[Music Alchemist]

  The elephant in the room is, if Sennheiser electrostatics were so damned awesome, why can't they compete with Stax at a fraction of the price with their volume manufacturing advantage?

 
When you say compete, what do you mean exactly? Because as far as sound goes, it can go either way. Some people like the Orpheus HE 90 more than any STAX.

 

[fiascogarcia]

   
Car analogies really don't work, because there are clear measures of performance with cars and not so with headphones. You can't just say "I subjectively prefer the speed of this Camry to this Ferrari and it subjectively goes around the track faster", that is nonsense, but you can easily say the same regarding even the original Orpheus and something like the HD650.
 
The elephant in the room is, if Sennheiser electrostatics were so damned awesome, why can't they compete with Stax at a fraction of the price with their volume manufacturing advantage? The answer is exactly the reason why these car analogies don't work.

Well, I guess that using your argument, some may consider them, subjectively, that much better than Stax.  Having said that, there should be no further argument about pricing since performance is subjective and everyone will determine their own opinion about the HE1060/HEV1060's worth.  I think the only point on which I disagree with some people posting on this thread is their implication that Sennheiser has some ethical responsibility to charge a lower, more competitive price.

 

[subtle]

Yes, I have also boycotted Ferrari and Lamborghini, as they have refused to build me a $50,000 exoticar.

..

 

[saidentary]

Before people take the moral high ground and indignant, remember that personal audio hardware is a discretionary hobby. No more and no less. After all one can enjoy music tuning into an FM radio broadcast. Sennheiser is not selling medicine or food. Sennheiser are not the reason there is war and suffering. It is a toy for the well heeled. Last I checked, Sennheisser sell sub-£20 headphones. Relax and breathe

This is a crucially important point, one with which I very strongly agree. But it's still irksome that they claim to be the "best" without any data (only testimonials) and that their main justification for these claims seems to be the price point they've selected.  So....the argument seems to be: they must be the best because they have the highest price.  The price is the highest because they're the best.  (And they're Sennheiser.  And there's marble.  And tubes, and fins, and stuff.)
 
 

 

[Sal1950]

  Yes, I have also boycotted Ferrari and Lamborghini, as they have refused to build me a $50,000 exoticar.

No worries. that will get you a new 2015 C7 Corvette. One of the finest sportcars in the world.

 

[RCBinTN]

   
Talks on the exact sales model and processes are currently in planning. The issues of conditions, tester devices and the presentation of the Orpheus at local events will also be resolved in the near future.

 
Will you guys be demonstrating the system at your HQ outside Hannover?  I will be in ASL in early December, should I plan a trip to your site?  
 
Thank you -
RCBinTN

 

[scorpio187]

   
$12,900. Compensating for inflation from 1991 to 2015, that's over $22,600 in today's dollars.

My point is the price for the first Orpheus was and still is very high. It was meant to be a statement product just like this one. I think people here should quit complaining about it. I mean did you really expect Sennheiser would price this thing like its predecessor? If yes, then BIG mistake!
 
Just saying...

 

[Music Alchemist]

  My point is the price for the first Orpheus was and still is very high. It was meant to be a statement product just like this one. I think people here should quit complaining about it. I mean did you really expect Sennheiser would price this thing like its predecessor? If yes, then BIG mistake!
 
Just saying...

 
Yeah, I mean, like I said before, both myself and my best friend are determined to buy this someday. I'm not the type of person to complain about price. After all, there are plenty of affordable products out there for those who don't want to pay so much.

 

[tonykaz]

Ferrari Dino was not exotic or not very exotic and somewhat an "Everymans" Ferrari.
 
Nice little car.
 
Tony in Michigan

 

[tonykaz]

MisTahhhh 1950, 
 
The Corvette IS the finest Sports Car in the World.
 
How dare you suggest it's "one" of the finest?
 
Warsh yur mouth out with windshield Washing liquid,
 
No desert for you!  
 
Tony in Michigan

 

[tonykaz]

Geez, this is the most fun place of all HeadFi, maybe anywhere on the Internet.
 
Jude ain't even coming around to block out all the bickering.
 
This is one hell-of-a Campfire to sit around. 
 
We even got the Sennheiser guy! 
 
And we got Me!  
 
Tony in Michigan

 

[superlowfi]

   
Yeah, I mean, like I said before, both myself and my best friend are determined to buy this someday. I'm not the type of person to complain about price. After all, there are plenty of affordable products out there for those who don't want to pay so much.

I think this line of thinking speaks to how Sennheiser has shifted from performance based marketing with the previous Orpheus to aspirational based marketing with the second generation version.
 
To stick with the asinine car analogies, the first Orpheus was more like a Ferrari in the sense it was designed to do one thing and one thing really well. For the Ferrari, it was to be fast, competing with companies like McLaren. For the Orpheus, it was to be the best headphone in the world competing directly with the Stax Omega. Sure, the Ferrari has leather seats and the Orpheus had wood, but those were minor features on the back burner of the purpose of these objects.
 
