[sajunky]

all this knowledge you claim to possess were is your state of the art product?

I wrote it already, but you didn't listen. I do actually like L30. The same technology as A90 at more affordable price and it doesn't suffer from the same design defect. More appropriate technology for this price range than $500 range. And such a comment was on topic. You were derailing this thread with a raw of off-topic attacks.

 

[Racheski]

all this knowledge you claim to possess were is your state of the art product?

Stop feeding it!

 

[lantian]

How do topping amps sound. Are they any good subjectively aswell. Measurements are all fine and well. But untill you hear it they mean pretty much nothing.
So far monoprice liqud spark seemed to be the best sounding of the small amps. Though more voltage for high impedence cans would be nice. Spec qise these seem amazing, but are they soundwise any better than say schiit magni3 or the liqud spark.

 

[cel4145]

How do topping amps sound. Are they any good subjectively aswell. Measurements are all fine and well. But untill you hear it they mean pretty much nothing.
So far monoprice liqud spark seemed to be the best sounding of the small amps. Though more voltage for high impedence cans would be nice. Spec qise these seem amazing, but are they soundwise any better than say schiit magni3 or the liqud spark.

Well, how can you describe what an amp sounds like without a reference standard for a neutral, no coloring added sounding amp?

I think it's fair to say that the L30 measures so freaking accurate, with SINAD of 122 and dynamic range of 132db with 4V input, that it can't sound like anything.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...asurement-of-topping-l30-headphone-amp.14252/

If you're looking for an amp with a sound, this is not the amp for you.

 

[lantian]

Well, how can you describe what an amp sounds like without a reference standard for a neutral, no coloring added sounding amp?

I think it's fair to say that the L30 measures so freaking accurate, with SINAD of 122 and dynamic range of 132db with 4V input, that it can't sound like anything.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...asurement-of-topping-l30-headphone-amp.14252/

If you're looking for an amp with a sound, this is not the amp for you.

Not what i asked for. But guess wont get the answer here.
Thanks anyway.

 

[sajunky]

@lantian. You can expect better SQ than A90 on SE connection. Essentially the same performance sans a nasty ground loops design defect. I think L30 will compete well with THX 789 (now a price 'drop' -ed to $299), giving a slight coloured sound in a direct comparison (which doesn't have to be a bad things). It the same extremely high nested loopback technology, so comparison is fair. If you want a real neutral sound, you can't get (for now) from a cheap loopback configuration, a price must be higher. Sometimes it is worth to read about higher priced products to understand value what you get for a price. Look at a review of A90: https://www.avforums.co.za/index.php/topic,88010.msg1006168.html#msg1006168

Remember that a balanced connection was used in this review and a main comparison was made with high-end sounding R28 (class A non-feedback discrete amp).

Be careful when pairing. The input impedance of L30 is only 2.5 kOhms (vs a typical 47 kOhms, it is how Topping has achieved top SINAD figures). It will drop an output level when pairing with a DACs with a passive output with an associated high frequency roll-off.

 

[cel4145]

Not what i asked for. But guess wont get the answer here.
Thanks anyway.

That is a good reply to your question.

If you don't believe you can rely on measurements to determine if an amp is neutral and distortion/noise free, then subjective evaluations like warm or bright or having great clarity only have meaning in reference to another amp.

In other words, those terms are relative to someone's experience with other amps. In the same way that 90° F is a very hot day for me here in Michigan. But it is not considered hot for someone who lives in Las Vegas or Aswan, Egypt. Or in the same way that 40°F is not considered cold where I am, but is considered frigid in those other places.

Amp sound is relative to your experience and what you're used to.

 

[sajunky]

If you don't believe you can rely on measurements to determine if an amp is neutral and distortion/noise free, then subjective evaluations like warm or bright or having great clarity only have meaning in reference to another amp.

How we can believe in measurements when our perception for objective measurements is subjective and in reverse.

I mean that not everything we hear objectively is measured. Instead of developing new measurement methods a slogan came out claiming that measurements are objective and our hearing subjective. What a lame definiion.

Measurement methods didn't change over decades. Only a static sinewaves are analyzed. No dynamic response, even a simple square wave for testing overshots is not taken. But even the amps that do not show overshots do always suffer from a dead time. During such short period any input signal stops being amplified with a proper amplitude and phase, as a negative loopback is broken. Amps like THX, A90, L30 with a nested loopback and a strong open loop gain suffer from a longer dead time. It show as increasing sibilants when present in the recording or other artefacts.

