[Luvdac]

Does LHY SW-6 and SW10 work without problems? I would buy it for a LUMIN U2 music player and streamer device. 1 SFP output and 4 LAN outputs are enough for me, so I plan to buy the Sw6. does anyone here have one? works perfectly stable, which adapter do you use?

I'm using the sw6 with no issues and it made a positive difference to the sound. Its clocked by the ock2 which also clocks the r26 and server. Wouldnt do without the sw6 or ock2 now.

 

[falcon70]

Hi guys,
I am new to this forum and found it very informative.
I believe that UTP cables and switches affect the sound quality. Replacing my cheap UTP cable with the Neotech NEET-1008 silver cable that precedes the streamer has definitely improved the sound quality.

Good quality switches are an important part of the streaming chain because the audio data are not 0 and 1 bits, but small analogue voltage changes on the cable that are sensitive to noise from the carrier.
An audio switch with a good LPS generates less noise, filtering out external noise using galvanically isolated ports. This is clear.

But how does the clock of the switch affect the sound quality?
As an IT professional, I know how switches work. The Layer 2 audio switch handles only Ethernet frames.
The network and transport (layer 3-4) are handled by the TCP/IP protocol software of the router/streamer. TCP/IP packets are controlled by the streamer/router.
What does it mean to reclock packets in the switch? The switch doesn't even recognize IP packets, only Ethernet frames.
Why does the audiophile switch need a good clock, what is the advantage of an OXCO clock or an external clock?

 

[sajunky]

But how does the clock of the switch affect the sound quality?
As an IT professional, I know how switches work. The Layer 2 audio switch handles only Ethernet frames.
.... .
What does it mean to reclock packets in the switch? The switch doesn't even recognize IP packets, only Ethernet frames.

Short answer, in only two ways. Spreading EMI (it also interacts with ground loops over cabling system) and spreading own noise through the power supply and power cables.

It is true, reclocking frames does nothing, up to 100 meters, only exceeding such lenght requires a adding switch.

As long as packets arrive in time, there should be no distortions added, it is considered fully asynchronous, a receiver use its own independent clock. If some frame is dropped on the path, there will be a dropout in the sound stream, it will be noticed immediately (not as a sound quality, but a violent disruption).

However, there is additional traffic a receiver has to interpret like truncated frames coming out of the switch or broadcast/multicast traffic, it create peaks of EMI and the power supply noise, see the above. This is why reducing traffic transfered over a cable or FMC is important. Special protocols for audio were developed that reduce bursts in the traffic, so a noise is spread more evenly across wide spectrum (less higher energy peaks).

Why does the audiophile switch need a good clock, what is the advantage of an OXCO clock or an external clock?

This is a question worth of one extra external clock.

Adding external clock cable changes distribution of ground loops, it may have a positive effect on SQ. The same effect as using mysterious ground boxes. If helps, fine. However it make a noise created by a switch correlated to the sound, it is a negative efect. I always suggest: if you want to add external clock to a switch, use a different clock device, not your audio clock for D/A conversion.

Many technologies leak to the audio industry without any sense. In this example enterprise grade networking equipment in datacentres (10Gbps Ethernet and above) use 10MHz external clock, but for a different purpose. It is for token recognition. It is easier to recognise transitions of logic levels when the exact frequency of incoming datastream is known. The exact timing (frequently synchronised with GPS) is also needed to setup a precise time advance in a transmitter for avoiding colisions in multiple access networks like 5G.

 

[falcon70]

Short answer, in only two ways. Spreading EMI (it also interacts with ground loops over cabling system) and spreading own noise through the power supply and power cables.

It is true, reclocking frames does nothing, up to 100 meters, only exceeding such lenght requires a adding switch.

As long as packets arrive in time, there should be no distortions added, it is considered fully asynchronous, a receiver use its own independent clock. If some frame is dropped on the path, there will be a dropout in the sound stream, it will be noticed immediately (not as a sound quality, but a violent disruption).

However, there is additional traffic a receiver has to interpret like truncated frames coming out of the switch or broadcast/multicast traffic, it create peaks of EMI and the power supply noise, see the above. This is why reducing traffic transfered over a cable or FMC is important. Special protocols for audio were developed that reduce bursts in the traffic, so a noise is spread more evenly across wide spectrum (less higher energy peaks).

Thank you. As I understand good, the cheap crystal clocks make noise too and spread EMI.

Interesting part you wrote about reducing audio traffic. The Diretta transmission host/target protocol does this way, if I am correct.
Has anyone tried the diretta system, for example the Afterdark Rosanna X network bridge?

