[Spud1969]

I have the Westone2 (117dB/1mW) and Aurisonics ASG-1.3 (120dB/1mW). Both work fine with Samsung flagship phones...then I ended up needing to charge a dumb dongle anyway (on top of a recent Android update that effed up USB audio digital output to my desktop system again), so I now have a Hidizs AP80 (using it via line out to my amp). It's already overkill for those but if you really need to go louder then instead of more power then higher sensitivity is one way to go.

Unfortunately these IEMs are also not being made anymore but my beater IEM, a Nicehck DB1, still has the Hidizs AP80 as overkill for it even at 106dB/1mW. But in your case with an AP80 Pro already making more power, depending on what you were driving before, this might be insufficient...not to mention the DB1 has a rather odd shape to the shell on the side that contacts the ear conch.

What exactly were you driving with the AP80 Pro before? At the very least look into the sensitivity of that and try to find something that has roughly the same impedance but has at least 6dB higher sensitivity.

Hi
I have been using Sound Magic E11C, their sensitiviy is 112db/1mw so the Nicehck DB1 at 106db would be an improvement.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Hi
I have been using Sound Magic E11C, their sensitiviy is 112db/1mw...

If you've been using a 42ohm, 112dB/1mW that means you can hit 120dB+ at about an inch from the drivers easily. Maybe it's not a matter of power but

1. The eartips on the Sound Magic might be compressing as you put them into your ear canals. It's kind of like listening to speakers from another room with the door open.

2. Your AP80 is broken, in which case buying another IEM might be a good idea if just to see how it does with that one...but just to be sure, make it an IEM with a higher sensitivity but not too low nor too high impedance.

...so the Nicehck DB1 at 106db would be an improvement.

Uh...no. Not for what you need. The sensitivity is lower that you'll need 4X the power to match the output of the SoundMagic.

That said, I can blow out my eardrums on the DB1, so if you get this and it still sounds weak (and you're sure it's not the eartips compressing practically shut over the bore), you either return the AP80 Pro or schedule an appointment with an ENT. You could have pushed earwax in with IEMs and they've partially blocked the path to your eardrums.

 

[castleofargh]

Now I ’m wondering if it’s not a plug problem with the remote ring?
Because as suggest, beside clogged nozzles and broken gear, that setup should go plenty loud on paper.

 

[Spud1969]

If you've been using a 42ohm, 112dB/1mW that means you can hit 120dB+ at about an inch from the drivers easily. Maybe it's not a matter of power but

1. The eartips on the Sound Magic might be compressing as you put them into your ear canals. It's kind of like listening to speakers from another room with the door open.

2. Your AP80 is broken, in which case buying another IEM might be a good idea if just to see how it does with that one...but just to be sure, make it an IEM with a higher sensitivity but not too low nor too high impedance.




Uh...no. Not for what you need. The sensitivity is lower that you'll need 4X the power to match the output of the SoundMagic.

That said, I can blow out my eardrums on the DB1, so if you get this and it still sounds weak (and you're sure it's not the eartips compressing practically shut over the bore), you either return the AP80 Pro or schedule an appointment with an ENT. You could have pushed earwax in with IEMs and they've partially blocked the path to your eardrums.

Hi
I took the plunge and bought my first pair of i.e.m's as opposed to ear buds which the E12C's are, I bought the KZ ZSN as they were reasonably inexpensive and I could get them the next day on Amazon Prime as well as being able to send them back easily if they didn't prove to be a solution to my issue. I did go down an I.E.M rabbit hole on Saturday afternoon, as well as the DB1/3 I am also considering the tin hifi 2 but I will continue with the KZ ZSN first.
The difference in output is incredible, some tracks I am only going to 50 on the AP80 scale and haven't been past 80. I did try the 2.5mm balanced output with a balanced 2.5mm to 3.5mm adaptor but one I.E.M is distorting badly and there is hiss and crackle, I am suspecting that the cheap adaptor I got from Amazon is not fit for purpose, I will seen out something better although I do not need to use the balanced output as the standard 3.5mm output is loud enough.

 

[Spud1969]

Now I ’m wondering if it’s not a plug problem with the remote ring?
Because as suggest, beside clogged nozzles and broken gear, that setup should go plenty loud on paper.

Hi
See my response to the previous reply, I seem to have found a solution.

 

[castleofargh]

Glad that you at least found an alternative.
Just in case, to use a balanced output you need the entire cable to be made for it(4 distinct wires and not because of a remote on the cable!). A trs plug into an adapter will not become balanced, it could even be bad for the amplification section of the DAP.

