[mnemonix]

Many headphone companies have a "Reference" product, but in a field that is so subjective it seems to me to be a bit of pseudo-scientific nonsense used to imply that whatever it is is imbued with some kind of "absolute" quality... So does it just mean top of the line ? I wish they'd just say so if that's the case.

 

[ethebull]

Marketing, SNM

 

[mnemonix]

I should add that being over-literal in my interpretation of things sometimes, when I first saw the term I scurried off to find the International Standards Organisation that determined the technical & performance specification for a reference headphone...

 

[ttmnky]

I think reference is just a company's way of saying that their head-phones are more "neutral" across the board rather than having a certain frequency range boosted...

Can anyone else clarify?

 

[ILikeMusic]

In this context the term 'reference' is essentially equal to the term 'bulls..t'.

 

[GlendaleViper]

Who do you mean by "they"?

Seriously though, I think it's a combination of marketing (another word for flagship) and, perhaps not neutrality, but overall representation of the entire sound spectrum within certain tolerances. There's likely no real standard here, but suffice it to say, any "reference grade" headphones I've heard have been of exceptional quality, coloured FR or otherwise.

 

[mnemonix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ttmnky /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think reference is just a company's way of saying that their head-phones are more "neutral" across the board rather than having a certain frequency range boosted...

see ? it obviously worked on you

 

[BushGuy]

and a company/maker is saying this is their best quality product for both now and the immediate future. No neutrality is meant to be implied.

 

[mnemonix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlendaleViper /img/forum/go_quote.gif Who do you mean by "they"? Seriously though, I think it's a combination of marketing (another word for flagship) and, perhaps not neutrality, but overall representation of the entire sound spectrum within certain tolerances. There's likely no real standard here, but suffice it to say, any "reference grade" headphones I've heard have been of exceptional quality, coloured FR or otherwise.

I would say more by virtue that they are top of range than anything else though.

Actually I'd love there to be a reference standard covering a set of very high technical & performance requirements, it'd make the manufacturer comparisons we have here all the more interesting to see how each worked within the specifications and resulted in headphones that shared those high specifications but still differed in their design approach and sound. It's nice to have absolute references in such a sea of subjectivity too.

 

[ethebull]

Specifications mean little to nothing in this arena. You can buy a $150 Awia shelf system that is 200 watts, .01 THD... Specs are "used" for marketing hype as are meaningless words such as "reference, ultimate, powerful, refined,..." Don't believe it just bc it's printed in words or numbers.

 

[mnemonix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ethebull /img/forum/go_quote.gif Specifications mean little to nothing in this arena. You can buy a $150 Awia shelf system that is 200 watts, .01 THD... Specs are "used" for marketing hype as are meaningless words such as "reference, ultimate, powerful, refined,..." Don't believe it just bc it's printed in words or numbers.

As they say you can prove anything with statistics, but I don't believe numbers are meaningless, they are still the basis of science & engineering when used in a correct and complete context. Standards are set for a reason, and by an independant body, not the marketing department of a company!

 

[ethebull]

POWER OUTPUT: 110 watts per channel continuous from 20Hz to 20kHz. 1kHz total harmonic distortion typically 0.3% at 110 watts, below 0.03% at 1 watt.

FREQUENCY RESPONSE:
(-3dB points at 1 watt) 0.5Hz to 200 kHz.

HUM & NOISE: Less than 0.1mV RMS -112dB below rated output (IHF weighted, input shorted).


--------------------------------------------


Channel Power Rating
100W x 2 (8 ohms, 40 Hz - 20kHz, THD 0.09%)

The top group of specs is from a high end brand with a sterling reputation. The specs are fine but tell you little to nothing. The basic amp sells for $8000

The lower power rating spec is from a $150 stereo receiver.

Good luck basing your buying decisions on specs.

 

[mnemonix]

I think you're missing my point... it stands to reason a marketing department is going to use specifications out of context of the complete picture to make their product look good, and I'd never base my buying decision on them.

I was suggesting an independant specification for a reference phone, which would by its nature, be independantly determined, and of sufficient scope and depth to define a genuinely high performance device. I might accept that the performance bar would be arbitrary to some extent, but the nature of a reference is to serve as an absolute benchmark against which something can be judged or class to which it belongs. It's fantasy of course, but I wanted to redefine the notion of a reference phone as something with a clearly defined meaning rather than the marketing bs it clearly is atm.

 

[tom hankins]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mnemonix /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think you're missing my point... it stands to reason a marketing department is going to use specifications out of context of the complete picture to make their product look good, and I'd never base my buying decision on them. I was suggesting an independant specification for a reference phone, which would by its nature, be independantly determined, and of sufficient scope and depth to define a genuinely high performance device. I might accept that the performance bar would be arbitrary to some extent, but the nature of a reference is to serve as an absolute benchmark against which something can be judged or class to which it belongs. It's fantasy of course, but I wanted to redefine the notion of a reference phone as something with a clearly defined meaning rather than the marketing bs it clearly is atm.

Well I think any of the better phones are going to test pretty good. Trying to set a guideline to go by is pretty much worthless.
When a company claims that a product or line of products is there reference line. It usually means that its the best they have produced in that company. How would you check one companies reference (top of the line) product against another companies? It becomes subjective.
So when a company claims such and such to be there reference, it does have a clearly defined meaning. it means this is the best they have to offer. (as comparied to the other products they offer)

 

[mnemonix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom hankins /img/forum/go_quote.gif So when a company claims such and such to be there reference, it does have a clearly defined meaning. it means this is the best they have to offer. (as comparied to the other products they offer)

I know... my original post was motivated by pedantry