[purrin]

   
Indeed, if you had to, whereabouts would you rank the Uber-Bi purrin (or ninja)?

 
zerodeefex is a ninja.
 
I like the uber-frost, but I need to live longer with it to make a decisive determination. Definitely E, possibly D, but take that with a serious grain of salt. I do like it enough that I may end up buying it.

 

[olor1n]

 No way man. If the Bifrost is E, then the Gungnir is a C. The M51 would of course be an A. Coz it's the Schiit.
 
I'm out of tables to flip in rage here purrin! Gonna go knock over a bookshelf!

 

[purrin]

UPDATE 12/7 11:08pm:
 
Now as how far the Gen2 board lessens this "constantly loudly shouting" effect? (kind of like that Pacific Rim movie where all the actors are ALWAY shouting at each other.) At the risk of sounding ghey, I would say the reduction of this effect is about 80%. The Gen 2 USB not like the quite like the old Gungir Gen 1 USB. I find the DAC with the Gen2 USB just that much more enjoyable now with finesse, refinement, and more plankton. Much more able to reproduce the softest sounds.

For most of today, I switched back and forth between AGD M7 (coax) and Gungnir Gen 2 USB, usually for 1 hour sessions at a time. Quite frankly I couldn't tell the difference if I was not paying attention - they have such similar tone. The AGD M7 via coax is better, offering slightly better clarity and plankton and doing what it does best with the bass texture thing, smokey vocals, denser tone / richer harmonics. But it was so close. Gungir Gen 2 USB was not far behind. Gungnir Gen 2 staging was also better - further out in front. M7 stage was in closer in.

I also threw in the ECZD into the mix to get another perspective.

I'm convinced Maxvla and olor1m would now find the Gen 2 acceptable.

 

[KmanChu]

  My main quibbles (they are not major ones) with the M51 were that sounds were compressed. I felt like that I had to turn the volume knob down on soft sounds and up on loud sounds to get the same effect as the better DACs. The attack was good, but the high treble rendering was off. Not anything annoying or rough, but rather not natural sounding. Sort of like an exquisite silky fine grain. Very open sounding though. It's a good DAC, and I would have purchased it if NAD did not give it the dumb price of $2000 in the USA. (The Aussies lucked out.) I do wonder what magic the OR5 via i2s would have been able to work on it.

The HDMI port apparently doesn't work via the regular HDMI/I2S routes (like PS Audio or W4S.) It works with the NAD M50 and apparently through HDMI protocols but supposedly isn't compatible with the others previously stated. I wish it did as I would have tried it. I use it with a PS3 for watching movies and the sound is very good through the HDMI ports.
 
Sonically, the winningest qualities of the M51 are the absolute background silence and ability to portray high detail and resolution without harshness. Music has a natural and fluid sound. A large part of the appeal of the M51 is the digital volume control: it is unquestionably the best volume control I have used. The backrgound noise it generates is not a function of the volume. The resolution is not affected by the digital volume control, even with high res materials.  I understand some have used it with excellent results in headphone systems, but to me a large part of its appeal is the HDMI ports and the ability for it to act as a control center/preamp in a "home theater 2.0" type of system. It is a unique product in allowing an all digital audiophile stereo system to stand in as an HDMI 1080p capable handler. If you need this functionality in your system it is a no brainer unless you are willing to fork out mega-bucks. I use it in my main rig as a DAC/preamp. For a headphone rig with a typical headphone amp it wouldn't have as much appeal.
 
The M51 is in not the pinnacle of current DACs. But, its unique feature set and sonic qualities make it very competitive at it's price point. It is a piece of equipment that has been described as being simultaneously highly resolving and too polite/smooth. That is a good pair of contradictory descriptors. 

 

[aive]

 
UPDATE 12/7 11:08pm:
 
For most of today, I switched back and forth between AGD M7 (coax) and Gungnir Gen 2 USB, usually for 1 hour sessions at a time. Quite frankly I couldn't tell the difference if I was not paying attention - they have such similar tone. The AGD M7 via coax is better, offering slightly better clarity and plankton and doing what it does best with the bass texture thing, smokey vocals, denser tone / richer harmonics. But it was so close. Gungir Gen 2 USB was not far behind. Gungnir Gen 2 staging was also better - further out in front. M7 stage was in closer in.

