[Deolum]

I feel like in terms of headphones the aspect of price/performance falls way to short and nobody talks about it. Why?

Having heard quite a bit of headphones and possessed a few now i noticed that price and performance do absolutely not correlate at all.

I'm very curious what you think which headphones differ the most with what they offer from their price. To both sides.


For me the biggest diffs are:

better:

Sennheiser HD600 - costs 300 but could cost 2k+

Denon AH-D9200 - costs 1,5 k but could cost 2-3k

AKG K701 - costs 100 but could cost 300

AKG K371 - costs 100 but could cost 200


worse:

AKG K812 - costs 800 but is more like 300

Grado GS1000e - costs 1000 but is more like 300-400

AKG K872- costs 1000 but is more like 50



What's your experience?

 

[ThanatosVI]

It isn't talked much about it, because it is pretty clear that higher end audio products come with huge "dimnishing returns".
That means that usually the cheaper product has almost always the better price/performance ratio, while the absolute quality of the higher priced product usually is superior.

This also Held true throughout my own journey from 300€ Hifiman He400 to 3000€ Meze Empyrean.

Noteable price Performance monsters from my experience are
Sub 500€: Hifiman Sundara
Sub 1000€: LCD-2C
Sub 2000€: Hifiman Arya

 

[Eldair]

Im so with you that all 6 series should be like 1000€

 

[loopfreak]

For sake of the discussion I would say Focal Elear/Elex combo is representative sample of price performance ratio game.

Comfort is solid, you can easily EQ Elear's dip and mid bass bump when you need to, Elex needs no EQ and it's pretty much different sounding from Elear so "they" don't step on each other's toe. They really scale very good while not getting offended with modest amp/dacs.

In comparison to a wild headphone sector, downstream equipment has really hit unbelievable price/performance ratio but the drivers are still in some kind of weird voodoo/pixie dust development phase.

When someone reviews a 2k 'phone and says it's worth the price, it's only applicable when compared to an equally or more overpriced headphone. If they are compared to some of the budget champions they fall apart completely.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

I feel like in terms of headphones the aspect of price/performance falls way to short and nobody talks about it. Why?

Having heard quite a bit of headphones and possessed a few now i noticed that price and performance do absolutely not correlate at all.

I'm very curious what you think which headphones differ the most with what they offer from their price. To both sides.


For me the biggest diffs are:

better:

Sennheiser HD600 - costs 300 but could cost 2k+

Denon AH-D9200 - costs 1,5 k but could cost 2-3k

AKG K701 - costs 100 but could cost 300

AKG K371 - costs 100 but could cost 200


worse:

AKG K812 - costs 800 but is more like 300

Grado GS1000e - costs 1000 but is more like 300-400

AKG K872- costs 1000 but is more like 50



What's your experience?

I agree with you and I think many people agree with you. Probably nobody talks about it because we all agree.

BTW @ThanatosVI if I understand the discussion is not about diminishing returns. It is about the poor correlation between price and how good the headphones sound.

 

[amoeba1126]

I agree with you and I think many people agree with you. Probably nobody talks about it because we all agree.

BTW @ThanatosVI if I understand the discussion is not about diminishing returns. It is about the poor correlation between price and how good the headphones sound.

Problem with that argument is that how good headphones sound is entirely subjective. Take the HD800 for example. They ran what... a grand and half? Super big and accurate sound stage, incredibly fast and accurate, and I absolutely abhor the way they sound. By my preferences, the treble hurts my ears and they are completely bass anemic and I wouldn't pay more than $200 for them. You can make a similar argument about the old Hifiman planars; sound incredible when properly driven but that means you had to have a quality amp, which was another few hundred bucks back then. If you had a good amp already, their value was phenomenal. If you also had to buy an amp to properly use them, then all of a sudden not such good value.

 

[loopfreak]

Even if the subjectivity definitely plays a big role in this hobby there are still some points that we can all agree.

If we look at the scores which are for example impressions threads after the hype, we could see that every headphone which is intended for a "mass market" but lives only inside isolated isolated buble should be undoubtedly considered as a poor price/performance value.

