Weiss Engineering DAC50x (DAC501 and DAC502) Review
- Thread starter warrenpchi
- Start date
I am asking regarding the 4ch
The normal one does not run both channel/input at the same time
To use either you will have to choose/isolate the inputs on the standard version.
___
Sorry I misread your post. Very informative. THANKS!
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Sorry for the hijack @RobertSM ...
Im moving over to the DAC204 as Im looking for a smaller system, and can not meet all my requests when I have Susvara.
Im moving over to the DAC204 as Im looking for a smaller system, and can not meet all my requests when I have Susvara.
Curious as to which amp this will be!
I've placed an order for the Cayin HA-300B MKII. I'm excited to get into the world of 300b tubes.
The Weiss will continue to feed the ALO Studio Six via unbalanced RCAs and will feed the Cayin via balanced XLR. It should prove to be two totally different experiences due to the output tube types and overall different tunings. More to come as I think I'm still a few weeks out from having it all. But I'm excited.
Andrewteee
100+ Head-Fier
I could not find a thread focused on the DAC204 (except an announcement). Is there one or is chat about it only in this thread so far?
I talked with my local dealer and he told me they were suppose to be released in July, but have been delayed. 3-4 weeks before I will demo one.
Here is a thread I posted latest comment on
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/new-from-weiss-the-dac-204-in-stock-a-ttvjaudio-com.968323/page-6
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Highfive99
100+ Head-Fier
New 204 owner here but was wondering what exactly is the difference between a 501/502 2ch and a 4ch? Not quite grasping the concept of 4ch with respect to a DAC. TIA!
Take a look at Asia Weiss. It's Weiss Engineering Asia arm of the business website.
Click on the appropriate device on the landing page and here you can see the features and technologies specific to the given model. You can then easily click into another unit to see how they are similar or how they differ.
https://www.asiaweiss.com/
Mister Crash
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The 4-channel bit is more of a future proofing exercise at the moment. But the 4-channel version also has updated DAC chips and analog section. You can read more about it here:
https://weiss.ch/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/White-paper-on-the-DAC50x-4ch.pdf
On the topic of "future" stuff: it seems that the last firmware update for the 501/502 was almost a year ago (V2.6.1 in Sep 2022). (I don't own the Audeze LCD-5, but if I did, I probably wouldn't be happy that the Weiss Headphone EQ still pretends that headphone doesn't even exist yet.)
Just something to keep in mind for those who bought, or are considering buying, the 501/2 on the promise of rapid developments in software/DSP/etc., including the 4-ch functionality.
Mister Crash
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I ended up ordering a Weiss Helios. I got it earlier this week, and I decided that I was going to set up the ultimate blind test of the Weiss DACs this weekend:
1. I ordered a passive XLR switch from Amazon. 3 sets of inputs and 3 sets of outputs.
2. I ordered a few sets of Grimm TPR XLR cables. All were the same 2m length and used the same Grimm TPR cable with Neutrik connectors. I already had a pair straight from the manufacturer but ordered two more from Geistnote. Each set had one cable with a black ring and one with a colored ring (blue, orange, or red).
3. I hooked all three up to the same network switch using Blue Jeans Cat6 ethernet cables and plugged them in using generic power cords. I plugged one set of XLR cables into each DAC and connected them to the switch.
4. I used a pair of Grimm SQM cables to output from the switch to my Mjolnir Audio KGSSHV amp. I used my Stax SR-007MkI headphones to listen.
5. I made sure all DACs were using the latest firmware and bypassed DSP. They were all set to headphone output with no attenuation.
6. I tried running a few sample songs in Roon and adjusted the volume of the DACs until they seemed comparable. This meant turning the Helios down to -7.5 dB and turning the 4ch down to -1.0 dB. Fortunately, Roon allows you to group streamers together, so I could send the same song to all of them simultaneously. This volume adjustment was done by ear so there may have been some variances and it wasn't possible to match the volume at all frequencies. Having done this, I stopped for the night.
7. The next day, I unplugged the inputs to the switch and asked my wife to plug them back in whatever order she wanted. I left the room while she did that. She also put a towel over the switch so I couldn't see which cables were connected to which input.
8. I loaded up Roon, grouped all of the streamers together, and started playing music. I tried listening to songs all the way through, then switching inputs, but I also switched inputs on the fly when I wanted to hear differences in particular passages. For the purposes of my notes, they were simply #1, #2, and #3.
#1 was very clear and clean with a ton of detail. It seemed to handle complex passages very easily and had a great handle on the bass. Highs could be sparkly but were never strident. It felt full and immersive. It was definitely the most forward sound of the three but wasn't overbearing.
#2 was not as detailed as #1. In particular, the bass notes seemed a little less well-defined and sounded slightly more muffled. It was still pleasant to listen to, but I found that I didn't like it as much as #1.
#3 was very close to #1, but was a hair short. Again, it was very detailed, but it was slightly softer in the lower registers (though it was better than #2 was). It had a direct and balanced sound that was impressive.
Overall, I found that I liked #1 > #3 >> #2. None of the sounded bad, but #1 and #3 definitely sounded better to me than #2 did.
I called my wife in to get her thoughts as well. While she had plugged the XLR cables into the switch, she didn't know which cable corresponded to which DAC (and she doesn't care about gear so I don't believe she would have an expectation bias). I left her to listen and a few minutes later, she came out of the room and said that she preferred #2. When I asked her why, she said that it sounded the clearest. This may have been the first time that she and I had a different ranking of results when I set up a blind test.
