[docholliday]

Do they though? The diagram on the UE Pro 18+ webpage has this:

Which still has nozzles and sound tubes, unlike TIA.

It doesn't seem to be as much about the construction as it is the new driver design and the acoustic path the drivers are mounted in to ensure accurate output. I'd say that UE's definition of "custom drivers" has more to do with having the buying power to order drivers like the WBFK made in any of the 13 configurations that they offer. It's more likely that the big guys like JH, UE, UM have the pull with Sonion and Knowles to get them to custom make a batch of drivers specifically to their specs.
 
There is an article here: http://www.knowles.com/eng/premiumsound/Resource-center titled "Measuring Balanced Armature Drivers for Hi-Res Audio Earphones" that talks about measuring the WBFK in compliance with the Hi-Res Audio standard requirements and how devices much reach 40KHz to be certified "Hi-Res", with exception to earpieces and speakers.
 
JH has FreqPhase patented. I think the True Tone stuff has a bit to do with UE's own version of tone/phase accuracy as well.

 

[ForceMajeure]

Do they though? 

 

Look carefully at the picture you uploaded in your first post.
 

 
The driver in the middle is place vertically having the solder pads facing up. You can see the opening.
This driver is firing directly from it's diaphragm into the widest bore through a red damper (wider doesn't constrain higher frequencies).
The other 2 drivers ("more conventional" ED26805 and CI) goes through smaller bores and red dampers either.
 
 
 
"

Q: What are True Tone drivers?

Joe: True Tone drivers are proprietary balanced armatures  that focus on the overtones and harmonics, so that you can hear and feel the emotional qualities of the music."

 
http://ultimateearsuniversity.com/

 

[miceblue]

It doesn't seem to be as much about the construction as it is the new driver design and the acoustic path the drivers are mounted in to ensure accurate output. I'd say that UE's definition of "custom drivers" has more to do with having the buying power to order drivers like the WBFK made in any of the 13 configurations that they offer. It's more likely that the big guys like JH, UE, UM have the pull with Sonion and Knowles to get them to custom make a batch of drivers specifically to their specs.

There is an article here: http://www.knowles.com/eng/premiumsound/Resource-center titled "Measuring Balanced Armature Drivers for Hi-Res Audio Earphones" that talks about measuring the WBFK in compliance with the Hi-Res Audio standard requirements and how devices much reach 40KHz to be certified "Hi-Res", with exception to earpieces and speakers.

JH has FreqPhase patented. I think the True Tone stuff has a bit to do with UE's own version of tone/phase accuracy as well.

Look carefully at the picture you uploaded in your first post.




The driver in the middle is place vertically having the solder pads facing up. You can see the opening.
This driver is firing directly from it's diaphragm into the widest bore through a red damper (wider doesn't constrain higher frequencies).
The other 2 drivers ("more conventional" ED26805 and CI) goes through smaller bores and red dampers either.

Q: What are True Tone drivers?
Joe: True Tone drivers are proprietary balanced armatures  that focus on the overtones and harmonics, so that you can hear and feel the emotional qualities of the music."

http://ultimateearsuniversity.com/

Ah okay, I see it now. From Jude's new video, the True Tone drivers are the balanced armatures, while the Sound Engine enclosure is the sound guide tube things that the patent covers.

[video]https://youtu.be/qf4ilaX37Kw?t=7m41s[/video]


Interesting stuff. I'll be attending CanJam SoCal this coming weekend. I wonder if Audio Precision's dummy head is able to take okay measurements of my UERR. I'd be interested in how they perform objectively.

 

[docholliday]

Ah okay, I see it now. From Jude's new video, the True Tone drivers are the balanced armatures, while the Sound Engine enclosure is the sound guide tube things that the patent covers.


Interesting stuff. I'll be attending CanJam SoCal this coming weekend. I wonder if Audio Precision's dummy head is able to take okay measurements of my UERR. I'd be interested in how they perform objectively.

If they can, I'd definitely be interested to see your results, if yours are full custom...

 

[ForceMajeure]

Interesting stuff. I'll be attending CanJam SoCal this coming weekend. I wonder if Audio Precision's dummy head is able to take okay measurements of my UERR. I'd be interested in how they perform objectively.

If your pair is a custom they'll probably will need to have silicone ears that are conform to your ears and ear canals to be able to measure them though.

 

[miceblue]

If they can, I'd definitely be interested to see your results, if yours are full custom...