As hd 800 s in my case, which is tonality whore and genre specific or planars that need power house behind with impedance more suitable for a speaker.

 

[Hondadude85]

HD6XX, cost $220 - but with the right setup sounds just as good as any dynamic I’ve ever heard.

 

[SilverEars]

Problem with that argument is that how good headphones sound is entirely subjective. Take the HD800 for example. They ran what... a grand and half? Super big and accurate sound stage, incredibly fast and accurate, and I absolutely abhor the way they sound. By my preferences, the treble hurts my ears and they are completely bass anemic and I wouldn't pay more than $200 for them. You can make a similar argument about the old Hifiman planars; sound incredible when properly driven but that means you had to have a quality amp, which was another few hundred bucks back then. If you had a good amp already, their value was phenomenal. If you also had to buy an amp to properly use them, then all of a sudden not such good value.

Sounds like the nonsensicsl audiophile kingdom. Lol. Looking back at some of the products hyped, and failures. Is this seriously 'audiophile?' Kinda embarassing really.

 

[A Jedi]

If the really high end speakers of the world had the issues that the really high end cans do, they would be laughed right out of the market. The fact that top tier cans require living with certain deficiencies is a joke. For budget stuff, sure, it makes sense. But spending $3000+ and not having it all is a rip-off.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Snake oil is sold at every level of the market and in every market. Some laugh, some cry, some take the money and run

 

[Malevolent]

Snake oil is sold at every level of the market and in every market. Some laugh, some cry, some take the money and run

Some take the money to make even more exotic snake oil...

 

[gooeyrich]

These guys always talk about it:

https://www.youtube.com/c/JoshuaValour/videos

https://www.youtube.com/c/DMS3TV/videos

 

[cycloverid]

Having just done a 3-way sub $1000 shootout between the Sundara ($350), LCD-GX($700 open box), and DT1990 ($525), the Sundara edged out the other 2 for the best all around headphone for me. It's even a little disappointing that I was willing to spend more for the best within this price bracket, but felt like the Sundara did everything so well and even better in a couple categories that I preferred them.

Honestly, the DT1990 was fairly disappointing given the price point and was bested in most ways to me. The sub bass performance is handily beaten by the Sundara (EQ makes this extremely obvious) and the tonality I prefer much more on the Sundara. I couldn't totally eliminate sibilance with EQ and nothing stood out as outstanding on the DT1990. If I was more into competitive gaming and had to have pin-point imaging, this seems to be the only real deciding factor.

The LCD-GX and Sundara were much more evenly matched. But, the tonality is definitely better to me on the Sundara (the GX sounds a bit dull and lacks air in comparison) and the comfort is much better on the Sundara. The deal breaker was the GX had a weight that felt like long term would be an issue.

While this obviously isn't totally conclusive, I think with a bit of sub bass EQ the Sundara is so good at doing everything well that I think I've found my sub $1000 headphone for the time being. The Sundara looks a bit cheaper than the other two, but the performance is just too solid at this price point. This is an incredible savings for me and I'm somewhat shocked at this outcome.


Other considerations:

1. I could have maybe tried the Ananda, but based on the reviews I've read it feels like I would come away with a similar feeling (trading comfort and slam for refinement).
2. The Elex was dropped from my list as I think people are overlooking pad maintenance when factoring in price/performance (Clear pads are somewhere between $150-200 for a pair - is there even an alternative given the Mass Drop pad failure situation?). If you're spending this kind of money on a headphone, I think you should keep the pads in top condition for the best sound quality - and the price to do this is absurdly high.

 

[Tachyon88]

I went from the hd6xx to the lcd2c and thought "400-600 dollars more for this ?". In the end I like my hd6xx more.

I think most headphones besides some boutique lines should not cost over 1k. I own the hd800s and really enjoy it, but I do not think its worth over 1k. Id price it at $800 new.

Kinda irks me when people like a headphone so much and say "id happily pay more" and or its "worth more".......I get you probably wouldn't and you're referecning the more expensive competition, but dont say that !! lol