[DairyProduce]

In this audiophile world which is impregnated with misleading reviews and impressions, I have seen too many false assertions.

If momentums can be called great or fantastic, please explain in detail in what sense they make you think so?

Then why should people pursue super expensive cans such as 009 and HE90? Simply because they are "different"? Isnt it because they are truly transparent?

My point is that momentums and monster beats undeniably have good looks, but their sound quality is equally undeniably bad. (Once again, bad means not transparent sounding.)

You can recommend these momentums from whatever angle: fashion, comfort, design etc. But please stop misleading people by claiming them fantastic sounding.

 
...I didn't claim they sounded fantastic, I never even said anything about the momentum's sound quality. I just said people may prefer different headphones.

 

[gzeminem]

...I didn't claim they sounded fantastic, I never even said anything about the momentum's sound quality. I just said people may prefer different headphones.

My comments were not targetting anything you said.

I can understand if someone changes his taste from 009 to LCD2. Although their sound signature are totally different, they are both very transparent phones hence both have good SQ.

but change from 009 to momentum is just too big.

 

[Lan647]

In this audiophile world which is impregnated with misleading reviews and impressions, I have seen too many false assertions.

If momentums can be called great or fantastic, please explain in detail in what sense they make you think so?

Then why should people pursue super expensive cans such as 009 and HE90? Simply because they are "different"? Isnt it because they are truly transparent?

My point is that momentums and monster beats undeniably have good looks, but their sound quality is equally undeniably bad. (Once again, bad means not transparent sounding.)

You can recommend these momentums from whatever angle: fashion, comfort, design etc. But please stop misleading people by claiming them fantastic sounding.

 
Then YOU stop misleading people by claiming the Momentum is not good sounding. We all have different tastes, but I dare you to find ONE person on head-fi that would agree objectively that the Momentum is "undeniably bad". 
 
A $350 headphone can't be great sounding just because a $5000 headphone is better? I've listened to the 009 and frankly, I don't find the Momentum bad sounding switching back to it. As you seem open to the idea of misleading reviews and impressions, you should be able to accept the fact that the $5000 SR-009 isn't ten times better sounding than the Momentum. In reality, in high-end hi-fi, you usually pay for those last details sound-wise to get closer to perfection. The SR-009 is a statement product (same goes with the HE-90) and STAX has priced them as such. The Momentum is an example of great sound at a consumer friendly price. 

 

[MacedonianHero]

k3003, JH13, 5way, just to name few, they are way more consistent with your 009 in terms of transparency and high resolution.

I clearly understood what your purpose is, it was you who did not bother to think what I really meant.

Had you only owned something like HD600, it would be more sensible that you could enjoy the muffled sound from the likes of momentum and monster beats.

Your analogy of top quality steak and good hamburger logically is not correct. As long as the ingredients used are fresh and properly cooked, they both can taste good. They are two types of food, there is no such thing as one food category is superior to another. Therefore you should have used $100 steak and $10 steak, it would make more sense.

Lack of transparency just ruins everything, like stale meat ruins the whole steak.

 
Again...why is it that mostly the newest members think they know everything? Obviously you have NOT read my review. Did you read the part about headphones and NOT IEMs? 

 Please go start your own thread that I'm sure no one will invest the time to read with your attitude.
 
Did you miss this:
 
"As over the years, my ears have worked less and less with IEMs (just sold my pair of fantastic Westone 4s for that reason)..."
 
Many don't like IEMs or their ears don't mesh well with them. So this is a search for portable headphones....you know on the go...like fast food hamburgers. Sheesh. Can I be more obvious?
 
I have the upmost respect for the JH13s, but this thread is about the search for a GOOD PAIR OF PORTABLE HEADPHONES!  The K3003s are simply overpriced mid-fi IEMs (and I'm being polite). Don't let price tag fool you. Costing more does not equal better. 

 
Did you miss the part about PORTABLE HEADPHONES? Nothing about the HD600s are portable...and if you took the time and looked at my profile, you'd see I owned the HD650s. Trust me son, I've been around the block many times in this hobby. Before you think of posting something else, please think about it first and the topic for discussion here: "PORTABLE HEADPHONES", not IEMs, or full sized open headphones that require a great source/dac/amplification to sound their best.
 
So please stop trolling on my thread.

 

[kyuuketsuki]

My comments were not targetting anything you said.

I can understand if someone changes his taste from 009 to LCD2. Although their sound signature are totally different, they are both very transparent phones hence both have good SQ.

but change from 009 to momentum is just too big.

 
If you can figure a way to make either the LCD2 or 009 into portable, I'm sure you'll become the most popular member here. However, considering how laughably unportable those are, they make literally 0 sense for connecting to your PMP. 
 
This is for portable use, specifically cirum/supra-aural headones (aka not IEMs). I'm sure one might enjoy the in-ear selection better. In fact every headphone you have been comparing to these portables are simply not that portable. 009, LCD2, HD6xx, almost ANY other orthodynamic are just not feasibly portable. If MacedonianHero enjoys these portable headphones for what they are designed for (portable use), then that is his prerogative. 
 
