[Vespasian]

Besides scratches, stains, writing, scuffs, ect... is there anything else that determines the quality of a vinyl record? In other words, if you had two of the same record that were both in mint condition, is it possible that one could sound better than the other? If so, why?

Also, what are some good vinyl cleaning products?

TIA,
Ves

 

[Zanth]

When you write "the same record" if you mean the same as in indentical upc (release, vinyl thickness, vinyl colour) etc., then no would not think there would be anything save for warps. However, vinyl of different thickness sounds different as does the vinyl colour apparently. White vinyl is resiliant against noise apparently, black vinyl has more resolution, red and green apparently sound like crap generally, etc. Though I must say, I have a green Weezer album and it sounds awesome and it one of my quiestest records.

 

[lini]

Well, the mould can be more or less worn, then there's a difference between standard pressings, direct metal masterings and half-speed cuttings et cetera; then there can be a difference in vinyl quality itself, in the amount of vinyl used and the cooling time; packaging and storage also makes a difference... lots of variables, acutally...

Greetings from Hannover!

Manfred / lini

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lini Well, the mould can be more or less worn, then there's a difference between standard pressings, direct metal masterings and half-speed cuttings et cetera; then there can be a difference in vinyl quality itself, in the amount of vinyl used and the cooling time; packaging and storage also makes a difference... lots of variables, acutally... Greetings from Hannover! Manfred / lini

Nice post lini! Makes me feel like buying vinyl is like playing Russian roulette!

All the more adventurous!

 

[Vespasian]

"there can be a difference in vinyl quality itself, in the amount of vinyl used and the cooling time"

Is this information somewhere on the vinyl itself or perhaps on the cover?
Does more vinyl mean better quality?

-Ves

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vespasian Does more vinyl mean better quality? -Ves

Not necessarily. Though many enjoy 180 and 200 gram pressings, the lower weight pressings can sound as good if not better. It really comes down to the mixing and mastering along with the QA at the factory. That said, many 180 and 200 g releases of late are astoundingly good. Spin a clean one and you could argue that the notion of noisy vinyl is about as true as kissing causing pregnancy

 

[Vespasian]

"Though many enjoy 180 and 200 gram pressings"

If you given a record, how could you determine the gram pressing?

Actually, I was given about 200 records, and I am trying to figure out each records vinyl integrity?

Thanx much,
Ves

 

[Zanth]

Most 180 and 200 gram pressings have a sticker indicating so on the cover. Most companies are proud to advertize this as it is a hot selling point for audiophiles.

Others, you could measure the thickness of the vinyl with callipers

I am very new to vinyl so I don't know when manufacturers started making heavier pressings.

 

[Garbz]

or you could put it on a scale

I have found no real correlation with vinyl quality and what it's on. I have an excellent frank sinatra album which is almost paper thin. Buying vinyl really is like playing russian roulette.

 

[bigshot]

The gram measurements refer to the quality of the vinyl, not the weight of the actual record. For the same mass, the better grade of vinyl is denser and heavier.

See ya
Steve

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigshot The gram measurements refer to the quality of the vinyl, not the weight of the actual record. For the same mass, the better grade of vinyl is denser and heavier. See ya Steve

I don't understand? Is there anything in a record besides vinyl? If not, mass is directly related to density. Certainly, my 200g records feel heavier than my thin 70's pressings

 

[Jeff Wong]

Another consideration would be "virgin vinyl." As I recall, the thinking behind this is that the purer the vinyl, the more consistent the expansion and contraction of the grooves will be as the vinyl heats up and cools after the stylus has passed through. Impure vinyl, with its less than uniform makeup will expand and contract at different rates. I suppose it's possible for the grooves to cool in a slightly deformed state because of this, affecting playback next time. Many Japanese pressings of LPs have been pressed on this purer grade - although the disc may look black, if you hold it up to the light, it'll be brown and you can see through it.

 

[JefferyK]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Nice post lini! Makes me feel like buying vinyl is like playing Russian roulette! All the more adventurous!

It is!

Generally speaking, records from earlier in the print run sound better because the stamper is newer. Usually, white-label DJ copies were the first in the print run.

Jeffery

 

[Jeff Wong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth I don't understand? Is there anything in a record besides vinyl? If not, mass is directly related to density. Certainly, my 200g records feel heavier than my thin 70's pressings

Some records are pressed on polypropylene, such as the 7" single Stairway to Gilligan by Little Roger and the Goosebumps. My friend, Wes, found out the hard way when he used LAST record cleaner on it, and the disc melted into a pink gooey mess before his eyes.

 

[studeb]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigshot The gram measurements refer to the quality of the vinyl, not the weight of the actual record. For the same mass, the better grade of vinyl is denser and heavier. See ya Steve

umm no.

the gram measurements refer to the nominal weight of the record. And yes i have measured quite a few of my records, they all come out about what the label says. The actual composition of vinyl does vary, but not enough to change the density. The "best" vinyl was supposed to have been made by JVC in the mid 70s- early 80s.

But to the origianl question, yes the same records can sound better or worse. A given record can be made several times; the original run, usually considered the best as the lacquers are made from the original master; then a reissue made from a second generation master; then it can be discovered by the audiophile companies, and remastered from the original tapes and reissued on heavier vinyl.

Instead of weighing the records, you can hold them in two hands and flap them up and down. If it flexes it is probably around 100-110g. When you have one heavy with a thin pressing side by side you can tell the difference.

And cleaning products, try "Disk Doctor" for manual cleaning. For automated most people start with a VPI or Nitty Gritty and go from there.