We're all spoiled
Oct 7, 2001 at 6:26 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 44

dngl

He'd rather show hisbuns than wear fur.
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I was watching the news in light of the recent attack on Afghanistan, and they stated that a big deal over there was owning a donkey, which cost $50 USD, which is a year's salary to them. The first thing I thought was "why the hell would you want a donkey?" Then I realized that they didn't have cars or big houses and had to <gasp> do hard labor for work, so of course an pack animal would be a convenience.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 6:40 PM Post #2 of 44
yea.....times like this make audio pursuits seem so self-serving and unnecessary.....
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 7:08 PM Post #3 of 44
yeah, we're all hypocrits really. I mean, spending thousands to get our music to sound "better", while some people don't have a home and such.

it's not like we've earned this or something.

inequality will always stay tho...
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 7:31 PM Post #4 of 44
Like Braver said, not spending money on audio won't end inequality. I think it's just important to be aware of it and read Ayn Rand novels to make ourselves feel better.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 7:41 PM Post #5 of 44
I think that you guys are touching on one of the reasons we're so hated in some parts of the world. You're right, we are spoiled. millions of people spend more money than those people will see in their lifetimes on trivial items like shoes or clothes. our country is so wealthy it's almost disgusting. Hell, I live here too, I'm not saying that everyone else has made a mistake except me. But ****, can you blaim some of those people for hating us? We have no idea what it's like to suffer. Obviously I'm not saying that the attack on the WTC was justified by any means, but it's true that before now we never knew what it was like to have true fear about whether or not we were safe. many of the people in the middle east or Africa or many other places fear every day about whether or not their family will starve to death or whether or not their homes will be bombed or set on fire during the night. Yeah, we're definitely spoiled. And every time I think about that sort of thing I feel terrible pangs of guilt. What really sucks is that i don't know what to do about it. Any thoughts that i have about what to do are implausible simply because very few Americans are willing to let go of the wealth and protection that we have.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 8:09 PM Post #6 of 44
it's not just this audio hobby tho. it is costing me a lot, but I don't have more money than my friends for instance, I just spend it differently.

the whole world's ****ed up, it not just us audio enthousiasts.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 8:37 PM Post #7 of 44
and i suppose bin laden who inherited loads of cash isn't spoiled
wink.gif


it's quite ironic that a guy who turned his large inheritance into an even larger fortune through many smart investments, uses his money to attack a capitalist icon like the world trade centre.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 8:42 PM Post #9 of 44
Quote:

We have no idea what it's like to suffer.


Neruda, don't EVER make a stupid-ass statement like that.

Perhaps YOU don't know what it's like to suffer. Others do.

I sure as hell do.

Sure, I haven't been denied food, clothing, shelter, or any other "necessity."

But.....I've suffered my share of emotional pain. I won't go into details - but that above quote pisses me off.

I do see understand what you're trying to say......and I would've had a "100% agreement" post if you hadn't said what you did.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 9:38 PM Post #10 of 44
Quote:

Originally posted by Neruda
I think that you guys are touching on one of the reasons we're so hated in some parts of the world. You're right, we are spoiled. millions of people spend more money than those people will see in their lifetimes on trivial items like shoes or clothes. our country is so wealthy it's almost disgusting. Heck, I live here too, I'm not saying that everyone else has made a mistake except me. But heck, can you blaim some of those people for hating us? We have no idea what it's like to suffer. Obviously I'm not saying that the attack on the WTC was justified by any means, but it's true that before now we never knew what it was like to have true fear about whether or not we were safe. many of the people in the middle east or Africa or many other places fear every day about whether or not their family will starve to death or whether or not their homes will be bombed or set on fire during the night. Yeah, we're definitely spoiled. And every time I think about that sort of thing I feel terrible pangs of guilt. What really sucks is that i don't know what to do about it. Any thoughts that i have about what to do are implausible simply because very few Americans are willing to let go of the wealth and protection that we have.


frown.gif

Neruda,
What you say is generally true, most of us who participate in this forum do not understand what life is like for most people living in places like Afganistan. One gentleman who works for me spent time in Afganistan. Even though he experienced "life" over there, he was able to leave it behind and return to his previous life. The people who were born into that situation, do not know any other life, and their suffering is relative for them. They, no doubt find great pleasure and relief in things we would consider abject poverty and depravation. We live in different worlds. My wife and I spent seven years of our lives as missionaries trying to alleviate the suffering of others and endured suffering ourselves as a result. That was a drop in the bucket compared to the personal sacrfice that some willingly make with their whole lives. Look at the sacrifice that someone like Mother Theresa made with her entire life to serve others and to help alleviate the suffering of others. Yet... The world is still what it is. I offer the following thoughts I shared in another thread;

What is Good? What is Bad? What is Right? What is Wrong? Are there any Absolutes? Is everything Relative?

To one, that which is good is perceived as bad by another. It is a good thing for us to live by our convictions. Unless we are convicted that it is bad to allow others to live by theirs.

Is there an absolute right and wrong? Is there an absolute good and evil? I believe there is, and I also believe in allowing others to seek these absolutes for themselves as long as they do not impose upon the right of others to do the same for themselves. I believe in demonstrating that which is good by example, thereby helping others to see the same.

These are sad times we live in. Times in which people are not willing to listen to, and consider one another. Times in which people are not willing to rejoice in our differences as well as our commonality. Times in which some feel the need to force their will upon others who are not imposing upon their own.

