Interesting to know the new batch of Z2 employs 4562. The old batch used 2604.
Perhaps, you may want to take a look at the OPA1662. It's less noisy than OPA1652 and it's more power efficient. However, you may as well want to check the input resistance to it. If it's > 5K, you may want to go for 1652 instead. Pls check the datasheet for detail. For 49720, you may want to try the metal cap version, LME49720HA or you may want look for LME49990 x 2 (you need 2 to work, pls check carefully). Moreover, you may want to get your hands onto the MUSES 8920, which some said it's the so-called downgraded MUSES01.
Just from the top of my head. There should be a long list.
I took a look at the OPA1662 and there was a recommendation on the page for the OPA1692 ('To achieve lower distortion at much lower power consumption (650µA/ch) for wireless microphones and USB audio applications')(http://www.ti.com/product/OPA1692)... a better/upgraded version?... besides lower power consumption I am not sure that wireless microphones and USB audio applications are relevant to this situation.
I have taken a look at a few primers for how to read opamp datasheets and have tried to make sense of what I am looking at ... (I have to admit that most of it doesn't make any sense)... but I will keep reading.
When you refer to input resistance >5K, are you referring to 'common mode' or 'differential'?
This is what I found for the OPA1662/OPA1664:
Differential 170 || 2 kΩ || pF Common-mode 600 || 2.5 MΩ || pF
I've been lurking here and reading through the pages trying to glean some understanding and ideas for opamp mods. I recently ordered a Vishan V2 based on reviews and user feedback, but mostly overlooked any comments based on switching the opamp... then I started reading those... then I got it in my head that there was indeed doable/achievable 'tinker-room' with this device based on my resources (this place is very bad for that!...)
Anyway, I came across all the reviews for the Burson v5i, v5, and v6 variations and thought 'cool!... i could switch a chip and play...', then I looked at the cost to Canada. Given the Vishan was under $50CAD shipped I am hesitant to spend another ~$60+USD for an opamp to experiment with (with the reality that I may actually break both in the process).
The Z2 comes with a TI LM4562NA (which I am assuming is the same when referenced as a LM4562). I am looking for an upgrade that is good at presenting soundstage/detail/separation, but in a way where the listener is in the audience (vs 'on stage' not unlike the presentation given with Fiio X5 gen 1 LMH6643 used for headphone output (if I understand correctly) where the listener is 'in' the band).
I have read that possible affordable 'upgrades' would be opamps like:
- TI LME49720
- TI OPA1652
- TI LME4970
From what I can tell (through Mouser) these chips are more affordable/doable... I looked at options like MUSE as well but they are even more expensive than the Bursons.
(Yes... I know I don't even have the unit yet and don't actually know what it sounds like... this has more to do with the mod/tinker/just-because side of me... , either way, I would be ordering blind, though I won't )
If anyone has any other 'cost-effective' (as little as possible to ~$30 CAD delivered) suggestions this would be greatly appreciated! Or... if there is not really a good 'affordable' upgrade (anything worth doing is going to cost me) and I should just use as is, that wisdom would also be appreciated...
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
Thanks for your suggestions and sharing your most recent experiences.
I noticed that these ic chips are tiny. My understanding is that I would have to solder them onto some kind adapter so they would work in a dip 8 package?
Also, when ordering, how would I tell which one to order of a particular model. There are a combination of letters following the chip model (e.g. OPA1692AID vs OPA1692AIDR)...more specifically for the Zishan Z2, which I believe is a dual version dip8 configuration...
Also, the nice surprise with these suggestions is that I just put 3 opamps into my Mouser cart and with shipping it was under $30! Much more doable compared to the Burson and Muse options, and I can experiment...
Thanks for your suggestions and sharing your most recent experiences.
I noticed that these ic chips are tiny. My understanding is that I would have to solder them onto some kind adapter so they would work in a dip 8 package?
Also, when ordering, how would I tell which one to order of a particular model. There are a combination of letters following the chip model (e.g. OPA1692AID vs OPA1692AIDR)...more specifically for the Zishan Z2, which I believe is a dual version dip8 configuration...