Believe it or not, people can like multiple headphones for multiple uses. One can love HD800 and 009 for home and enjoy M500, and M-100s for portable because that is their design, despite not being as technically or even perhaps sonically as good as their home set up.

 

[Lan647]

   
Again...why is it that mostly the newest members think they know everything? Obviously you have NOT read my review. Did you read the part about headphones and NOT IEMs? 

 Please go start your own thread that I'm sure no one will invest the time to read with your attitude.
 
Did you miss this:
 
"As over the years, my ears have worked less and less with IEMs (just sold my pair of fantastic Westone 4s for that reason)..."
 
I have the upmost respect for the JH13s, but this thread is about the search for a GOOD PAIR OF PORTABLE HEADPHONES!  The K3003s are simply overpriced mid-fi IEMs (and I'm being polite). Don't let price tag fool you. Costing more does not equal better. 

 
Did you miss the part about PORTABLE HEADPHONES? Nothing about the HD600s are portable...and if you took the time and looked at my profile, you'd see I owned the HD650s. Trust me son, I've been around the block many times in this hobby. Before you think of posting something else, please think about it first and the topic for discussion here: "PORTABLE HEADPHONES", not IEMs, or full sized open headphones that require a great source/dac/amplification to sound their best.
 
So please stop trolling on my thread.

 
Agreed on the K3003s, major overprice alert right there. 

 

[MacedonianHero]

   
If you can figure a way to make either the LCD2 or 009 into portable, I'm sure you'll become the most popular member here. However, considering how laughably unportable those are, they make literally 0 sense for connecting to your PMP. 
 
This is for portable use, specifically cirum/supra-aural headones (aka not IEMs). I'm sure one might enjoy the in-ear selection better. In fact every headphone you have been comparing to these portables are simply not that portable. 009, LCD2, HD6xx, almost ANY other orthodynamic are just not feasibly portable. If MacedonianHero enjoys these portable headphones for what they are designed for (portable use), then that is his prerogative. 
 
Believe it or not, people can like multiple headphones for multiple uses. One can love HD800 and 009 for home and enjoy M500, and M-100s for portable because that is their design, despite not being as technically or even perhaps sonically as good as their home set up.

 
You seem to understand the topic of this thread....wonder how some could miss it? 

 
Completely agreed on your last statement here too. 

 
Speaking of transparency and driver performance:
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/SennheiserMomentum.pdf
 
Some very impressive measurements....and the thoughts from the man himself:
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/innerfidelitys-wall-fame-full-size-sealed
 
They measure very, very well. And that's some OBJECTIVE evidence you can hang your hat on.

 

[gzeminem]

Then YOU stop misleading people by claiming the Momentum is not good sounding. We all have different tastes, but I dare you to find ONE person on head-fi that would agree objectively that the Momentum is "undeniably bad". 

A $350 headphone can't be great sounding just because a $5000 headphone is better? I've listened to the 009 and frankly, I don't find the Momentum bad sounding switching back to it. As you seem open to the idea of misleading reviews and impressions, you should be able to accept the fact that the $5000 SR-009 isn't ten times better sounding than the Momentum. In reality, in high-end hi-fi, you usually pay for those last details sound-wise to get closer to perfection. The SR-009 is a statement product (same goes with the HE-90) and STAX has priced them as such. The Momentum is an example of great sound at a consumer friendly price. 

Fair enough, I have no objection as to you holding your believes of "momentum is an example of great sound".

But please explain in what sense they sound great?

I have laid out my judgement criteria which is transparency. I have compared momentum more than 10 times with my t5p, t70p and k3003. I used Birdy, Emile Sande and WOW ost as sound source. My conclusion is that momentum has a muffled sound.

Please do not gloss over the term "great sound", otherwise you are just an perfect example of making misleading statements

 

[gzeminem]

If you can figure a way to make either the LCD2 or 009 into portable, I'm sure you'll become the most popular member here. However, considering how laughably unportable those are, they make literally 0 sense for connecting to your PMP. 

This is for portable use, specifically cirum/supra-aural headones (aka not IEMs). I'm sure one might enjoy the in-ear selection better. In fact every headphone you have been comparing to these portables are simply not that portable. 009, LCD2, HD6xx, almost ANY other orthodynamic are just not feasibly portable. If MacedonianHero enjoys these portable headphones for what they are designed for (portable use), then that is his prerogative. 

Believe it or not, people can like multiple headphones for multiple uses. One can love HD800 and 009 for home and enjoy M500, and M-100s for portable because that is their design, despite not being as technically or even perhaps sonically as good as their home set up.

I beg you to read my comments. I said it would make more sense if one who likes 009 recommend portables such as JH13, k3003 or 5ways.

Actually at momentum's price, w4r is much better

 

[kyuuketsuki]

I beg you to read my comments. I said it would make more sense if one who likes 009 recommend portables such as JH13, k3003 or 5ways.

Actually at momentum's price, w4r is much better

 
I beg you to read my post again. 
 

