[subguy812]

Have not been back on this thread since I returned my rose gold CF2W but 40 or so pages later y'all are still having the same discussion about non supported codecs and V-MODA's advertising!

Yes its too bad there is no manufacturer response, but that only matters to us Head-Fi'ers and lets face it, we are by far the minority. I doubt any Amazon or Best Buy reviews are screaming about AAC support, but some will probably gripe about aptX and rose gold

Yes I wish we could get past the same tired material in this thread. I hang around here in the rare case any one has questions or wants to discuss worthwhile aspects of this specific headphone.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Have not been back on this thread since I returned my rose gold CF2W but 40 or so pages later y'all are still having the same discussion about non supported codecs and V-MODA's advertising!

Yes its too bad there is no manufacturer response, but that only matters to us Head-Fi'ers and lets face it, we are by far the minority. I doubt any Amazon or Best Buy reviews are screaming about AAC support, but some will probably gripe about aptX and rose gold

For what it's worth, questions about AAC are by far the most common comment I've seen about these headphones on YouTube videos, news articles, reviews, other forums, etc.

 

[Yaroslav]

For what it's worth, questions about AAC are by far the most common comment I've seen about these headphones on YouTube videos, news articles, reviews, other forums, etc.

Well, that's because V-MODA's lead generation comes from online communities and mostly head-fi; they don't do traditional marketing other than sending samples, SMM and Google Ads. M-100 and their previous headphones are known because they are good and praised online.

That's why I don't believe in the "oh the common folk won't care" argument — people will eventually google this thread or reddit discussions.

 

[gLer]

Well, that's because V-MODA's lead generation comes from online communities and mostly head-fi; they don't do traditional marketing other than sending samples, SMM and Google Ads. M-100 and their previous headphones are known because they are good and praised online.

That's why I don't believe in the "oh the common folk won't care" argument — people will eventually google this thread or reddit discussions.

Let's just say if V-Moda followed the same path and crowdsourced the design of the original CW we would have had Cliqfold, AAC and aptX from the start. Guess the marketing and money men got too much of a good thing with the M-100.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Let's just say if V-Moda followed the same path and crowdsourced the design of the original CW we would have had Cliqfold, AAC and aptX from the start. Guess the marketing and money men got too much of a good thing with the M-100.

V-MODA used to scoff at companies that relied on finance people and marketing departments to create products, and was proud of the crowd-sourcing that made M-100 so unique.

 

[MintOtter]

I owned the Sennheiser Momentum 2 Wireless for a good number of months and wanted to try something new. I've also demo'ed the Sony MDR1000x, and P7 Wireless. I purchased the Rose Gold V-MODA Crossfade 2 Wireless, because, in relation to my desires the reviews seemed good. The sound quality was okay at best, I'd put them above the Sony, but below everything else. They were hard for me to listen to for long sessions, It felt a bit like my ears were being attacked with sound, as opposed to comfortably enveloped in it, and oddly, even though the Momentum 2 is known for being quite small, it fit my ears, but the depth of V-MODA was shallow enough for my ears to be pressured uncomfortably.

Ultimately, I ended up buying the ATH-DSR7BT, far and away the best overall experience for me out of the bunch. Especially in terms of musicality, A-B'ing the two headphones, Crossfade 2 Wireless, and ATH-DSR7BT, almost makes me upset about the reviews praising the V-MODA's sound. Maybe my unit was just defective, I don't know, but it wasn't even close.

 

[winslord]

I owned the Sennheiser Momentum 2 Wireless for a good number of months and wanted to try something new. I've also demo'ed the Sony MDR1000x, and P7 Wireless. I purchased the Rose Gold V-MODA Crossfade 2 Wireless, because, in relation to my desires the reviews seemed good. The sound quality was okay at best, I'd put them above the Sony, but below everything else. They were hard for me to listen to for long sessions, It felt a bit like my ears were being attacked with sound, as opposed to comfortably enveloped in it, and oddly, even though the Momentum 2 is known for being quite small, it fit my ears, but the depth of V-MODA was shallow enough for my ears to be pressured uncomfortably.

Ultimately, I ended up buying the ATH-DSR7BT, far and away the best overall experience for me out of the bunch. Especially in terms of musicality, A-B'ing the two headphones, Crossfade 2 Wireless, and ATH-DSR7BT, almost makes me upset about the reviews praising the V-MODA's sound. Maybe my unit was just defective, I don't know, but it wasn't even close.

I have a feeling yours might be defective, just like my Matte Black. Everybody that tested my song on wireless mode reported no distortion. A V-MODA tech also diagnosed the problem on a Rose Gold and a Matte White but he said on that song he didn't notice any particular difference between wired and wireless, while I did on mine. But if mine is indeed defective, there are other defective batches because my SECOND Matte Black distorted too in that particular song.