 

[Jake2]

Thank you. As I understand good, the cheap crystal clocks make noise too and spread EMI.

Interesting part you wrote about reducing audio traffic. The Diretta transmission host/target protocol does this way, if I am correct.
Has anyone tried the diretta system, for example the Afterdark Rosanna X network bridge?

@Dandoudou and @bodiebill2 have had good success with Diretta so may be able to comment further.

 

[Atriya]

There is not alot of mention of jcat net card xe.

Im considering it over an audiophile switch, because it will be close to my jcat usb xe. Other worth mentioning, I started to like the sound very much and most of the credit goes to the usb xe + ifi elite.

Anybody using the jcat net card xe?

I'm considering this combo (NET Card XE + iFi Elite). Do you still like it?

Is it really a very singular product? I couldn't find a single direct competitor. For example Afterdark has PCIe LAN cards, but they rely on an external clock input, whereas the NET Card XE has the clock built in. I'd prefer something with the clock built in.

 

[Tubewin]

I'm considering this combo (NET Card XE + iFi Elite). Do you still like it?

Is it really a very singular product? I couldn't find a single direct competitor. For example Afterdark has PCIe LAN cards, but they rely on an external clock input, whereas the NET Card XE has the clock built in. I'd prefer something with the clock built in.

I use the Jcat net xe card powered by the Optimo 3 Duo power supply. Sounds good. The optimo 3 duo boosts the low end a little bit which is nice.

 

[OCC7N]

I'm considering this combo (NET Card XE + iFi Elite). Do you still like it?

Is it really a very singular product? I couldn't find a single direct competitor. For example Afterdark has PCIe LAN cards, but they rely on an external clock input, whereas the NET Card XE has the clock built in. I'd prefer something with the clock built in.

Elite is aggressive and also has emphasized lows/upper. Very silent/holographic black bacground. Leaning to the colder coating/sound. iPower X is more elegant sound and neutral, it has a sharper sparkling sound and sound less cold than Elite which I like in most use cases.

(It is hard to explain but it is like Class A vs Class D speaker amp sound.)

Linear powersupplies I have tried does sound warmer but forced and fatiguing. It feel like something is "lighting" the whole soundstage with and overkill too powerful light bulb.

----

Both Elite and X are very technical performing, Elite the most. I would choose the more forgiving one = iPower X which still beats linear power supplies in above classes to my taste.

EDIT: the JCAT Optimo 3 is a steal for what it can do to the sound! - I would recommend it over the iFis if you are using it on USB XE and NET XE
EDIT2: iFi Elite needs a good run, 1000hours imo. The X is ready after 300hours.

 

[OCC7N]

When building a gamerphile pc, remember to choose motherboards, with ATLEAST 2x PCIe(x16) ports that is connected to the CPU. Use the closest one for the audiophile network card, and the second for GPU.

Buy either Corsair AX1600i or the Supernova that beats the measurements of the Corsair. I chose Corsair because of the GaN transistors.

Im blown away how great it sounds vs iFi Elite and the X internally.

A more unforgiving sound than both but still able to sound musical and breath with the blackest background! - It took the black background of the Audio-gd further I MUST SAY.

So.....buy Corsair AX1600i instead of the iFi Elite and iFi iPower X ? - and use the internal molex = 10000% yes!

Use only a good DC filtering in front of the Corsair, nothing more was needed in my setup, I did test with power conditioners. The only tweak I did was connecting the motherboard to earth which did collect/tightened the music more, but I could live without it as it sound more relaxed without.

 

[TheR0v3r]

This weekend I’m doing a comparison between the following network cables in my system:

• Belden Catsnake 6a
• Furutech LAN-8 NCF
• Neotech NEET-1008
• Shunyata Delta Ethernet

All cables are connected to my Netgear GS105E w/ SBooster and the Netgear in turn is connected to the router with an Inakustik Ethernet cable. (I’ve auditioned several different switches and power supplies incl Phoenix NET. The Netgear is MY value champ and choice.)

After a first quick comparison the Neotech is out. It’s just too unwieldly to work for me, however great it may be. The Shunyata Delta is unconvincing, especially given that it’s alot more expensive than the others. I just can’t relate the marketing speak and some other reviews positivity with what I’m actually hearing. A consequence of expectations? I’ll circle back to it at the very end just to make sure that I’m not being overly critical.