This is for portable use, specifically cirum/supra-aural headones (aka not IEMs). I'm sure one might enjoy the in-ear selection better. In fact every headphone you have been comparing to these portables are simply not that portable.

 
Some people prefer headphones to IEMs. Some people can't wear or stand putting things in their ears. Please reread the purpose of this thread and rethink posting here, since you clearly don't understand the point.

 

[MacedonianHero]

Fair enough, I have no objection as to you holding your believes of "momentum is an example of great sound".

But please explain in what sense they sound great?

I have laid out my judgement criteria which is transparency. I have compared momentum more than 10 times with my t5p, t70p and k3003. I used Birdy, Emile Sande and WOW ost as sound source. My conclusion is that momentum has a muffled sound.

Please do not gloss over the term "great sound", otherwise you are just an perfect example of making misleading statements

 
Yikes... t5p, t70p and K3003...sorry, we'll have to disagree here. Horrible treble, thin sound and far, far from transparent. 
 
My conclusion, those headphones have tin-like harsh treble that really hurts the recording. The Momentums mop the floor with them. And again, the K3003s are IEMs and not part of this discussion. The only good beyer Tesla headphone I've heard (and I've heard them all) are the T1s. The rest aren't worth 1/3rd the price IMHO.
 
And now you mention the W4R...are you grasping as straws with this other IEM? BTW, I used to own it for 2 years as I pointed out in my review (that you failed to read). And no, I would gladly take the Momentums over the W4s any day of the week (my ear issues with IEMs regardless).

 

[Lan647]

Fair enough, I have no objection as to you holding your believes of "momentum is an example of great sound".

But please explain in what sense they sound great?

I have laid out my judgement criteria which is transparency. I have compared momentum more than 10 times with my t5p, t70p and k3003. I used Birdy, Emile Sande and WOW ost as sound source. My conclusion is that momentum has a muffled sound.

Please do not gloss over the term "great sound", otherwise you are just an perfect example of making misleading statements

 
No offense, but anyone who actually KNOWS how real life sounds would agree with me that the K3003 doesn't do that justice. You use the t5p, t70p and K3003 for reference. I use STAX for reference. And the Momentum comes closer to the STAXes than those you mentioned do.

You think the Momentum sounds muffled, in my experience that's because it's darker and fleshier than what most "modern" hi-fi headphones tend to be. Those you mentioned are bright and thin sounding. A usual mistake among audiophiles is to confuse "bright" with "detailed" or in your case "transparent". 

When the sound comes close to real life, THAT's transparency. The Momentum is more honest than the T70p and K3003 in that case (haven't heard the T5p). The Momentum isn't perfect in any way, but for what it is (a small, closed headphone meant for on-the-go use) it delivers great sound. 

The Momentum sounds great to me in particular because it has a very natural sounding midrange. Smooth, clean (= not grainy or oddly colored) and open sounding. Compared, the K3003 sounds thin, hard and simply lacks presence. The Momentum really isn't that different from the LCD-2 actually, which I noticed you mentioned earlier. 

(Also by the way, if you are to truly judge the performance of a headphone to the max, you should use better recorded music than those mentioned)

 

[gelocks]

Well, although I don't fully agree with gzeminem's words, I didn't really liked the Momentums too much either. I felt that due to their warm signature and kind of "wonky" upper-mid characteristic they were just not that enjoyable. In fact, it's probably this upper-mid "veil" that makes them a bit, "muddy" as he mentions. This is probably why I preferred the KEF M500s over the Momentums. Even though those are also warm, mids were more forward, more energetic (probably a bit too much but that was Ok by me).
 
Now, regarding this whole "transparency" thing, I'll leave that to you guys with your hi-end gears to discuss. It seems that gzeminem is correlating a bright signature (and possibly "fake-ish" detail) with transparency, but if that's HIS preference, then good for him.
 
Just my .02 cents.

 

[palmfish]

k3003, JH13, 5way, just to name few, they are way more consistent with your 009 in terms of transparency and high resolution.

I clearly understood what your purpose is, it was you who did not bother to think what I really meant.

Had you only owned something like HD600, it would be more sensible that you could enjoy the muffled sound from the likes of momentum and monster beats.

Your analogy of top quality steak and good hamburger logically is not correct. As long as the ingredients used are fresh and properly cooked, they both can taste good. They are two types of food, there is no such thing as one food category is superior to another. Therefore you should have used $100 steak and $10 steak, it would make more sense.

Lack of transparency just ruins everything, like stale meat ruins the whole steak.

K3003 and JH13 are fine earphones, no doubt, but MacedonianHero clearly stated that he cannot listen to IEMs.

If your personal needs dont match the needs of the reviewer, you can feel free to ignore the reviewers opinion on the matter.

By the way, I love my HD800's, but when Im at work or traveling, my $5 Koss KSC75's please me very much. They are a terrific sounding headphone.

 

[waynes world]

By the way, I love my HD800's, but when Im at work or traveling, my $5 Koss KSC75's please me very much. They are a terrific sounding headphone.

 
Normally I would be asking you what you're smoking. But I have a pair of ksc75's and sportapro's that constantly astound me, so I know what you're smoking!