech head and enjoy buying stuff for the hell of it 

Thanks.
 
Yes to the bolded.

 

[Currawong]

 

1. I do not listen to "audiophile" music on HD or DSD. I just listen to music, so it might be different for you

 

 
Agreed too all that you wrote! The only thing I think is missing is an idea of roughly how loud you listen. I've always said that, other than for functionality, unless one wants to get the best out of high-quality recordings with high-end headphones or IEMs, the very expensive DAPs wont be worth it, unless you're doing something like buying an AK240 as a complete desktop/portable solution with all accessories. Also that the primary benefit of the better DAPs is that they drive full-sized headphones much better than, say, an X5 does -- vastly better in fact, and that's before we get into UI differences and storage.

 

[soundblast75]

I tokd you all way before anyone that P1 was great...
now i am telling you Calyx is even better..let see how long it will take..

 

[Mimouille]

Agreed too all that you wrote! The only thing I think is missing is an idea of roughly how loud you listen. I've always said that, other than for functionality, unless one wants to get the best out of high-quality recordings with high-end headphones or IEMs, the very expensive DAPs wont be worth it, unless you're doing something like buying an AK240 as a complete desktop/portable solution with all accessories. Also that the primary benefit of the better DAPs is that they drive full-sized headphones much better than, say, an X5 does -- vastly better in fact, and that's before we get into UI differences and storage.

I do not use full size headphones so that is one thing.
I listen at quite low volume, push it to average when outside. Since I listen to hundreds of new albums each year, only 5% of it exists in HD.

I would keep only the Cowon P1 if it wasn't for the fact that I like the look and feel of the AK240, it has huge storage.

 

[Mimouille]

I tokd you all way before anyone that P1 was great...
now i am telling you Calyx is even better..let see how long it will take..

Toooooo big.