This new Orpheus is more like a Bentley or a Rolls Royce. It is an aspirational luxury lifestyle product. All of a sudden the wood construction on the previous Orpheus gives way to marble construction on the new one. Instead of having pedestrian tubes statically housed in an enclosure, you have motorized tubes and buttons that again reinforce the lifestyle of luxury you are buying.
 
Your money isn't going to product performance. No one cares how fast a Bentley or a Rolls Royce goes around a track. What you are buying is the experience and the pomp and circumstance.
 
I think the people who are attracted to the new Orpheus are those attracted to the luxury lifestyle aspect of what this product represents. There is nothing wrong with buying products on that philosophy, and certainly no one can begrudge another for lusting after a Rolls Royce or this new Orpheus. But at the same time, there are quite a few people out there who are more interested in Ferraris and the purpose they are built for as opposed to the Rolls Royces of the world.
 
It's two different market segments, and it's a fairly interesting contrast between the two versions of Orpheus that were produced by Sennheiser.

 

[Music Alchemist]

  I think this line of thinking speaks to how Sennheiser has shifted from performance based marketing with the previous Orpheus to aspirational based marketing with the second generation version.
 
To stick with the asinine car analogies, the first Orpheus was more like a Ferrari in the sense it was designed to do one thing and one thing really well. For the Ferrari, it was to be fast, competing with companies like McLaren. For the Orpheus, it was to be the best headphone in the world competing directly with the Stax Omega. Sure, the Ferrari has leather seats and the Orpheus had wood, but those were minor features on the back burner of the purpose of these objects.
 
This new Orpheus is more like a Bentley or a Rolls Royce. It is an aspirational luxury lifestyle product. All of a sudden the wood construction on the previous Orpheus gives way to marble construction on the new one. Instead of having pedestrian tubes statically housed in an enclosure, you have motorized tubes and buttons that again reinforce the lifestyle of luxury you are buying.
 
Your money isn't going to product performance. No one cares how fast a Bentley or a Rolls Royce goes around a track. What you are buying is the experience and the pomp and circumstance.
 
I think the people who are attracted to the new Orpheus are those attracted to the luxury lifestyle aspect of what this product represents. There is nothing wrong with buying products on that philosophy, and certainly no one can begrudge another for lusting after a Rolls Royce or this new Orpheus. But at the same time, there are quite a few people out there who are more interested in Ferraris and the purpose they are built for as opposed to the Rolls Royces of the world.
 
It's two different market segments, and it's a fairly interesting contrast between the two versions of Orpheus that were produced by Sennheiser.

 
Make no mistake, though: I only care about the sound. You seem to be implying that this new product has an inferior sound, but everyone who has heard it and talked about what they heard (at least from what I've seen) has emphatically stated that it's the best-sounding headphone they have heard.

 

[superlowfi]

   
Make no mistake, though: I only care about the sound. You seem to be implying that this new product has an inferior sound, but everyone who has heard it and talked about what they heard (at least from what I've seen) has emphatically stated that it's the best-sounding headphone they have heard.

 
But what are you really paying for with the new Orpheus? You can't really have it both ways. If all you care about is speed in a car, you wouldn't be paying for the luxuries and excesses of a Rolls Royce, you would want the Ferrari.
 
With the new Orpheus, you are paying for the marble amp, the motorized tubes, the integrated amplifier in the ear cups. When it comes to Ferrari, we know they use carbon fiber to reduce weight. It makes sense. With the new Orpheus, you have to genuinely believe that marble constructed amplifiers have audibly less distortion than amplifiers made out of less rigid structures. You have to genuinely believe that cables are an audible source of distortion so that the only solution is to build a headphone with integrated amplifiers. The problem is these things are demonstrably false.
 
The only people who have been allowed to talk about the new Orpheus are hand picked individuals from Sennheiser themselves. They are all "on message", and have not legitimately had the chance to properly criticize and compare. Notice the press reviews for each new Ferrari release all gush over them in the same way?
 
Aside from that, each headphone has it's own subjective parameters important to it's evaluation. To suggest that it doesn't matter what it sounds like personally to you, you want it, belies a motive aside from sound for acquiring these headphones. There's no other way around it.

 

[Exidrion]

I can't read all of this thread, but I just wanted to say something to all the people proclaiming "it's not meant for you, it's meant for the rich" when people act shocked at the price. I think, like a lot of things in life, this simply doesn't need to cost $55,000. It could, I'm not going to try and do the research lol. I'm just trying to say that there is some sense in getting up in arms over the recent trend where headphone systems are getting more and more expensive. It starts to feel like they're just doing it because they can, and to me a "marvel of engineering" is achieving improvements at lower costs, not higher ones. Justifying it by saying "well speaker systems can cost way more!" is so very very foolish.

As much as I like Swiss watches and appreciate the effort that goes into them, I'm very aware that they're mostly a status symbol. (especially Rolex ).

By giving this system that price, that's all I see this as.