Having gathered her opinion and mine, I removed the towel and revealed which was which:
#1 was the DAC501-4ch
#2 was the DAC501
#3 was the Helios
Now for the caveats:
1. I bought the Helios new (which is the first time I've bought a new, non-demo, non-open box audio piece in 17 years). While I did run it a little bit over the week, it doesn't have more than 30 hours on it. Perhaps it needs more time to break in.
2. From past experience with the Weiss DACs, the digital volume control does not sound as good as the analog volume control on the headphone amp. Digital volume controls are lossy, so enacting them can cause the sound to suffer. The Helios had the highest level of output and required a -7.5 dB adjustment to match the levels of the other two, which I believe was a notable handicap. The DAC501-4ch also required a slight -1.0 dB volume reduction, but it wasn't nearly as substantial as the Helios.
I am going to keep the Helios in my home office setup and the DAC501-4ch in my bedroom setup. I haven't yet decided what to do with the base DAC501, but I will probably end up selling it at some point. It's a great DAC that I love, but when I compare it to the upgraded models, it's not as engaging.
1. I ordered a passive XLR switch from Amazon. 3 sets of inputs and 3 sets of outputs.
2. I ordered a few sets of Grimm TPR XLR cables. All were the same 2m length and used the same Grimm TPR cable with Neutrik connectors. I already had a pair straight from the manufacturer but ordered two more from Geistnote. Each set had one cable with a black ring and one with a colored ring (blue, orange, or red).
3. I hooked all three up to the same network switch using Blue Jeans Cat6 ethernet cables and plugged them in using generic power cords. I plugged one set of XLR cables into each DAC and connected them to the switch.
4. I used a pair of Grimm SQM cables to output from the switch to my Mjolnir Audio KGSSHV amp. I used my Stax SR-007MkI headphones to listen.
5. I made sure all DACs were using the latest firmware and bypassed DSP. They were all set to headphone output with no attenuation.
6. I tried running a few sample songs in Roon and adjusted the volume of the DACs until they seemed comparable. This meant turning the Helios down to -7.5 dB and turning the 4ch down to -1.0 dB. Fortunately, Roon allows you to group streamers together, so I could send the same song to all of them simultaneously. This volume adjustment was done by ear so there may have been some variances and it wasn't possible to match the volume at all frequencies. Having done this, I stopped for the night.
7. The next day, I unplugged the inputs to the switch and asked my wife to plug them back in whatever order she wanted. I left the room while she did that. She also put a towel over the switch so I couldn't see which cables were connected to which input.
8. I loaded up Roon, grouped all of the streamers together, and started playing music. I tried listening to songs all the way through, then switching inputs, but I also switched inputs on the fly when I wanted to hear differences in particular passages. For the purposes of my notes, they were simply #1, #2, and #3.
#1 was very clear and clean with a ton of detail. It seemed to handle complex passages very easily and had a great handle on the bass. Highs could be sparkly but were never strident. It felt full and immersive. It was definitely the most forward sound of the three but wasn't overbearing.
#2 was not as detailed as #1. In particular, the bass notes seemed a little less well-defined and sounded slightly more muffled. It was still pleasant to listen to, but I found that I didn't like it as much as #1.
#3 was very close to #1, but was a hair short. Again, it was very detailed, but it was slightly softer in the lower registers (though it was better than #2 was). It had a direct and balanced sound that was impressive.
Overall, I found that I liked #1 > #3 >> #2. None of the sounded bad, but #1 and #3 definitely sounded better to me than #2 did.
I called my wife in to get her thoughts as well. While she had plugged the XLR cables into the switch, she didn't know which cable corresponded to which DAC (and she doesn't care about gear so I don't believe she would have an expectation bias). I left her to listen and a few minutes later, she came out of the room and said that she preferred #2. When I asked her why, she said that it sounded the clearest. This may have been the first time that she and I had a different ranking of results when I set up a blind test.
Having gathered her opinion and mine, I removed the towel and revealed which was which:
#1 was the DAC501-4ch
#2 was the DAC501
#3 was the Helios
Now for the caveats:
1. I bought the Helios new (which is the first time I've bought a new, non-demo, non-open box audio piece in 17 years). While I did run it a little bit over the week, it doesn't have more than 30 hours on it. Perhaps it needs more time to break in.
2. From past experience with the Weiss DACs, the digital volume control does not sound as good as the analog volume control on the headphone amp. Digital volume controls are lossy, so enacting them can cause the sound to suffer. The Helios had the highest level of output and required a -7.5 dB adjustment to match the levels of the other two, which I believe was a notable handicap. The DAC501-4ch also required a slight -1.0 dB volume reduction, but it wasn't nearly as substantial as the Helios.
I am going to keep the Helios in my home office setup and the DAC501-4ch in my bedroom setup. I haven't yet decided what to do with the base DAC501, but I will probably end up selling it at some point. It's a great DAC that I love, but when I compare it to the upgraded models, it's not as engaging.
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Fun review! I do suspect the Helios will improve with some time. But it's good to know the DAC 501-4Ch is up to the task. I was thinking it would be to be honest.
Enjoy the Weiss DACs you're in good hands!
greyforest
500+ Head-Fier
Not many people have the courage to conduct such an ABX test, and you are truly commendable for taking on that challenge.
Highfive99
100+ Head-Fier
Or the bank account to swing 3 of Weiss's top DAC's!
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