[Prog Rock Man]

 
Quote:

However, I do see a lot of what you say demonstrated here, in addition to a personal need to prove the cables void of benefit since they cannot be afforded.
 
Wow!  Something new has been added to the list of negative reasoning, affordability.
 

 
I can't afford it, therefore you can't have it.
 

Your desire to control and manipulate means you are seriously scraping the bottom of the barrel now. This gets ridiculous when people cannot even pass comment and disagree with the pricing of headphone cables without an exaggerated and misrepresented nasty comment.

 

[beeman458]

Of course I can afford $625 for a set of cables for my HD800, but why would I do that?
 
You wouldn't.  Now, what about others?  Just because you can't hear a difference, you think nobody else should be able to spend what ever they want?
 
As I pointed out earlier, I really don't think anyone in this world would buy $200,000 tyres for their $400,000 Ferraris even if they could afford them.
 
If people will pay a hundred million dollars for a boat, who knows what a person will pay for a set of Ferrari tires.  You say it's not about money yet you bring up money as a complaint and then say you can afford to pay for the cables.  And then you write that Sennheiser is replacing the cables for no charge.  Where's the grind?
 
Your example is nothing more than a red herring with no substance and yet you push as if it's rational yet you won't let cables guys alone as in stalking.  Dude wants to buy cables, let them.  You guys keep pushing and pushing and pushing with your examples and people continue to write how happy they are with their cables.  Must be really hard knowing there are so many happy cable people in the world.
 
Yes, there's a whole lot more under the covers of those who qualify as anti-cable.  If it's not one straw man argument, it's another.  While the anti-cable guys have their bogus tests to keep them warm at night while listening to their music, we have our cables.  Seems like a fair trade.
 

 

[Danz03]

 
I've already pointed out in my earlier posts that I'm not anti anything. I mean the Sennheiser cables are quite expensive but then if one needs them, he'd just have to buy them. Now these aftermarket cables, if they were balanced cables, I would at least be able to understand why they were expensive, because at least they are special, even Sennheiser don't make them. But these $625 ones I saw were unbablanced cables and they looked even more flimsy than the Sennheiser stock cables. I actually asked the shop why they were so expensive and what can they actually do for my HD800s, but they couldn't even tell me. So I thought the pro-cable people here would be able to give an answer, but instead, the only comments so far had been like : "fxxk off if you're not buying!", so there doesn't seem to be any real reason why anyone should buy them. If there are many people here who are happy with their cables, where are they? I'd really love to hear some real comments.

 

[Prog Rock Man]

Beeman, Danz03 and I were posting about the merits of headphone cables for the HD800 considering how expensive they are. That is totally on topic and relevant to the thread title. You then launch yet another baseless attack by stating Danz cannot hear a difference between cables, something you know nothing of as he has said nothing about listening to different cables and then you twist comments on prices to claim we say that no one is allowed to buy such cables.
 
Buy your expensive cables and promote their alleged merits and I will not buy them and promote their lack of merit. Fairs fair.

 

[Danz03]

I mean even if the reason was because they look nice and cool, like those JPS labs cables being advertised here, I would have accepted that, but seriously, they were ugly looking, like my UE 18 Pros' cable but 5 times bigger! 

 

[beeman458]

Danz03 wrote:
 
I actually asked the shop why they were so expensive and what can they actually do for my HD800s, but they couldn't even tell me. So I thought the pro-cable people here would be able to give an answer, but instead, the only comments so far had been like : "fxxk off if you're not buying!", so there doesn't seem to be any real reason why anyone should buy them. If there are many people here who are happy with their cables, where are they? I'd really love to hear some real comments.
 
You might want to take time to go through the thread to help give you understanding of how your original comments fit into the context of the thread.  My comments were based upon the context of the thread.  Here's your original comment:
 
I'm sure these cables would somehow change the sound character of the HD800s, whether one is able to detect the difference is another matter, but 625 USD? Wouldn't it be better spent on an amp or even to upgrade to a better pair of headphones? 