 

[skyejack]

I owned the Sennheiser Momentum 2 Wireless for a good number of months and wanted to try something new. I've also demo'ed the Sony MDR1000x, and P7 Wireless. I purchased the Rose Gold V-MODA Crossfade 2 Wireless, because, in relation to my desires the reviews seemed good. The sound quality was okay at best, I'd put them above the Sony, but below everything else. They were hard for me to listen to for long sessions, It felt a bit like my ears were being attacked with sound, as opposed to comfortably enveloped in it, and oddly, even though the Momentum 2 is known for being quite small, it fit my ears, but the depth of V-MODA was shallow enough for my ears to be pressured uncomfortably.

Ultimately, I ended up buying the ATH-DSR7BT, far and away the best overall experience for me out of the bunch. Especially in terms of musicality, A-B'ing the two headphones, Crossfade 2 Wireless, and ATH-DSR7BT, almost makes me upset about the reviews praising the V-MODA's sound. Maybe my unit was just defective, I don't know, but it wasn't even close.

I don't think yours are defective. My wife has had the rose gold model for over a month, and put in more than enough hours to burn in the drivers and I still find them to be too harsh for me to enjoy for music, gaming or movies. They're just really unpleasant. I much prefer my M100s.

 

[subguy812]

These veer from the more traditional V-MODA house sound where the bass is loose, flabby and uncontrolled to a degree ie. M-100. It is the first V-MODA that has the extension to create a broader soundstage and details and not as congested an boomy. It is the first V-MODA that stuck a toe over the line of the usual fun signature. Obviously, it wont be for everyone particularly the usual V-MODA crowd. Wired they are more controlled than wireless. Wireless reminds me more of the house sound, a little more loose and uncontrolled. I think it is interesting someone mentioned they also didn't like the Sony MDR1000X which also have been reviewed well and many of the reviewers placed them at the top of the BT heap. I also am a fan of the Sennheiser M2 Wireless, it was my go to since it's release. The CF2W has replaced it and the M2 was sold. Sennheiser is known for it's smooth and creamy mids and they are an easy listen and premium product. I know they also don't have all of the codec's folks may want, that is not important to me.

 

[gLer]

I owned the Sennheiser Momentum 2 Wireless for a good number of months and wanted to try something new. I've also demo'ed the Sony MDR1000x, and P7 Wireless. I purchased the Rose Gold V-MODA Crossfade 2 Wireless, because, in relation to my desires the reviews seemed good. The sound quality was okay at best, I'd put them above the Sony, but below everything else. They were hard for me to listen to for long sessions, It felt a bit like my ears were being attacked with sound, as opposed to comfortably enveloped in it, and oddly, even though the Momentum 2 is known for being quite small, it fit my ears, but the depth of V-MODA was shallow enough for my ears to be pressured uncomfortably.

Ultimately, I ended up buying the ATH-DSR7BT, far and away the best overall experience for me out of the bunch. Especially in terms of musicality, A-B'ing the two headphones, Crossfade 2 Wireless, and ATH-DSR7BT, almost makes me upset about the reviews praising the V-MODA's sound. Maybe my unit was just defective, I don't know, but it wasn't even close.

If the C2W sound sig is anything like the original CW and M-100, soundstage is going to be very narrow so the music seems to come at you all at once. That's great for some, but once I experienced the wider soundstage and more controlled bass of the P7, it almost "opened my ears". I moved away from V-Moda after that, but it's a personal preference. A lot of modern music sounds great on the V-Modas.

A V-MODA tech also diagnosed the problem on a Rose Gold and a Matte White but he said on that song he didn't notice any particular difference between wired and wireless, while I did on mine.

Well there's wireless and there's wireless. Your source and codecs have a huge impact on what you'll hear in wireless mode. If you read through my previous posts on this thread, V-Moda pulled the wool over our eyes with wireless codec support, at least with the original CW.

 

[WCMTWS]

If the C2W sound sig is anything like the original CW and M-100, soundstage is going to be very narrow so the music seems to come at you all at once. That's great for some, but once I experienced the wider soundstage and more controlled bass of the P7, it almost "opened my ears". I moved away from V-Moda after that, but it's a personal preference. A lot of modern music sounds great on the V-Modas.



Well there's wireless and there's wireless. Your source and codecs have a huge impact on what you'll hear in wireless mode. If you read through my previous posts on this thread, V-Moda pulled the wool over our eyes with wireless codec support, at least with the original CW.

Beating a dead horse, but this is the most disappointing thing for me. Guess ill wait to see what the CF3 have in store...

 

[PDevil]

Have you tried the same song in wired mode? My matte black sounds different between the two modes. 0:15-0:16 distorted badly on Bluetooth, but is very clear on wired mode. You have the rose gold?