If your pair is a custom they'll probably will need to have silicone ears that are conform to your ears and ear canals to be able to measure them though.

Yeah I'm hoping they have the full-size KEMAR head and torso simulator with the more flexible ear pieces versus the portable ear simulator. I got my STAX measured at CanJam at RMAF, but they had the portable simulator and the ears were super stiff.

 

[Nqstv]

Hey All,
 
Another interested consumer here.  I've been interested in the UE Reference for years, but only recently have decided I might foot the bill.  Here's where I'm coming from;  Currently use a pair of IE800 with either a Fiio X7 or Fiio X5iii with Mojo.  I'm absolutely in love with the signature of these setups.  But, I want to step wholeheartedly into the CIEM world.  I also play and write some as well, mostly in home studio work, so I think the UERR would be good for that.  My questions are these;
 
1.  How drastic is the difference between the IE800 and UERR?  My thought is that I can get used to any changes simply based on the quality of both.  And I like the thought of having the reference set. 
2.  I live north of Seattle, so getting to LA wouldn't be an option.  Are there any reps or audiologists in the area I can talk to and/or get impressions from (Assuming that there might be a fellow Head-Fi-ian up in this area).  Is the laser molding a more common practice now or is it still ear filler to get molds?
3.  I also have a set of Westone W40's that I've bought multiple cables for (balanced...etc).  Can I use these cables with the UERR? (Same connector?)  Or would it be better to order or get a set of balanced cables along with standard from UE?
 
What I love about the IE800 is the deep controlled bass, wide soundstage and controlled mids.  I understand that they're colored compared to reference (I've owned ER4S in the past which I consider to be the closest I've ever come to reference). 
 
I guess, ultimately, what I'm looking for is another set that will let me get lost in the music.  I can be a bit analytical at times when listening, but I also like the sound to just envelope me and get lost in the feel of it.  Make sense?  Would the UERR do this?  I'm sorta hoping UERR would be endgame as well.  I've spent way too much on headphones and gear   The wallet hates me.
 
Thanks a ton for your help.

 

[twice tzuyu]

  Hey All,
 
Another interested consumer here.  I've been interested in the UE Reference for years, but only recently have decided I might foot the bill.  Here's where I'm coming from;  Currently use a pair of IE800 with either a Fiio X7 or Fiio X5iii with Mojo.  I'm absolutely in love with the signature of these setups.  But, I want to step wholeheartedly into the CIEM world.  I also play and write some as well, mostly in home studio work, so I think the UERR would be good for that.  My questions are these;
 
1.  How drastic is the difference between the IE800 and UERR?  My thought is that I can get used to any changes simply based on the quality of both.  And I like the thought of having the reference set. 
2.  I live north of Seattle, so getting to LA wouldn't be an option.  Are there any reps or audiologists in the area I can talk to and/or get impressions from (Assuming that there might be a fellow Head-Fi-ian up in this area).  Is the laser molding a more common practice now or is it still ear filler to get molds?
3.  I also have a set of Westone W40's that I've bought multiple cables for (balanced...etc).  Can I use these cables with the UERR? (Same connector?)  Or would it be better to order or get a set of balanced cables along with standard from UE?
 
What I love about the IE800 is the deep controlled bass, wide soundstage and controlled mids.  I understand that they're colored compared to reference (I've owned ER4S in the past which I consider to be the closest I've ever come to reference). 
 
I guess, ultimately, what I'm looking for is another set that will let me get lost in the music.  I can be a bit analytical at times when listening, but I also like the sound to just envelope me and get lost in the feel of it.  Make sense?  Would the UERR do this?  I'm sorta hoping UERR would be endgame as well.  I've spent way too much on headphones and gear   The wallet hates me.
 
Thanks a ton for your help.

I can't answer 1 and 2 but I can for 3. The UERR uses a recessed 2 pin connector. The Westone W40 uses a MMCX connector instead so you won't be able to use it on the UERR. You can get another 2pin cable that terminates in a balanced plug if you wish to use the UERR balanced.

 

[docholliday]

  I can't answer 1 and 2 but I can for 3. The UERR uses a recessed 2 pin connector. The Westone W40 uses a MMCX connector instead so you won't be able to use it on the UERR. You can get another 2pin cable that terminates in a balanced plug if you wish to use the UERR balanced.