 
Nowhere in your introductory comment did you mention your above.  Personally, I've never evaluated the price of a set of cables for the HD800, so I can't give you an answer as to your question.  Maybe you can ask this question of some of the folks who make and sell cables for the HD800 who post among these forums.  The custom cables I purchased for the HD650, I'm very happy with in both the price and for what they do to the sound quality.
 
As to cost and value, see it in the same light as hiring a service person to provide services that you yourself are capable of providing and balance the convenience of having someone else provide services vs you providing the services against the cost; value.  The point, in the end, the end user has to be the final arbiter of value.

 

[aimlink]

.

 

[The Monkey]

Quote:

 

Your desire to control and manipulate means you are seriously scraping the bottom of the barrel now. This gets ridiculous when people cannot even pass comment and disagree with the pricing of headphone cables without an exaggerated and misrepresented nasty comment.

 
He'll continue to get worse if his behavior on other forums is any indication.
 

 

[Uncle Erik]

There isn't much comfort in failed tests. Some of us really want to know what's going on. Don't think that tests are exclusive to cables, either. We test headphones, amps, sources, and associated equipment, too. It's about seeking knowledge and refining things. That's how you learn what works, what makes a difference, solve problems, and gain insight into what is really going on.

If you want to see some impeccable testing and gradual product refinement, visit Linkwitz Lab. You'll find someone who has extensively tested and researched what he sells. You'll find the methodology, results, test equipment, everything. You'll also see how Dr. Linkwitz admits mistakes and how he goes about making improvements. The products he sells make a profit, but a reasonable one and he actually justifies the costs. He deserves to be compensated for what he does and you get superior performance for a great price. He's as good of an example as we have in audio.

Another paragon of rationality is Nelson Pass. Yes, he sells products. But he also opens up his designs to the DIY community and encourages experimentation and refinement. Go visit his forum and see how audio should be discussed - openly with a free exchange of ideas.

There's nothing like this in the cable community. No research, no sharing, nothing. All you have are a bunch of fly-by-night companies selling cheap bits at extraordinary prices. Not only that, but they actively deny any and all forms of testing, experimentation and research. They say that it is not possible and try to redefine arguments away from the facts. Changing the topic to "hate" shifts the focus away from whether their products actually do anything. It's what you always find when someone has something to hide and is afraid of answering the tough questions.

 

[BIG POPPA]

Well I started to pack for the Portland meet. I will bring a few headphone cables to try out. Sure I won't be the only one with Senn cables.

 

[beeman458]

Uncle Erik wrote:
 
There isn't much comfort in failed tests. Some of us really want to know what's going on. Don't think that tests are exclusive to cables, either. We test headphones, amps, sources, and associated equipment, too. It's about seeking knowledge and refining things. That's how you learn what works, what makes a difference, solve problems, and gain insight into what is really going on.
 
No it's not.  This discussion is not about amps, transports and associated equipment.  This discussion is about folks enjoying the enhancement cables bring to their listening experience and nothing else.  It's not about knowing what's going on.  It's not about solving problems.  It's not about gaining insight to what's really going on.  What this conversation is all about is anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't buy.  It's about anti-cable guys telling cable guys, what they can or can't hear.  It's anti-cable guys telling cable guys what is or isn't a good price to pay for cables.  It's about anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't enjoy in life.  It even went over the edge when psychology was brought into the discussion.  What this conversation is about is anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't talk about in public to others.  What this discussion is about is anti-cable guys trying to control others.  This debate has absolutely nothing to do with figuring out how anything works.
 
To cable guys, this isn't an intellectual study on how anything works.  Why?  Because it's about a single and only one single point, the enjoyment of music.
 
You'll also see how Dr. Linkwitz admits mistakes and how he goes about making improvements. The products he sells make a profit, but a reasonable one and he actually justifies the costs. He deserves to be compensated for what he does and you get superior performance for a great price. He's as good of an example as we have in audio.
 