I have the rose gold and did not listen in wired mode, only in wireless with both SBC and aptX. Like I said, I am not familiar with the source material and I didn't hear any distortion when played back in either mode on my Mac Mini when streaming directly from Apple Music (sorry, I didn't want to add it to my library and download the song as I didn't want Apple Music to start changing its recommendations). The song sounded fine to me.

AAC support was mostly advertised on forums, but it ALSO was featured on the site. I don't agree with your idea that it's only fraud if it's in the box — as well as a lot of people in this thread, I buy from V-MODA.com directly and it was on the site for sure.

I never said that it's only fraud if something is printed on the box. I'm just saying that people were initially only quoting the video interview that Val did and saying that the website listed AAC support. It's gone now so there's no proof that it was listed on the website (I believe the people claiming it was on there though). What I am trying to get across is that yes, it is a shame that V-Moda isn't more open about the codecs they support (aside from aptX) and that they don't step up and apologize to the small, niche base here who have taken offense to what Val said (in the forums, in the video, and on the website) and what the company actually did with the CFW1's. But, if people are going to hold V-Moda accountable for this, why aren't other companies held to the same standards. Do we really know if those MDR-1000X headphones are operating in AAC mode or are they spazzing out and reverting back to SBC? I don't remember seeing people pour over the absence of AAC with the wireless Momentum 2.0's and how awful they sounded when paired with an iPhone. If people are this much up in arms about V-Moda's CFW1 headphones, I think they should scrutinize every other pair of "professional" Bluetooth headphones advertising advanced codec support.

That's why I don't believe in the "oh the common folk won't care" argument — people will eventually google this thread or reddit discussions.

But the average headphone consumer really doesn't care, they aren't even aware of the concept of Bluetooth codecs. These are the people that do little to no research and are happy buying name brands (Sony, Bose, Beats) because they are familiar with the brands. The average consumer isn't buying a pair of Sony MDR-1000X's because they support a multitude of codecs, they are buying them because they are made by Sony and the sales person said they sound better than the similar Bose headphones. Some people will do more advanced research and that will likely lead them to this thread but, if they actually read it, they will see that most people are enjoying the sound quality of the CF2W's regardless of what codec is being used. That nobody has come out with a blind, volume-matched test where they were actually able to differentiate between aptX and SBC mode.

 

[Yaroslav]

I never said that it's only fraud if something is printed on the box. I'm just saying that people were initially only quoting the video interview that Val did and saying that the website listed AAC support. It's gone now so there's no proof that it was listed on the website (I believe the people claiming it was on there though). What I am trying to get across is that yes, it is a shame that V-Moda isn't more open about the codecs they support (aside from aptX) and that they don't step up and apologize to the small, niche base here who have taken offense to what Val said (in the forums, in the video, and on the website) and what the company actually did with the CFW1's. But, if people are going to hold V-Moda accountable for this, why aren't other companies held to the same standards. Do we really know if those MDR-1000X headphones are operating in AAC mode or are they spazzing out and reverting back to SBC? I don't remember seeing people pour over the absence of AAC with the wireless Momentum 2.0's and how awful they sounded when paired with an iPhone. If people are this much up in arms about V-Moda's CFW1 headphones, I think they should scrutinize every other pair of "professional" Bluetooth headphones advertising advanced codec support.

There is proof that it was listed on the website — just check web.archive.org. I've even linked proof with a direct link right here, in this thread, several days ago. Here you go again: http://web.archive.org/web/20161027231226/http://v-moda.com:80/crossfade-wireless

Val also chanted praise for AAC+ in his post for the original CFW, and the post is still there. You're making it sound like a conspiracy theory, but it's all visible in a couple of clicks.

We do know that MDR's support AAC, as it is easy to validate that on any Mac computer. Linux, probably, too. Sure, the host can decide to use SBC, but the fact is, several people here aren't even able to run a single AAC connection for CFW.

Wireless Momentums never announced any Bluetooth codec support other than AptX specifically. People contacted Sennheiser support to make it clear — and support was clear that they only support "A2DP" (translation, SBC only). That is mentioned several times in the Momentum Wireless thread on head-fi, and there is a huge /r/headphones post on that as well.

But the average headphone consumer really doesn't care, they aren't even aware of the concept of Bluetooth codecs. These are the people that do little to no research and are happy buying name brands (Sony, Bose, Beats) because they are familiar with the brands. The average consumer isn't buying a pair of Sony MDR-1000X's because they support a multitude of codecs, they are buying them because they are made by Sony and the sales person said they sound better than the similar Bose headphones. Some people will do more advanced research and that will likely lead them to this thread but, if they actually read it, they will see that most people are enjoying the sound quality of the CF2W's regardless of what codec is being used. That nobody has come out with a blind, volume-matched test where they were actually able to differentiate between aptX and SBC mode.