These times are unfortunately not too unlike all other times recorded in the course of humanity. There have been such people among us since Cain. Whether the story of Cain and Abel is allegory or fact, matters not as much as the demonstrated fact that it is unquestionably exemplary of the human condition.

Given this human condition, in human terms, there is no easy solution to the problems we see in this world in which we live. I Pray for peace.

Last night Neruda, my wife and I met for the first time at a restaurant. We had a wonderful time. We shared a few tunes on the cans. We enjoyed Neruda's musicianship, and I enjoyed his jammin' 401's.
smily_headphones1.gif
We learned from each other. We ate a modest meal (to us) that many in this world will never see the luxury of. We came away from that meeting with a thanksgiving for our good fortune to have met and to have learned from one another. What more can we ask from one another than mutual acceptance and understanding? What better thing to do in this life than the maintain a sense of wonder and thankfulness for the things we are able to enjoy in this life and to live out a desire to help others to enjoy theirs.

By all means, let us do what we can to help alleviate suffering when and where we can, but above all, let us not take part in causing the sufferiing of others.
Peace.
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 10:15 PM Post #11 of 44
Quote:

Originally posted by coolvij

Neruda, don't EVER make a stupid-ass statement like that.

Perhaps YOU don't know what it's like to suffer. Others do.


Dude, **** that. You don't think I've suffered too? I have been denied food and clothing before! So **** that. I'm talking about a different level of suffering, completely.

kwkarth brought up a lot of very good points. Times are very strange right now...I just wish that no one had to worry about stuff like that, you know?
Quote:

What more can we ask from one another than mutual acceptance and understanding? What better thing to do in this life than the maintain a sense of wonder and thankfulness for the things we are able to enjoy in this life and to live out a desire to help others to enjoy theirs.


I totally agree. If only everyone shared that philosophy...
 
Oct 7, 2001 at 11:13 PM Post #12 of 44
We are spoiled and lucky. But at the same time I think we miss out on something when we aren't allowed to struggle with nature to survive. If you philosphize enough I think you can justify the disparity between people. However if you're a realist it's pretty obvious that Americans generally got it good and we are damn lucky to be Americans. But we also spend alot of time trying to kill each other and threatening to kill each other. Which reminds me... OT...

I got rather close to a middle aged couple while I was on my bike the other day and the man just straight flipped the **** out. He flipped out like I had just walked up and punched him in the forehead and groped his wife. I was actually a tad scared, so I said sorry and continued on. I was in a hurry to go pay rent so i didn't have time to chat with the fellow and assure him I wasn't a total ass. So I am coming back from paying the rent and there the guy is again. He is still pissed off, I mean he is so pissed he's red and steaming. He yells that I better not come near them but I don't heed him, I ride where I will without regard to that fool. And he knocks me off my bike. As I determine that I should stand up quickly to the right to cause him to move back into his wife and strike out with a straight kick to further imbalance him on his companion I realize a couple of things: #1 I am right in front of a police station #2 No one will believe me over this guy and his wife. #3 If I hit this guy to hard he will be in the hospital and then I will really be in trouble. So I decide to stand up nice and slow and look him in the eye and ask him: "Could you tell me why you just knocked me off my bike?" He's so freaking angry he is spitting and spurting and quivering like a litle kid. I have rarely seen someone so utterly out of control. And this guy looks like a middle aged wealthy fellow which might explain it. He apparently thinks I could have hurt him and his wife, yes I very well could have if I had been riding a harley davidson and doing 70 mph on the sidewalks of Savannah. (I should do that someday before I die.) Anyhow, I never get him to say sorry even though I apologized profusely and I even asked a cop to try and sort things out but they basically didn't listen to a damn thing I said and I ended up getting scolded for riding my bike on the sidewalk. The cop even went as far saying they were just visiting our "fair" city and I should do my best to make them feel at home. I about snapped. I almost went to jail for about a decade. I stood silent for a moment in contemplation of my destructive dreams, then setting those aside merely said "Well, I hope it rains the whole time." It was pretty lame but I really, really, meant it. And really meaning something is rare for me... It was the kind of meaning as if I had been starving for a month and then said "Man I'm hungry." And it didn't rain a damn bit although it was cloudy part of yesterday. After saying that I just got on my bike, thanked the Police officer, and continued on with existence.

Hopefully there is a moral to that story.
 
Oct 8, 2001 at 12:13 AM Post #13 of 44
ai0tron, that's a great story
wink.gif
I've decided that some people just need a reason to be angry, even if it's over something ridiculous.

Jon wrote:
Quote:

and read Ayn Rand novels


Sorry, Jon, reading Ayn Rand just infuriates me rather than makes me happy
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Oct 8, 2001 at 2:15 AM Post #14 of 44
Yeah, I totally know what you're saying ai0tron. Some people just have a perpetual stick up their booties.

MacDef- Ayn Rand makes me angry as well. It's a nice attempt to justify leading a hedonistic life. Even though I disagree with her views, her novels should still be required reading.
 
Oct 8, 2001 at 2:16 AM Post #15 of 44
To a very large extent the suffering of most people in the world is a factor of being unlucky enough to be born into the country and society they live in. No matter what we do, we cannot be blamed for the suffering they live with. The US can not turn the middle east into the Garden Of Paradise. The death of every American and Jew and free person in the world will not change anything in the middle east. The elimination of Jerusalem from the face of the earth won't make any Muslim's life better. Any foreign policy we change can not remake the middle east into a less harsh enviroment.
 

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