loquah said:

Hi all. I've finally jumped into the Schiit and bought a Gumby (secondhand) to upgrade from my X-Sabre. Having done some reading, I've started wondering if it's worth using a USB to coax/BNC converter. My normal setup is PC > ROON > Audioquest Jitterbug > Audioquest Coffee USB > DAC

Any recommendations?

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Just to throw out another option I use a Sonic Orbiter SE connected via optical running as a Roon endpoint.

I tried to contact them and have not got a response yet. Can anyone tell me if the gungnir multibit is out of stock in the US? Somebody said it was because they ran out of chassis but that was two weeks ago and the gungnir is still out of stock. How long will this continue? I considered switching to the yggydrasil. That is also on a three week backorder, but at least it gives a date.

I have been keeping an eye on the Gungnir for a few weeks and it has remained out of stock. That said, I emailed them a week or so back and asked if it would be shipped when they got more chassis in stock. The answer was yes, so I placed an order for a Gumby and will wait it out.
 
I received my Mjolnir 2 last Monday and had ordered it with LISST and tubes. I later found out they ran out of LISST and asked them to ship them separately. A few days later, my LISST shipped but the web site still says "Out of Stock" for those. I'm hoping the same will happen with the Gumby.

noobasauruswrex said:

  I have been keeping an eye on the Gungnir for a few weeks and it has remained out of stock. That said, I emailed them a week or so back and asked if it would be shipped when they got more chassis in stock. The answer was yes, so I placed an order for a Gumby and will wait it out.
 
I received my Mjolnir 2 last Monday and had ordered it with LISST and tubes. I later found out they ran out of LISST and asked them to ship them separately. A few days later, my LISST shipped but the web site still says "Out of Stock" for those. I'm hoping the same will happen with the Gumby.

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You will like the kit allot. Not sure what you are moving from, but it will be worth the wait. They pair perfectly.

I'm upgrading from a Valhalla 2/Bimby combo. Still using the bimby with the MJ2 for the moment.

What am I missing regarding the use of coax rather than USB for the Gumby? Schiit advertise how strong their Adapticlock technology is at managing timing errors / jitter and yet I'm reading how people are experiencing huge benefits with USB to coax bridges. Does that mean the Schiit USB interface is actually sub par? I read similar claims about the Matrix X-Sabre, but found zero difference when I tested it for myself...

loquah said:

  What am I missing regarding the use of coax rather than USB for the Gumby? Schiit advertise how strong their Adapticlock technology is at managing timing errors / jitter and yet I'm reading how people are experiencing huge benefits with USB to coax bridges. Does that mean the Schiit USB interface is actually sub par? I read similar claims about the Matrix X-Sabre, but found zero difference when I tested it for myself...

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The Adaptaclock circuitry is designed to benefit all Gumby inputs equally.  It is not exclusively for USB.  In my view, most of the USB problems are noise-related, and as of now we have a history of two USB upgrades.  SPDIF coax, AES EBU and TOS link is a far more mature medium than USB for digital audio transmission.  For that reason, there has been a history of 3 Schiit upgrades to USB.  There may be more in the future.

baldr said:

 
The Adaptaclock circuitry is designed to benefit all Gumby inputs equally.  It is not exclusively for USB.  In my view, most of the USB problems are noise-related, and as of now we have a history of two USB upgrades.  SPDIF coax, AES EBU and TOS link is a far more mature medium than USB for digital audio transmission.  For that reason, there has been a history of 3 Schiit upgrades to USB.  There may be more in the future.

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Thanks for the response, Baldr. Is it safe to assume from that response that you would recommend the use of a USB-SPDIF bridge with the Gumby for maximum quality or is it still one of those case-by-case situations?

loquah said:

   
Thanks for the response, Baldr. Is it safe to assume from that response that you would recommend the use of a USB-SPDIF bridge with the Gumby for maximum quality or is it still one of those case-by-case situations?

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Case by case -

loquah said:

Thanks for the response, Baldr. Is it safe to assume from that response that you would recommend the use of a USB-SPDIF bridge with the Gumby for maximum quality or is it still one of those case-by-case situations?

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As has been suggested elsewhere, the cheapest way to work around USB limitations is to turn it off and use something else. For instance, you could use a PCI card with SPDIF out on your desktop computer, if you have one. For Toslink, a quality, inexpensive glass cable like Lifatec should be considered. Another way is to use a network streamer, and the cheapest of 'em out there would be the RPi & Digi+, which will output SPDIF. The latter is a self-contained device, with an OS optimized for one thing: move the audio bits in a timely manner and with as little fuss as possible from your data storage device to your DAC. It's cheaper, but requires some manual fiddling to setup. If you're an impatient type, then something like Auralic Aries Mini or Sonicorbiter SE would fit the bill as well.
 