If the Shunyata was unconvincing both the Belden and Furutech are convincing, albeit different. The tonality is different, the transient response is different etc. Looking forward to comparing them more in depth. More to follow

 

[Atriya]

When building a gamerphile pc, remember to choose motherboards, with ATLEAST 2x PCIe(x16) ports that is connected to the CPU. Use the closest one for the audiophile network card, and the second for GPU.

Buy either Corsair AX1600i or the Supernova that beats the measurements of the Corsair. I chose Corsair because of the GaN transistors.

Im blown away how great it sounds vs iFi Elite and the X internally.

A more unforgiving sound than both but still able to sound musical and breath with the blackest background! - It took the black background of the Audio-gd further I MUST SAY.

So.....buy Corsair AX1600i instead of the iFi Elite and iFi iPower X ? - and use the internal molex = 10000% yes!

Use only a good DC filtering in front of the Corsair, nothing more was needed in my setup, I did test with power conditioners. The only tweak I did was connecting the motherboard to earth which did collect/tightened the music more, but I could live without it as it sound more relaxed without.

Interesting, thanks. I need to use the PCIe card with a laptop. Thinking of using this:

https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/owc-mercury-helios-3s/thunderbolt-3

 

[OCC7N]

Interesting, thanks. I need to use the PCIe card with a laptop. Thinking of using this:

https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/owc-mercury-helios-3s/thunderbolt-3

Hmm..

If I were to go that route which I actually still thinking I would choose the Sonnet IIIe

My reason: DSP card, Network card, I2S card.

 

[Tubewin]

This weekend I’m doing a comparison between the following network cables in my system:

• Belden Catsnake 6a
• Furutech LAN-8 NCF
• Neotech NEET-1008
• Shunyata Delta Ethernet

All cables are connected to my Netgear GS105E w/ SBooster and the Netgear in turn is connected to the router with an Inakustik Ethernet cable. (I’ve auditioned several different switches and power supplies incl Phoenix NET. The Netgear is MY value champ and choice.)

After a first quick comparison the Neotech is out. It’s just too unwieldly to work for me, however great it may be. The Shunyata Delta is unconvincing, especially given that it’s alot more expensive than the others. I just can’t relate the marketing speak and some other reviews positivity with what I’m actually hearing. A consequence of expectations? I’ll circle back to it at the very end just to make sure that I’m not being overly critical.

If the Shunyata was unconvincing both the Belden and Furutech are convincing, albeit different. The tonality is different, the transient response is different etc. Looking forward to comparing them more in depth. More to follow

That is a shame the Neotech lan cable didn't work out for you. I'm using the neotech 3008 copper lan cable which replaced the supra lan cable. It's not a night and day upgrade coming from the supra to the neotech 3008. Both are warmer sounding cables. I'm not a big fan of silver with the exception of oem neotech upocc silver. Would be interesting to hear your thoughts on the 1008.

The Sotm DCBL-7 makes the neotech look like the most pliable cable in the world. If you need flexibility, I would stay away from the sotm. If you can somehow work the sotm cable in the chain, I would recommend them. It's one of my favorite lan cables, and still one that I currently use in my chain.

 

[TheR0v3r]

This weekend I’m doing a comparison between the following network cables in my system:

• Belden Catsnake 6a
• Furutech LAN-8 NCF
• Neotech NEET-1008
• Shunyata Delta Ethernet

All cables are connected to my Netgear GS105E w/ SBooster and the Netgear in turn is connected to the router with an Inakustik Ethernet cable. (I’ve auditioned several different switches and power supplies incl Phoenix NET. The Netgear is MY value champ and choice.)

After a first quick comparison the Neotech is out. It’s just too unwieldly to work for me, however great it may be. The Shunyata Delta is unconvincing, especially given that it’s alot more expensive than the others. I just can’t relate the marketing speak and some other reviews positivity with what I’m actually hearing. A consequence of expectations? I’ll circle back to it at the very end just to make sure that I’m not being overly critical.

If the Shunyata was unconvincing both the Belden and Furutech are convincing, albeit different. The tonality is different, the transient response is different etc. Looking forward to comparing them more in depth. More to follow

Update
The Furutech is really, really nice. Voices and instruments have nice… heft? There’s a mass and weight that’s appealing.

How will it do when the music gets more complex?

 

[Atriya]

Hmm..

If I were to go that route which I actually still thinking I would choose the Sonnet IIIe

My reason: DSP card, Network card, I2S card.

Interesting, thanks. If buying Sonnet, this would probably work in my case (just one card):

https://www.sonnetstore.com/products/echo-express-sel-tb3