First, I think you disrespect "the average consumer", whoever that is. Just operating on the hypothesis that people are sheep is not something I can relate to.

Second, V-MODA is a brand mostly known among headphone enthusiasts (and I mean that in a very large sense of the word, including generic reddits, YouTube review/unpacking videos, etc.). Enthusiasts care.

Third, a codec is something the general public actually understands quite well, as most pricey Bluetooth headphones right now have AptX support, and they have that advertised right on the box, as well as in any online profile. Momentum, again, would be a good example. It's hard for a non-technical person to understand where in the Bluetooth layered stack should "AptX" go, or how do you "turn it on", but it's common knowledge now that "AptX Bluetooth headphones sound better", that's the whole point of this vendor-locked (unlike AAC) codec.

 

[gLer]

But the average headphone consumer really doesn't care, they aren't even aware of the concept of Bluetooth codecs. These are the people that do little to no research and are happy buying name brands (Sony, Bose, Beats) because they are familiar with the brands. The average consumer isn't buying a pair of Sony MDR-1000X's because they support a multitude of codecs, they are buying them because they are made by Sony and the sales person said they sound better than the similar Bose headphones. Some people will do more advanced research and that will likely lead them to this thread but, if they actually read it, they will see that most people are enjoying the sound quality of the CF2W's regardless of what codec is being used. That nobody has come out with a blind, volume-matched test where they were actually able to differentiate between aptX and SBC mode.

The average consumer also doesn't hang out at head-fi, and if they do they've probably no longer average consumers but more invested in their purchases. If this forum is about the quest for the best possible sound quality and pushing the envelope of products that deliver it, then we as forum members must hold vendors who claim to share this goal (like Val by way of his active participation here) to account and to a higher standard. Quite frankly I don't care if the average consumer thinks Apple's EarPods are the bomb (most do, and that's fine), but when you're looking to spend $300+ on a wireless headphone, and you're lurking/taking part in more technical discussions on head-fi, you have an obligation to call a spade a spade (or a foul a foul). I would say the same goes for Sony, B&W, Sennheiser, and any and all vendors who claim to be pushing the state of the art. If I owned a pair of Sony or Senn headphones that claimed to support AAC, or MP3, or aptX, and then didn't, I'd be shouting just as loudly.

 

[skyejack]

I have the rose gold and did not listen in wired mode, only in wireless with both SBC and aptX. Like I said, I am not familiar with the source material and I didn't hear any distortion when played back in either mode on my Mac Mini when streaming directly from Apple Music (sorry, I didn't want to add it to my library and download the song as I didn't want Apple Music to start changing its recommendations). The song sounded fine to me.



I never said that it's only fraud if something is printed on the box. I'm just saying that people were initially only quoting the video interview that Val did and saying that the website listed AAC support. It's gone now so there's no proof that it was listed on the website (I believe the people claiming it was on there though). What I am trying to get across is that yes, it is a shame that V-Moda isn't more open about the codecs they support (aside from aptX) and that they don't step up and apologize to the small, niche base here who have taken offense to what Val said (in the forums, in the video, and on the website) and what the company actually did with the CFW1's. But, if people are going to hold V-Moda accountable for this, why aren't other companies held to the same standards. Do we really know if those MDR-1000X headphones are operating in AAC mode or are they spazzing out and reverting back to SBC? I don't remember seeing people pour over the absence of AAC with the wireless Momentum 2.0's and how awful they sounded when paired with an iPhone. If people are this much up in arms about V-Moda's CFW1 headphones, I think they should scrutinize every other pair of "professional" Bluetooth headphones advertising advanced codec support.



But the average headphone consumer really doesn't care, they aren't even aware of the concept of Bluetooth codecs. These are the people that do little to no research and are happy buying name brands (Sony, Bose, Beats) because they are familiar with the brands. The average consumer isn't buying a pair of Sony MDR-1000X's because they support a multitude of codecs, they are buying them because they are made by Sony and the sales person said they sound better than the similar Bose headphones. Some people will do more advanced research and that will likely lead them to this thread but, if they actually read it, they will see that most people are enjoying the sound quality of the CF2W's regardless of what codec is being used. That nobody has come out with a blind, volume-matched test where they were actually able to differentiate between aptX and SBC mode.

It's ok to deceive your audience as long as they're not aware you're deceiving them and as long as the only people aware of your deception is a "small/niche" group? I'm sure your attempts to minimize V-Moda's anti-consumer actions are appreciated at the home office. If you have evidence of Sennheiser or Sony lying about the codecs they support, present it. Otherwise you're doing nothing but creating strawmen in yet another attempt to diminish what it is V-Moda willfully has done. Sennheiser and Sony aren't the ones coming here and selling directly to us, so you can't really blame us for feeling a bit disillusioned. Val showed up, did the hard sell, and then immediately left once codec questions were asked.