[rmsanger]

I currently have a Thorens TD 125 MkII SME 3009 Series II improved turntable with an entry level AT cart. I'd like to get something that provides more detail as well as more low/high end punch. Based upon what I've been able to find this version of the 3009 "Improved" is designed for higher compliance and somewhat lighter cartridges than the earlier arms.

Here is what I've narrowed it down to thus far:

DL-301 MkII - $400
Shure V15-II w/ jico sas stylus - $400
Dynavector 10 x 5 High - $750
Audio-Technica AT33EV - $475
Grado Gold 1.5mV - $600
SoundSmith Carmen - $800
SoundSmith Otello - $380

The 3009 Series II improved has a mass of 6.5g so it's a low mass tonearm that needs a high compliance cartridge.
http://www.analogue-classics.com/html/s ... _3012.html

Something with a dynamic compliance of > 20 @ 10 Hz. Confusing is that many japanese manufacturers states compliance @ 100 Hz instead of 10 Hz. There is no exact conversion from 100 to 10 Hz, but > 10 @ 100 Hz and around 40 static should mean a highish compliance cartridge.

Do you have any other suggestions or 1 on this list that is a must? I was leaning toward the Shure v15 & Jico combo but not sure. Unfortunately I don't have the ability to demo any of these before purchase.

 

[rmsanger]

bumpage.. any suggestions on a cart upgrade?

 

[dninsan]

I don't think you'd get too much feedback on the matter in this forum, not a lot of turntable love around

I wish I could help you, but not too sure, here are some links which may help:

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index...suited-for-sme-3009-series-2-improved.785228/
https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/viewtopic.php?t=39004
https://theartofsound.net/forum/sho...ge-options-for-SME-3009-Series-2-Non-improved
https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/thre...a-vintage-sme-3009-series-iii-tonearm.665381/
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/sme-3009-ii-wich-cartridge

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Maybe ask on Hoffman forums. The cartridges I knew and loved are not made anymore and I've been away from vinyl for too long.

 

[bmichels]

One sure choice is Shure V15-II w/ jico SAS stylus . This is what that I choosed for my own refurbished TD160 with a SME3009 serie II Improved.

 

[rmsanger]

Maybe ask on Hoffman forums. The cartridges I knew and loved are not made anymore and I've been away from vinyl for too long.

Thanks I'll check with them!

 

[rmsanger]

One sure choice is Shure V15-II w/ jico SAS stylus . This is what that I choosed for my own refurbished TD160 with a SME3009 serie II Improved.

Thank you, such a beautiful TT!

I'm going down the rabbit hole of audio forums at this point to research.. Trying Hoffman, Auidokarma, and Vinyl engine to research. Initial feedback was either go Shure V15 but I was seeing discrepant information if the V15-II or V15-III is better with the 3009 series II improved. The suggestion from Vinyl engine was to get a cart with compliance > 20.

I'm also getting advice that the Grace F9e (extended) in Ruby is a great cart for this setup as well. I might end up having to buy multiple try them and then sell remaining.

 

[bmichels]

I wond

Thank you, such a beautiful TT!

I'm going down the rabbit hole of audio forums at this point to research.. Trying Hoffman, Auidokarma, and Vinyl engine to research. Initial feedback was either go Shure V15 but I was seeing discrepant information if the V15-II or V15-III is better with the 3009 series II improved. The suggestion from Vinyl engine was to get a cart with compliance > 20.

I'm also getting advice that the Grace F9e (extended) in Ruby is a great cart for this setup as well. I might end up having to buy multiple try them and then sell remaining.

thanks for your replies.

I wonder if the modern cartridges from Sumiko, that have compliance as high as 18 and a low weight, could do it ?

MC Sumiko Songbird : 989 €, Compliance : 18, Weight : 8,5 g. High Output: 2,5 mv

Principe : MC haut niveau
Diamant : elliptique 0.3 x 0.7 microns
Cantilever : aluminium creux enduit
Bobine : pur cuivre
Bande passante : 12 Hz - 40 Khz
Niveau de sortie : 2.5 mV
Séparation des canaux : 30 dB
Equilibre entre les canaux : < 0.5 dB
Compliance : 18 (x10-6cm/dyne)
Impédance interne : 135 Ohms
Impédance de charge : 47 KOhms
Capacitance de charge : 100 - 200 pF
Gamme de force de lecture : 1.8/2.2 g
Force d'appui recommandée : 2.0 g
Poids total de la cellule : 8.5 g


