[mrmarano]

So the HD800's have more of all of these traits?

 
Yes. And they're more comfortable.

 

[biggbenn74]

   
Yes. And they're more comfortable.

Wonderful. I am planning on buying a house here in the next month, so these are on the backburner for the moment. But I'm trying to gauge everything before I pull the trigger.

 

[Hansotek]

I wish tidal had eq.

If you're a Mac user you should try Amarra for Tidal. It will give you access to a very nice equalizer.

It also offers a significant jump in audio playback quality with much better clarity, apparent resolution, and soundstage depth and size, among other things. The changes aren't subtle. Tidal trough the browser now seems a bit grainy, un-detailed and closed-in, in comparison.

It is also only $50 or so, and there is a free 30-day trial, so you don't have to take my word for it, you can try it for yourself.

http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/aft.php

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

If you're a Mac user you should try Amarra for Tidal. It will give you access to a very nice equalizer.

It also offers a significant jump in audio playback quality with much better clarity, apparent resolution, and soundstage depth and size, among other things. The changes aren't subtle. Tidal trough the browser now seems a bit grainy, un-detailed and closed-in, in comparison.

It is also only $50 or so, and there is a free 30-day trial, so you don't have to take my word for it, you can try it for yourself.

http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/aft.php

I use the dedicated tidal player on macOS and iOS, but thanks, I'll give it a look.
 
Also, just bought K1000, looking forward to doing an epic comparison review when they arrive.

 

[mtoc]

Folks, the newest 800 (none S) has less 6khz bump than before, right?

 

[Me x3]

  Folks, the newest 800 (none S) has less 6khz bump than before, right?

Don't think so...
Where did you get that info?

 

[fjrabon]

 
Don't think so...
Where did you get that info?

guessing he's referring to this: http://www.head-fi.org/t/646871/new-hd-800-very-different-than-the-old-hd-800
 
one of the longest running debates surrounding the HD800.  Also "new" there is from late 2012 forward, which I wouldn't call "newest" by any stretch.
 
Mine is a 40,000+ serial number.  It didn't seem crazy piercing to me the way the first HD800 I bought in 2011 (and immediately sold) did.  But that's by no means scientific.  5 years old audio memory, older (perhaps less treble sensitive) ears, different system.  Even the Sennheiser FR plots don't really clear things up because nobody knows what reference curve they use and if they've kept the same one.  

 

[icebear]

  Folks, the newest 800 (none S) has less 6khz bump than before, right?

No, the HD800 is still a great headphone and doesn't sound anything like a HE-1000

 

[fjrabon]

Using my m9XX with my HD800, some thoughts on the pairing:

1) un-EQ'd it's a bright pairing. Not harsh per se, but definitely bright and lacking bass extension. This, however, is simply how the HD800 sounds. The flip side is that it's a supremely detailed, spacious, dynamic, fast, transparent pairing as well. With Filter 2 on and crossfeed off, the soundstage is spacious, but a bit unnatural and disconnected. Crossfeed reconnects the soundstage. With the Grace's crosfeed, most headphones can get a little bit claustrophobic, sounding less headphone-y, but also less spacious. With the HD800 however, it takes the HD800s gigantic, but a bit artificial sounding soundstage and makes it realistic. I've heard bigger soundstages, but I've never heard a more realistic soundstage than this pairing (well, except what I'm about to talk about next). While I like this sound (HD800 + m9XX + Grace crossfeed, no other adjustments), it's clearly a thin sound. A detailed, dynamic sound, but yes, thin. It works for a lot of recordings extremely well. But on some recordings, especially rock recordings, it leaves a bit to be desired in the visceral impact of the music. It's like the soul got sucked out. The soundstage is also a smidgen less large than I'd ideally like, but is also perfectly acceptable.

2) Enter the above with the Sonarworks plug in. For those who don't know, this plug in simply takes measurements of the HD800, and inverses them to match your target frequency response curve. With the sonarworks plug in, we get all the benefits of the above, plus a startlingly lifelike timbre. The bass is full when it's supposed to be, the highs are delicate yet never harsh. The midrange is accurate, flipping from lush to urgent as the music does so.