I agree to the point that a direct listening comparison is the best.

 

[cel4145]

How we can believe in measurements when our perception for objective measurements is subjective and in reverse.

I mean that not everything we hear objectively is measured. Instead of developing new measurement methods a slogan came out claiming that measurements are objective and our hearing subjective. What a lame definiion.

Measurement methods didn't change over decades. Only a static sinewaves are analyzed. No dynamic response, even a simple square wave for testing overshots is not taken. But even the amps that do not show overshots do always suffer from a dead time. During such short period any input signal stops being amplified with a proper amplitude and phase, as a negative loopback is broken. Amps like THX, A90, L30 with a nested loopback and a strong open loop gain suffer from a longer dead time. It show as increasing sibilants when present in the recording or other artefacts.

I agree to the point that a direct listening comparison is the best.

Dude. I have no interest in engaging in a debate about objectivism versus subjectivism. This has been done to death on the web over the last dozen years or so, and you are welcome to go Google it and read about it if you want to learn more.

Rather, I was trying to point out that for you to get a subjective evaluation of how the L30 sounds, putting aside whether or not that's reliable, you need someone to compare it to an amp you are familiar with. It has nothing to do with objectivism.

 

[Racheski]

@lantian. You can expect better SQ than A90 on SE connection. Essentially the same performance sans a nasty ground loops design defect. I think L30 will compete well with THX 789 (now a price 'drop' -ed to $299), giving a slight coloured sound in a direct comparison (which doesn't have to be a bad things). It the same extremely high nested loopback technology, so comparison is fair. If you want a real neutral sound, you can't get (for now) from a cheap loopback configuration, a price must be higher. Sometimes it is worth to read about higher priced products to understand value what you get for a price. Look at a review of A90: https://www.avforums.co.za/index.php/topic,88010.msg1006168.html#msg1006168

Remember that a balanced connection was used in this review and a main comparison was made with high-end sounding R28 (class A non-feedback discrete amp).

Be careful when pairing. The input impedance of L30 is only 2.5 kOhms (vs a typical 47 kOhms, it is how Topping has achieved top SINAD figures). It will drop an output level when pairing with a DACs with a passive output with an associated high frequency roll-off.

Almost all of what you are saying is not accurate. My suggestion for anyone looking for more information is to join ASR and talk to the actual person who engineered the product.

 

[chaotic_angel]

Has anyone compare the sound VS the SMSL SP200? are both same in sound characteristics and linearity? I have E30 DAC + SP200 wondering if L30 will provide more benefits please..

Edit: correcting type

 

[Light - Man]

Has anyone compare the sound VS the SMSL SP200? are both same in sound characteristics and linearity? I have A30 DAC + SP200 wondering if L30 will provide more benefits please..

Do you mean the Topping D30 DAC? If so I would lose it in favour of the Topping DX3 Pro which has much better dual DAC chips. The Topping D30 DAC is a very basic budget DAC in today's world that I would consider it obsolete.

 

[cel4145]

Do you mean the Topping D30 DAC? If so I would lose it in favour of the Topping DX3 Pro which has much better dual DAC chips. The Topping D30 DAC is a very basic budget DAC in today's world that I would consider it obsolete.

I thought he was talking about the L30 amp since he was looking for a comparison with the SP200

FYI: The Topping DX3 Pro is a $219 DAC and headphone amp. The Topping E30 for $129 and new D10S for $99 are both better measuring DACs.

 

[chaotic_angel]

Do you mean the Topping D30 DAC? If so I would lose it in favour of the Topping DX3 Pro which has much better dual DAC chips. The Topping D30 DAC is a very basic budget DAC in today's world that I would consider it obsolete.

ups my bad, I mean E30 DAC + SP200

 

[Light - Man]

FYI: The Topping DX3 Pro is a $219 DAC and headphone amp.

Indeed only $219 and if it cost 3 times more it would sound much better to some peoples ears.

BTW I have 2 of theTopping DX3 Pro and mainly use it as a DAC. Its bluetooth sounds fantastic which is another bonus. My previous DAC was the Chord 2Qute and I much prefer the Topping. In my main system I power it with a 12 volt car batter and it sounds wonderful. I really don't heed measurements that much. I wonder if they had measured it using battery power if it would make much difference.