BTW, some feel that even a Wet String would be superior to USB for transmitting audio bits...

landroni said:

 
As has been suggested elsewhere, the cheapest way to work around USB limitations is to turn it off and use something else. For instance, you could use a PCI card with SPDIF out on your desktop computer, if you have one. For Toslink, a quality, inexpensive glass cable like Lifatec should be considered. Another way is to use a network streamer, and the cheapest of 'em out there would be the RPi & Digi+, which will output SPDIF. The latter is a self-contained device, with an OS optimized for one thing: move the audio bits in a timely manner and with as little fuss as possible from your data storage device to your DAC. It's cheaper, but requires some manual fiddling to setup. If you're an impatient type, then something like Auralic Aries Mini or Sonicorbiter SE would fit the bill as well.
 
BTW, some feel that even a Wet String would be superior to USB for transmitting audio bits...

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Thanks for the post, landroni. The only problem is that different implementations of the various receivers can result in USB out-performing SPDIF on some DACs if they emphasised USB circuitry over SPDIF circuitry. I guess, in the end, I'll let my ears decide.
 
I like the idea of a RPi, but it's not convenient with the way I have my setup via my laptop which goes everywhere with me and contains / manages all my tunes (although I could, perhaps run Roon as a receiver on the RPi or something similar...)

loquah said:

 
 
The only problem is that different implementations of the various receivers can result in USB out-performing SPDIF on some DACs if they emphasised USB circuitry over SPDIF circuitry. 
 

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As Mike has hinted above, most problems associated with USB seem to be noise related. Eliminating USB noise is an uphill battle, not least because USB galvanic isolation can be ludicrously expensive. And USB cables themselves may always generate analog noise when passing on data; this is what would explain that performance may improve when cleaning up the connectors. Last, USB transceivers are generic devices: they're for printing, copying data and ordering pizza --- you can think of them as a miniature SoC, and as such are themselves prolific noise-generators, whichever the specific implementation. (Recall that DACs got externalized partly to isolate them from the noise present inside computers.)
 
SPDIF transports, on the other hand, are (somewhat) primitive and are designed for one thing and one thing only: streaming audio bits. For Coax, galvanic isolation is relatively cheap and part of the spec (not that all manufacturers follow it to the letter). Whereas for Optical, electric noise is a non-issue to start with. Some will point out that optical can induce performance degrading jitter, and while this was indeed a reality in the tech's beginning, it seems less of an issue nowadays especially if you use a quality glass cable like the Lifatec (which way exceeds the speeds needed for high-res audio).
 
So all things being equal, you're more likely to be confronted with implementation issues in USB (some which can hardly be overcome at all) than with SPDIF, especially if you're considering ~$1K devices.
Then there is the pro AES/EBU protocol (which SPDIF is based upon), and reports seem to be consistent that it performs sonically better than the above three. If AES/EBU is an option, it's definitely worth a try, though streamers with AES/EBU like Auralic Aries or Rednet 3 are unnecessarily expensive, so kind of an overkill for something like a Gungnir MB...
 

I guess, in the end, I'll let my ears decide.

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Indeed. Many things may depend on the actual setup, cables, etc.

So my new (secondhand) Gumby arrived this morning and I've swapped out the X-Sabre and swapped in the Gumby. I have to say that the improvements so far (I'm not even halfway through a single album) are only incremental. I'll do a bit of A/B comparison later, but I'm surprised that the leap isn't as great as I hoped. This also gives me confidence that the X-Sabre actually is as good as I thought it was. Sure, the Gumby is better, but it's not the leagues better I was expecting after reading some of the reviews and hype. This book is still open though so I reserve the right to do a complete about face if the limiting factor at the moment is the album I'm listening to (Gregory Porter - Liquid Spirit).
 
By the way, does the Gumby get better after being left on / warming up? This one hasn't been used since at least Monday I'd say so would / could that make any difference?

Leave it on all the time if possible, yes it gets better after several hours of warming up. I hope you enjoy it! 

loquah said:

  By the way, does the Gumby get better after being left on / warming up? This one hasn't been used since at least Monday I'd say so would / could that make any difference?

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Warming it up is recommended (and keeping it continuously on), though for a used item this should be a (much) quicker process and not take more than a day.
 
Otherwise, amp and transducers might also be a weak link in the chain. Schiit's latest Jotunheim is starting to be considered by some as Schiit's statement amp, at 400$, with good transparency particularly suited to show users how their DACs actually sound like. (Though impressions trickling in are still initial.)
As for transducers, many suggest that Schiit's 3D holographic imaging becomes obvious in speaker set-ups. Also, I tried the NightHawks once and they showed very poor synergy with my amp; not sure if this is something that might be going on here, but the HD650 is reported by many to scale up with TOTL amps and remains largely inexpensive.
 
Hope you enjoy your Gumby!