One thing to note with the Sonarworks plug in is that it requires you to run your amp at a higher power level, as it limits the input signal so that it doesn't move in to clipping. With the curve I use, I usually have to run the m9XX about 8 dB higher than I do when using the HD800 unEQ'd. So, if you're a very loud listener, you might start to get into the 90s, where the Grace is slightly less clean, or if you listen crazy loud you may actually run out of power. I personally haven't gone over 85 with the sonarworks plug in, but it is something to be aware of for people listening very loudly.

This aspect is what has convinced me of the m9XX for the HD800, as the sonarworks plug in puts a lot of pressure on the amp.  With all of my other amps (which admittedly aren't powerhouses) they start to run out of current once you put the additional 8-10dB power requirement on it (which means you need about 3X as much power.  With the Grace, I had no issue.  Power stayed crisp, clean and dynamic.  Not the slightest hint of running out of steam, and I still have about 15dB of head room.

3) The final piece de resistance for me was the Goodhertz can opener crossfeed DSP plug in combined with Goodhertz's free mid-side matrix plug in. I like the Grace's crossfeed circuit a lot, but it's non-adjustable and they clearly erred on the side of being conservative with it. Which was a good choice given the variety of music and headphones that would be running out of the Grace. However, to me, it always ended up sounding a tad bit like it wasn't enough, but also that it was too much. i.e. the crossfeed circuit narrowed the soundstage too much, while also not completely connecting it. When I say "connected" about soundstage I mean the ability to turn the natural headphone soundstage of "hard right, middle, hard left" into a continuous, smooth soundstage with no "drop outs". With the Grace's crossfeed there was still a tiny bit of drop out at about 2 oclock and 10 oclock. With the Goodhertz crossfeed system I was able to get it so that the soundstage was completely connected seamlessly. If I kept my head still and closed my eyes, envisioning musicians on a stage, I would get that magical "things slip away and you think you're there" experience faster and more dramatically than any other headphone setup I've experienced. However, the soundstage was a bit closed in even though it was realistically connected. That's where the mid-side plug-in came in to play. Giving the sides a 3.5dB boost I was able to "stretch" out the soundstage, without making it disconnected again. I was able to experience a full, connected soundstage that was also wide, deep and spacious.

Putting this all together is the most wow experience I've ever had with headphones (including a SR009 + KGHSSV setup of one of my close friends). I got the transparency and dynamicism that only a headphone like the HD800, Abyss or SR009 can deliver. However, I get a much more balanced sound than any of those headphones come with stock. Timbre sounds absolutely spot on. I've heard Joshua Bell's violin in real life from 20 feet away and this sounded exactly like that. Spatial cues are interpreted and reassembled better than I've ever heard a headphone do. The sound somehow manages to be simultaneously analytical and musical. If I want to peer into the detail I can just try to focus on it, if I want to sit back and relax and enjoy it, that's totally possible too, it doesn't smash you over the head with harsh detail saying "LOOK AT ME" the detail is there, if you want it, but it can blend if that's what you want as well. It's up to you and how you want to focus on your attention. You can pay attention to a given instrument, hear the pluck of the guitarist snapping with nails and notice the difference between a flat pick. Or you can "step back" and take in the totality of the band. It's the closest sound I've ever heard to the pair of $250,000 Focal speakers I get to listen to every so often. Obviously not 100% there (headphones will never have the full body impact of speakers and with headphones as soon as you turn your head, the illusion falls a bit, as your brain expects the sound to change and it doesn't). But dang startlingly close for around $1500 total (HD800 $850, Sonarworks $79, m9XX $499, canopener $79)

So, that was a lot of words, and the m9XX barely got mentioned. However, I think my point is that this device can absolutely scale with the HD800, as part of a whole system. It's not going to fix the HD800's frequency response issues on its own, it simply reflects what the HD800 does naturally. However, with the right system, you can take advantage of the HD800's strengths, while nearly completely fixing its weaknesses. I'll likely end up buying an amp specifically for the HD800 (probably a torpedo from beezar audio) to pull out that last .01% of performance the HD800 can deliver. But make no mistake, the m9XX is a more than capable performer with the HD800, as long as you aren't expecting it to, by itself, tame the HD800's 6kHz peak and add 8 dB of bass boost. There are other tools better suited for those issues. However, the m9XX splendidly does its portion of the job.