This above and rest of your post is one big straw man defense.  A company doesn't have to justify their profits to anybody.  What you've done is make a subjective judgment call.  You know what his business costs and profits are?  And of course, you're applying this to all businesses in your neck of the woods?  It's called capitalism.  Buy, don't buy, free choice, free will.
 
Another paragon of rationality is Nelson Pass. Yes, he sells products. But he also opens up his designs to the DIY community and encourages experimentation and refinement. Go visit his forum and see how audio should be discussed - openly with a free exchange of ideas.
 
Now you're saying how businesses should comport themselves.
 
There's nothing like this in the cable community. No research, no sharing, nothing. All you have are a bunch of fly-by-night companies selling cheap bits at extraordinary prices. Not only that, but they actively deny any and all forms of testing, experimentation and research. They say that it is not possible and try to redefine arguments away from the facts. Changing the topic to "hate" shifts the focus away from whether their products actually do anything. It's what you always find when someone has something to hide and is afraid of answering the tough questions
 
So patients shouldn't have confidentiality and corporate America shouldn't be allowed to maintain proprietary information?  It's business and all of corporate America operates in this fashion; profits and secrecy.  Your above is how, pretty much, all of the world operates; in secrecy.  A suggestion, you're projecting in your above as you state for the record, how you think businesses should be run and how people should comport themselves; standing in moral judgment.
 
This is about folks being able to freely acquire, share and enjoy the benefits of cables, with or without the permission or approval of the anti-cable set.
 

 

[Bullseye]

Is this guy really serious? 
 

 
"STAND UP AGAINST THE ANTI-CABLE PEOPLE!!!!"
 
Quote:

 
No it's not.  This discussion is not about amps, transports and associated equipment.  This discussion is about folks enjoying the enhancement cables bring to their listening experience and nothing else.  It's not about knowing what's going on.  It's not about solving problems.  It's not about gaining insight to what's really going on.  What this conversation is all about is anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't buy.  It's about anti-cable guys telling cable guys, what they can or can't hear.  It's anti-cable guys telling cable guys what is or isn't a good price to pay for cables.  It's about anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't enjoy in life.  It even went over the edge when psychology was brought into the discussion.  What this conversation is about is anti-cable guys telling cable guys what they can and can't talk about in public to others.  What this discussion is about is anti-cable guys trying to control others.  This debate has absolutely nothing to do with figuring out how anything works.
 
To cable guys, this isn't an intellectual study on how anything works.  Why?  Because it's about a single and only one single point, the enjoyment of music.
 
This above and rest of your post is one big straw man defense.  A company doesn't have to justify their profits to anybody.  What you've done is make a subjective judgment call.  You know what his business costs and profits are?  And of course, you're applying this to all businesses in your neck of the woods?  It's called capitalism.  Buy, don't buy, free choice, free will.
 
Now you're saying how businesses should comport themselves.
 
So patients shouldn't have confidentiality and corporate America shouldn't have proprietary information?  It's business and all of corporate America operates in this fashion; profits and secrecy.  Your above is how, pretty much, all of the world operates, in secrecy.  A suggestion, you're projecting in your above as you state for the record, how you think businesses should be run and how people should comport themselves.
 
This is about folks being able to freely acquire cables and enjoy the benefits there of, with or without the permission and/or approval of the anti-cable set.
 

 

 

[jellojoe]

There is only one picture that can accurately describe beeman's "logic" and argumentative powers:
 

 

[Cymbal Monkey]

Us anti cables guys are coming for your guns are religion!

 

[Prog Rock Man]

This thread is titled "What is your view on custom headphone cables?" It has a poll with an option for anti-cablers to vote on, "No I don't believe in it". But it is in the DBT free part of the forum. So the control is by the pro- not the anti-cable side. An easily observable proof.