[Randy]

I have noticed that a lot of folks spend some serious money on headphones and amps and only use I-Pods or Mp3 players for source material. It seems like a waste of money to me if you aren't going to get the best source possible. The compression that takes place with those players in my opinion sounds awful. Just my two cents.

 

[ShadowVlican]

what you say is true, though i doubt there are many people doing that HERE at headfi

 

[Hi-Finthen]

I prefer to think most sources arn't lousy... In fact they are a relatively good beginning of a system which then quickly begins an upgrade spiral to deminishing returns . I think most sources are "Good" enough (although there is seemingly always better) and the greatest impact to the presentation of a given source is the one unit consisting of amp/headphone which NEEDS to be well matched for their maximum potential of delivering enjoyment of the music chosen to be played by any source. Perhaps a more balanced proportion would be better is a fair statement to be made. However, I know alot can be accomplished focusing on amp/phone & their synergy and the money spent there($1000) with even lower end sources @ $200-$300.... That is very enjoyable until a source upgrade of perhaps another $500-$600 (DAC) can later be added.

 

[luckybaer]

I'm guilty.

j/k

I'll never spend a lot on a source. I listen mostly at my PC, so I did what I thought was a good use of money: I bought a DAC.

 

[mirumu]

I agree with the OP. Compression is optional on many of these players but there's no denying the quality of the output circuitry is not ideal. In my case I use them but mostly for portability, at home I've been using a standalone CD player but it's still not that great in the scale of things. The reason is because I can't upgrade my whole system in one foul swoop but a source upgrade is definitely in line for the future. I think for me a good DAC is what I need considering I have multiple devices suitable as transports. Makes me wonder how many others are in this situation where they just haven't got around to a source upgrade yet.

 

[cmirza]

Depends on what kind of compression you're using really. An iPod has a quite good DAC on it and if you're running at least something like LAME v2 compression or higher, you'll encouter a bad recording more often then you will compression artifacts. I haven't even felt compression being a problem until I reached the $300+ headphone bracket. At that point you really have to take a look at the source in your chain and make sure you're using lossless audio.

 

[mchang]

I submit my TV setup at home for comparison and reference:
I have a 42" plasma EDTV (step below HD, but hard to tell) with a OTA HD tuner, surround 5.1 speakers, blah blah blah. I choose to plug in a standard non-HD TiVo and watch a picture compressed and stretched.

Why?

Convenience. I much rather watch any TV -- even sports -- that I can skip commercials, watch whenever and save for later.

I feel the same way about my iPod. It syncs with my iTunes (duh), which also networked to my two TiVos, wife's laptop and two other family iPods. The iPod is small, holds a ton of music, works great, plays podcasts, etc. And I can watch videos and TV shows (that I record using EyeTV on Mac) anytime I'm stuck somewhere.

Honestly, if I had to choose between (A) iPod and earbuds or (B) non-iPod player with my amp and cans, I'd choose A every time. I'll probably be buried with a Generation 32 iPod.

Oh, and I'd buy an HD TiVo if I could stop upgrading my audio!

 

[nikongod]

in terms of source, i have a hard time hearing the differences between high grade mp3, and cd. naturally, this is mp3 played through a dedicated standalone dac, and the cd the same...

comparing mp3 from the pitiful portable picnic player direct to the dac (or the cd players on board dac) is a horror show. the mp3 players dac is a sad joke.

 

[smeggy]

Just to rock the boat a little, I'll go out on a limb and say I'd rather have great cans and an average source than great source and average cans. Reason being that while having a great source can maximise average cans, they'll never be more than average cans. I used to be a follower of the 'source first' way of thinking until I realised that it usually sounded like crap.

I don't suggest or advocate a massively unbalanced system, but I can be very happy running my staxes from my Rio Karma. You may not get the maximum from that setup but the Stax magic sill shows through. Given a finite level of resources I know I will always dollop down a hefty portion on the Phones if they sound good enough because for people like me, a great sound signature is more important than any other consideration. I can always upgrade the front end stuff as funds allow, in the meantime I'm assured of the signature I like.

 

[EFN]

What's your definition of lousy source? just because it is compressed doesn't mean that it have to be lousy.

I admit that most MP3s and WMAs encoded below 225kbps and encoded poorly sounded lousy. But anything above 225 and 320 encoded properly with LAME, Nero AAC or Ogg encoders are trully good that most have decided to use them exclusively to replace CDP. And that's not even touching lossless FLAC and ALAC yet.

With DAPs like RIO Karma, iAudio X5 Rockboxed, iRiver HSeries Rockboxed, iMod iPod - Hi Fidelity on a smaller scale is trully achievable. Specially now that we have DAPs with storage above 20GB which means that it is quite possible to construct lossless jukebox that's trully portable.

Legions of Head-Fiers using lossy/lossless digital source couldn't be wrong no?

 

[feh1325]

that was one of the things i advocated at ilounge headphone forums...but they were a bit rude...so i left

 

[Lad27]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikongod /img/forum/go_quote.gif in terms of source, i have a hard time hearing the differences between high grade mp3, and cd. naturally, this is mp3 played through a dedicated standalone dac, and the cd the same...

Same here, just adding that my MP3 DAP is connected to DAC via optical rather than line out.

 

[Jon L]

There is endless debate regarding the relative importance of source vs. preamp vs. amp vs. transducers.

Basically and unfortunately, you can't skimp on ANY of them for outstanding sound b/c problems in any one will ruin the music.

But my personal experience is that the transducer is the most vulnerable and frail and needs most effort to get half-way correct. Just compare frequency response and distortion curves for say a CDP vs. speakers(headphones). It ain't pretty..

 

[adhoc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowVlican /img/forum/go_quote.gif what you say is true, though i doubt there are many people doing that HERE at headfi

Headphone upgrades change the sound signature.

Source upgrades change the sound quality.

Two completely different beasts IMO.

 

[Duggeh]

Audigy 2ZS -> Stax SRM-717 -> Stax Omega 2

Meridian G08 -> CMOY -> PX100


One of those is my rig. Headphones make the biggest difference to the sound, work down the chain backwards. So long as the source isnt an old tape player that is.