MC Sumiko Starling : 1989 €, Compliance : 18, Weight : 9,5 g. low Output: 0,5 mv

Principe : MC bas niveau
Diamant : Micro Ridge
Cantilever : en Bore
Bobine : pur cuivre
Bande passante : 12 Hz - 50 Khz
Niveau de sortie : 0.5 mV
Séparation des canaux : 35 dB
Équilibre entre les canaux : <0.5 dB
Compliance : 18 (x10-6cm/dyne)
Impédance interne : 28 Ohms
Impédance de charge : 100 Ohms minimum
Capacitance de charge : 100 - 200 pF
Gamme de force de lecture : 1.8/2.2 g
Force d'appui recommandée : 2.0 g
Poids total de la cellule : 9.5 g

MC low oiutput Sumiko Black Bird Lo: 1 389,00 €, Compliance : 12, Weight : 9.6 g

MC Sumiko Blue Point Special EVO III low output : 589 €, Compliance : 12, Weight : 8,3 g

 

[sharkz]

It was suggested earlier but I would definitively recommend checking out AudioKarma. That group has a huge knowledge base and sometimes it won't be necessary to totally break the bank to get a big upgrade.

 

[bmichels]

It was suggested earlier but I would definitively recommend checking out AudioKarma. That group has a huge knowledge base and sometimes it won't be necessary to totally break the bank to get a big upgrade.

thanks a lot

 

[rmsanger]

I ended up buying this bad boy Grace F9e Ruby:
https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/viewtopic.php?f=106&t=116062

I found more help at vinyl engine than at AudioKarma but that could have just been my experience.

 

[bmichels]

Maybe someone knoledgeable with JICO Stylus can help: I ordered a JICO VN35HE SAS/S saphir for my SHURE V15 III, and I wonder if I received the correct stylus.
On the white box there is the marking " MODEL No. VN35HE SAS/S", and on the top of the cardboard inside cristal box it says " Super Analog Stylus series" & there is a SAPHIRE logo. So, it looks OK.

BUT... on the side of the cardbox inside the cristal box, there is a label marking " 192-VN35HE " !? I was expecting to see something like " 192-VN35HE SAS/S " !

--> is there a way to know if I have the corect SAS/S Stlus or if there is a packing mistake and I got only a "standard" VN35HE ( NON SAS ) ?

thank you in advance for your help

 

[bagwell359]

I just read the first post - and said Ruby out loud. Good move. That's a nice set-up. I also found over time that the compliance rules could be bent a bit. If you are using a record clamp or weight, and your vinyl is in good shape warp wise.

Do you have speakers too? Make sure the TT is as isolated from the woofers as possible. If just a TT - then footfalls. Enjoy!

 

[rmsanger]

Maybe someone knoledgeable with JICO Stylus can help: I ordered a JICO VN35HE SAS/S saphir for my SHURE V15 III, and I wonder if I received the correct stylus.
On the white box there is the marking " MODEL No. VN35HE SAS/S", and on the top of the cardboard inside cristal box it says " Super Analog Stylus series" & there is a SAPHIRE logo. So, it looks OK.

BUT... on the side of the cardbox inside the cristal box, there is a label marking " 192-VN35HE " !? I was expecting to see something like " 192-VN35HE SAS/S " !

--> is there a way to know if I have the corect SAS/S Stlus or if there is a packing mistake and I got only a "standard" VN35HE ( NON SAS ) ?

thank you in advance for your help

You may want to ask Audio Karma or Vinyl engine... I was told the SAS is better than non SAS but it may depend upon your tonearm.

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/v15-iii-jico-vn35he-non-sas-vs-sas.194960/

 

[]eep]

sorry I didn't reply earlier. I'm not always browsing all corners here.

You have a ruby cantilever, that means a super analog stylus. But is labeled as a replacement for the VN35HE, only better. Stylus replacements labeling can be very confusing since Joe average only knows what he needs a replacement for...

I have a TD115 and I'm not fond of the light arm. It's limiting the choice of modern carts to just a few. Replacement styli are getting scarce and thus expensive. Etc etc.

Vinyl engine would be the place to go since there is a lot of knowledge there, only there are also a bunch of errr, 'strong minded individuals' that want to push their opinions and do not tolerate anything else. Like if I say I have an Ortofon OM10 on my TD115 and I really dislike it (lifeless, boring and killing the hobby. It's the first thing I upgraded 35y ago and that plunged me into a world of ear candy. But that's moot now. I think you made a good choice. Enjoy!