Also, the nice surprise with these suggestions is that I just put 3 opamps into my Mouser cart and with shipping it was under $30! Much more doable compared to the Burson and Muse options, and I can experiment...
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
Hi @imran27 , which is bigger the soic or vvsop? I have an soic pcb board adapter to dip but underneath the board there is a footprint for soldering another chip but I'm not sure if it is for the vssop.
Hi @imran27 , which is bigger the soic or vvsop? I have an soic pcb board adapter to dip but underneath the board there is a footprint for soldering another chip but I'm not sure if it is for the vssop.
Hi @imran27 , which is bigger the soic or vvsop? I have an soic pcb board adapter to dip but underneath the board there is a footprint for soldering another chip but I'm not sure if it is for the vssop.
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
@imran27, thanks for the impressions.. it seems that TI raised the bar pretty much.. since you are responsible for my enjoyment about opa2209 in my zishan dsd, now it's a must to try OPA189 too..
OPA1692 (VSSOP-8) vs LM4562 (SOIC-8), size comparison
Pre ordered this thing more than 2 months ago IIRC, came in today, from element14
Now the surprise, or rather something I forgot about this was that it is a VSSOP-8 package not a SOIC-8 package. Fortunately the adapter boards I had support both packages.
TL; DR
Yes, this one stays in my XD-05. It has dethroned OPA2209
First thing I noticed: Such a clean and speedy attack and an insanely dark and silent background.
In fact the background is so dark and silent it confused me into believing that OPA2209 is more detailed. But it turns out OPA2209 has a brighter/noisiser background compared to OPA1692.
Just imagine, the opamp I was raving about is now just a piece of trash. (Not really, still a pretty amazing opamp). Everything will be a comparison to OPA2209
Detail resolution is indeed much better, bass depth and treble extension is better.
The highs are the cleanest and most detailed I've heard.
Texture is available without any graininess.
The layering is amazing, it can present different layers to something where even OPA2209 would struggle.
Soundstage as such is more precise and engaging.
Now I'll be waiting to check out OPA2189/OPA189.
All opamp rollers, I highly recommend this opamp. Check out if someone is selling premounted on eBay. Otherwise get your hands dirty, it's well worth it.
Please, don't even mention LME49720, it's not even in the same league.
As far as specs are concerned, OPA2209, OPA2189 & OPA1692 are the 3 best followed by OPA2192
And based on my listening, yes specs do mean better sound. Especially small signal and large signal response for G = +1, CMRR & Open Loop gain, Phase response (flat phase in audio spectrum is better).
I highly recommend this opamp.
Hopefully I receive my Burson Play replacement soon so that I can try this thing in Play. The higher detail resolution and transparency of ES9018K2M would be the real test for this opamp Even in Play, OPA2209 is my favorite (Only played with I/V stage)
The next challenge I seem to be facing is finding parts in or for Canada... or rather, does anyone know of a Canadian-based distributor for these parts? I have come across parts availability for Canada (e.g. no SOIC-8 to DIP-8 adapters available for shipment to Canada from Mouser... a regional thing?) I would prefer not to have to order multiple parts from multiple places as this increases shipping costs significantly...
*edit*- or does anyone have suggestive for parts abroad? Specifically soic8 to dip8 and Vssop8 to dip8 adapters? I've come across some that look like sheets of pcbs and some with out pins (just the board) and an not sure exactly which one will have all the parts... Or better yet a good ebay (or otherwise) seller that sells these pre-soldered? I am looking to try the opa1692 and the opa2209... For starters...
I ordered 2 of those Opa1611 modules. Very nice opamp anyway but I am captivated by these modules. For the price these are a steal... Oh and the underside has LED's. Bonus!
Those are LEDs on the underside? wondered what they were - wonder if they are used as a voltage reference or just for show.
Might throw some OPA1692 in with my next order I'm doing soon though from the description sounds like they will have me wanting the AD8066 which does inky blackness and deep layered sound so well when setup right.
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