 

[fjrabon]

Here's some pictures explaining how I have Sonarworks and the Goodhertz plug ins arranged:
 
How I have them set up in audiohijack

CanOpener settings.  150% is aggressive, but when paired with the mid-side correction is the most realistic.  I would only go around 80% if I didn't have the mid-side adjustment. I turn this off for binaural music.

mid-side correction.  The 3.5 dB boost to the sides takes the crossfed realistic, yet narrow soundstage and makes it bigger.  I turn this off for binaural music.

Sonarworks adjustment.  As you can see I wanted a slightly U-shaped correction.  Depending on the music, I will go back and forth between this and flat, which is as simple as pressing a (virtual) button.

 
m9XX volume level is 80 for most music.  Filter 2, crossfeed off.
 
Also, of note, make sure you have a decently powerful computer.  I'm running this on a TOTL specced 13" macbook pro, and I'm consistently using around 40% of the computer's processing power.  This is mostly due to canopener set at "most realistic" and sonarworks being run in the 100% linear phase mode.  You can run sonarworks in minimum phase mode, which is less processor hungry, and you can run canopener in one of the "less realistic" modes.  However, why go through all this trouble and then skip the last touch of quality at the end?

 

[Me x3]

 
guessing he's referring to this: http://www.head-fi.org/t/646871/new-hd-800-very-different-than-the-old-hd-800
 
one of the longest running debates surrounding the HD800.  Also "new" there is from late 2012 forward, which I wouldn't call "newest" by any stretch.
 
Mine is a 40,000+ serial number.  It didn't seem crazy piercing to me the way the first HD800 I bought in 2011 (and immediately sold) did.  But that's by no means scientific.  5 years old audio memory, older (perhaps less treble sensitive) ears, different system.  Even the Sennheiser FR plots don't really clear things up because nobody knows what reference curve they use and if they've kept the same one.  

As far as I know, early units of the HD800 had slightly different earpads (s/n up to 8000 at least). These had a tiny bit more low bass and the treble peak was a bit louder (+1.5dB). Newer version has slightly wider earpads

 

[fjrabon]

 
As far as I know, early units of the HD800 had slightly different earpads (s/n up to 8000 at least). These had a tiny bit more low bass and the treble peak was a bit louder (+1.5dB). Newer version has slightly wider earpads

yeah, I've exhaustively read the whole debate and talked to a Sennheiser rep (off the record) and nobody seems to really know for sure.  People even disagree about when the change started.  I've heard the earpad theory, a slight change to the interiror lining material theory and any other number of theories. I think this debate is destined to forever be unresolved.  

 

[MWSVette]

 
As far as I know, early units of the HD800 had slightly different earpads (s/n up to 8000 at least). These had a tiny bit more low bass and the treble peak was a bit louder (+1.5dB). Newer version has slightly wider earpads

 
 

 
yeah, I've exhaustively read the whole debate and talked to a Sennheiser rep (off the record) and nobody seems to really know for sure.  People even disagree about when the change started.  I've heard the earpad theory, a slight change to the interiror lining material theory and any other number of theories. I think this debate is destined to forever be unresolved.  

 
I have an early set #003xxx and recently changed the earpads.  I did not notice much change in the sound signature.  For what it is worth...

 

[Me x3]

 
yeah, I've exhaustively read the whole debate and talked to a Sennheiser rep (off the record) and nobody seems to really know for sure.  People even disagree about when the change started.  I've heard the earpad theory, a slight change to the interiror lining material theory and any other number of theories. I think this debate is destined to forever be unresolved.  

 

   
 
 
I have an early set #003xxx and recently changed the earpads.  I did not notice much change in the sound signature.  For what it is worth...

 
Measuring seems like a pretty easy task and can be done without extracting the earpads.

 
Here's mine (sn. 22xxx)

Picture quality is not that great but it's clear that it measures 2.5 cm
 
I think early HD800 units should measure 2 cm instead.

 

[Thenewguy007]

I've heard bigger soundstages, but I've never heard a more realistic soundstage than this pairing (well, except what I'm about to talk about next).

 
Which headphones have you heard with bigger soundstages?