 

[Spud1969]

Glad that you at least found an alternative.
Just in case, to use a balanced output you need the entire cable to be made for it(4 distinct wires and not because of a remote on the cable!). A trs plug into an adapter will not become balanced, it could even be bad for the amplification section of the DAP.

The 2.5mm balanced jack to 3.5mm female worked with the sound magic e11c but with the KZ's there seemed to be a bad connection in the left earpiece, I wondered if the adaptor is bad quality as it was £6 for 2 on Amazon. I can only find one of them or I would try the other to see if just one of them was at fault. The KZ's in the standard 3.5mm work just fine and are loud enough, I just wanted to have a play about. I tried the KZ's with my Sony NW A45 and they do not go loud enough, nowhere near the performance of HIDIZS.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I did try the 2.5mm balanced output with a balanced 2.5mm to 3.5mm adaptor but one I.E.M is distorting badly and there is hiss and crackle, I am suspecting that the cheap adaptor I got from Amazon is not fit for purpose, I will seen out something better although I do not need to use the balanced output as the standard 3.5mm output is loud enough.

What kind of adapter was this? Did you just hook it up to the stock cable on the ZSN? Because that's not how this works.

The three black stripes on the ZSN is the + for left, right, and microphone; if you only have two stripes it's the non-mic model. Either way the negative on the L and R drivers are both joined to a common ground on the 3.5mm plug regardless of whether there's a mic or not. Using an adapter that just tacks on to that still joins the separate L- and R- on the AP80 to the common ground. Just pray nothing got damaged and stop using that if that's what you're using, and get a balanced cable that has L- and R- separate all the way from the drivers to the plug.

Those adapters that tack onto the plug don't convert an SE cable into a balanced cable, they just convert a balanced cable with another kind of plug to work with another kind of socket.

 

[Spud1969]

What kind of adapter was this? Did you just hook it up to the stock cable on the ZSN? Because that's not how this works.

The three black stripes on the ZSN is the + for left, right, and microphone; if you only have two stripes it's the non-mic model. Either way the negative on the L and R drivers are both joined to a common ground on the 3.5mm plug regardless of whether there's a mic or not. Using an adapter that just tacks on to that still joins the separate L- and R- on the AP80 to the common ground. Just pray nothing got damaged and stop using that if that's what you're using, and get a balanced cable that has L- and R- separate all the way from the drivers to the plug.

Those adapters that tack onto the plug don't convert an SE cable into a balanced cable, they just convert a balanced cable with another kind of plug to work with another kind of socket.

Hi
Thanks for your reply, I got this from Amazon.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0BHSX8186?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Everything seems ok so I may have got away with it if I potentially put my i.e.m and dap at risk.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Hi
Thanks for your reply, I got this from Amazon.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0BHSX8186?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

That won't work to make your IEMs work in balanced mode. The common ground on the stock plug will not get split into independent grounding points to make for differential drive.

If anything if you get a new IEM with detachable cables then getting a balanced cable for them can now be an option.

 

[Spud1969]

That won't work to make your IEMs work in balanced mode. The common ground on the stock plug will not get split into independent grounding points to make for differential drive.

If anything if you get a new IEM with detachable cables then getting a balanced cable for them can now be an option.

Hi
Ah ok, thanks, sometimes a little bit of knowledge can be extremely dangerous lol, first time I have come across the phenomenon of a balanced output and what that meant.
Yes, the I.E.M's have detachable cables, I just need to find the correct cable, what exactly am I looking for so I don't make the same mistake as I did with buying that adaptor from Amazon.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Yes, the I.E.M's have detachable cables, I just need to find the correct cable, what exactly am I looking for so I don't make the same mistake as I did with buying that adaptor from Amazon.

Typically it will just say "balanced cable" on the product description, you just need to find one that uses the correct plug. Although right now it's usually 2.5mm TRRS. It will have three black stripes on the 2.5mm plug and will not have a microphone.

 

[Spud1969]

Typically it will just say "balanced cable" on the product description, you just need to find one that uses the correct plug. Although right now it's usually 2.5mm TRRS. It will have three black stripes on the 2.5mm plug and will not have a microphone.

Hi
I have ordered a couple of different cables from Aliexpress. Amazing the price range, from £10 upwards, £300 for a cable, that is insane. I have decided to send the AP80 Pro back as I had purchased a second hand cowon plenue D2 before I purchased the AP80. I am liking the sound of that more than the AP80.I really want an Cowon Plenue D3 but there are issues with chips apparently there are holding up supply, I really like the Astell and Kern SR25 but that is a bit rich for my pocket at present.