The UERR's connector isn't recessed (into the IEM), it's extended (chimney away from the IEM). Normal JH/Westone style 2-pin connectors will fit, but extend far away from the shell and don't have the extra support of the connectors shroud. It's best to get the actual cable from UE. The UM cable may fit, but I'm not sure how their pinout is. Remember that UE custom's pinout is the opposite of a normal 2-pin (JH/Westone) pinout and different from the TF10 pinout in that the sides are symmetrical. With the IEM in your ear, JH style shows + towards the top. With UE custom, it's ground that's towards the top.
 
As far as your impressions go, you can have any decent hearing-aid audiologist do it. The one I use doesn't usually do IEM stuff, but has done perfect impressions for me. When you order, UE will give you a page to print and take to them for instructions. Be sure to do it open mouth, with the bite block. If they don't have bite blocks at hand, find something hard but solid. I bite on a pack of smokes which has given me a perfect fit and seal that doesn't break when talking or yawning without any discomfort.
 
I actually like the silicone impressions better than the laser scan - there's less margin of error as the material will expand a touch to fill any spaces.

 

[olddude]

The UE Balanced cables are excellent and not at all pricey, and the iems are tuned to them and vice versa. I have had many after-market cables for my other iems, but I only use UE-made cables with my UERM.  

 

[Nqstv]

Thanks for the responses, guys.  That answers most of my questions.  I'll get a second balanced cable from UE.  That way, there's no question. And I'll find a good audiologist here locally.
 
What about sound?  Are the UERRs the kind of phone to get lost in, or are they really analytical?  Like I said before, but I'll put it a different way, I can be into the science of the music, but mostly, I want to get into the emotion of it.  After reading the entire thread, I'm thinking these sorta meet both aspects, but I'm wondering to which side of the scale do they tip?  Science or Emotion.
 
Really appreciate the help so far!

 

[ejong7]

  Thanks for the responses, guys.  That answers most of my questions.  I'll get a second balanced cable from UE.  That way, there's no question. And I'll find a good audiologist here locally.
 
What about sound?  Are the UERRs the kind of phone to get lost in, or are they really analytical?  Like I said before, but I'll put it a different way, I can be into the science of the music, but mostly, I want to get into the emotion of it.  After reading the entire thread, I'm thinking these sorta meet both aspects, but I'm wondering to which side of the scale do they tip?  Science or Emotion.
 
Really appreciate the help so far!

I previously did a duo review for the UERR so if you follow the link on my signature you can get two people's opinion on it!
 
But to directly answer your question, i feel within the spectrum they may lean towards analytical, so more science. Don't get me wrong they are certainly not cold, actually fairly musical, but since its so highly detailed it would probably be labeled under 'analytical'.
 
So if you want more lushness, perhaps you should turn to the 18+ Pro under the UE line, since its basically the UERR with more oomph and some extra sparkle. If you like a more true to music taste, definitely the UERR.

 

[Marc Lian]

  Thanks for the responses, guys.  That answers most of my questions.  I'll get a second balanced cable from UE.  That way, there's no question. And I'll find a good audiologist here locally.
 
What about sound?  Are the UERRs the kind of phone to get lost in, or are they really analytical?  Like I said before, but I'll put it a different way, I can be into the science of the music, but mostly, I want to get into the emotion of it.  After reading the entire thread, I'm thinking these sorta meet both aspects, but I'm wondering to which side of the scale do they tip?  Science or Emotion.
 
Really appreciate the help so far!

It's tilted slightly to the analytical side. It strikes a good balance of musical and analytical as the mid to high frequencies are very coherent but never grating or strident.

 

[Nqstv]

Okay, that makes sense.  Being reference, and from what I've read, I'm sure the UERR are not as lush as the IE800.  However, I think it would be a good contrasting set against the Senns.  I do like revealing and accurate.  I think, once I get past my overall laziness, I'll place an order for a set.  I'm pretty excited to hear these.

 

[docholliday]

  Okay, that makes sense.  Being reference, and from what I've read, I'm sure the UERR are not as lush as the IE800.  However, I think it would be a good contrasting set against the Senns.  I do like revealing and accurate.  I think, once I get past my overall laziness, I'll place an order for a set.  I'm pretty excited to hear these.

I wouldn't say they are analytical at all. If you feed it a crappy source, it'll sound crappy. But, if you feed it something that is done well, it will show and shine. The UE18+ will enhance the lower and upper end, so it'll cover up the bad file to make it sound nicer. But, it'll also alter the really well engineered files and bring make them sound overcooked. Plus, with the RR, you can always utilize the EQ and add minor bumps where you want the enhancements.