 
Awesome thread btw - and a great service for those DAC shopping like myself
 
It's interesting that you rate the Gungnir on par with the AGD M7 - considering the price difference, that is some serious value coming from the Schiit. Makes me want to wait and see what the Yggdrasil will be like! Considering it again will be cheaper than the AGD M7, I'm *almost* (still deciding) keen to wait for it
 
But ignoring the Ygg, my plan is for a AGD M7 + OR5 (or Alpha USB from Berkely Audio) as you recommended in the dedicated M7 thread. Keep up the great work

 

[Maxvla]

I'm convinced Maxvla and olor1m would now find the Gen 2 acceptable.

Unless the rest of the DAC has changed also, it shouldn't affect me as I never heard the Gungnir through USB since mine didn't have it.

 

[schneller]

 
   I have had a teac ud-501 dac since may and it sounds just wonderful in my set up. But I do have to say that after the unit breaks in there were definitely some settings with regards to the filters and upsampling depending on what type of input was used that make a noticeable difference in how this dac sounds. I myself prefer the dac without any pcm filtering at all. I can hear the effect of passing signal through the filtering and I much prefer listening with no filtering at all. It just sounds much better without the filtering. Next when using the usb input I prefer listening with no upsampling engaged. Things sound much clearer and better. Again I can hear the effect of passing the signal through the  additional circuitry.
  I do prefer listening to cds with the dac upsmapling engaged. Things sound more spacious and more resolving with the upsampling in place. But with the usb inpit things sound much better without the upsampling engaged.
  I suspect based on the comments about this dac that the listening was done with upsampling and digital filtering in place.
  Based on the largely positive comments about this dac and my own experience with it that something seems amiss with the evaluation of the teac ud-501 dac.

 
Thanks for the support. I don't own the TEAC but am very close to buying one based on so many positive reviews.

 

[schneller]

Anyone compared the Schiit Gungnir to the Meridian Director DAC? Same price.

 

[Hun7er]

Purrin did compare the Audio GD M7 vs AMR DP777 ?
 
Regards

 

[mrtim6]

Hi Purin, I was wondering what your thoughts are on the Resolution Audio Cantanta Music Centre as a DAC and where it would place in your DAC off. I ask because the DACs used in the RACMC are not saber DACs. I also think it would be competition for people thinking about the invictus.

 

[GoldfishX]

That is actually my problem with Teac, there's not much info about their DAC or amps online. I got to try the headphone amplifier at a local shop and it sounded like a $200 unit (I forget what the rest of the audio chain was, but it was some heavy duty equipment). Very flat, very 2D, sounds like my Lyr before the tubes have warmed up (cool effect, as they warm up, is like a 2D image becoming a 3D image...guilty pleasure I have with it), so I kind of lost interest in their offerings right there.
 
I'd probably be way more interested in the M51, but not at that price point. I'd sooner take my chance with the Gungnir for $750-$850 (got mine less, since it was used, heh) or even the Yulong DA8 at $1300 and save up for something higher end in the $2000-$2500 range.

 

[purrin]

Hi Purin, I was wondering what your thoughts are on the Resolution Audio Cantanta Music Centre as a DAC and where it would place in your DAC off. I ask because the DACs used in the RACMC are not saber DACs. I also think it would be competition for people thinking about the invictus.

 
I heard it many times, but only at HiFi shows on speakers, and with audiophile music I was not familiar with. Which means I can't say anything about it.

 

[thegunner100]

The all our DACs have not use the +5V line, there is better remove the wire if easy operate, if cut the wire but have not remove, it still in the cable as a Ant receive the RF disturb and fire to the data wire.
Kingwa

So I take it to mean that it will be better to physically remove the +5V line from the usb cable rather than to just cut the connection.

 

[purrin]

Yes. Or make a new USB cable from scratch.

 

[thegunner100]

I'll see if anyone can make me a usb cable for cheap, and then compare with a normal usb cable with the +5V in place. At the very least it'll get rid of some noise that I hear when I plug the UERMs into the nfb-10es2 w/ usb.
 
Just noticed that you changed the headphones in the OP to "HD800 Anax 3.0 (Beta)"!