The diary entries of a little girl nearing 30!
Mar 30, 2012 at 9:51 PM Post #4,141 of 15,119
Maverick, I needs helps!

Calculating Output Impedance
Output impedance is easy to calculate. Let’s look at three types of amplifiers, single-end tubes amplifiers, push-pull tube amplifiers, and OTL amplifiers. Solid-state amplifiers are similar to OTL’s.
Single-Ended
The first step is to calculate the impedances of the output devices. One 300B has a plate impedance of 700 ohms. If there were more than one tube, we simply divide the plate impedance by the number of tubes. Two 300B tubes would then have a net impedance of 350 ohms.
Next we calculate the impedance ratio between the primary and secondary windings of the output transformer. If the primary were 3000 ohms and the secondary were 8 ohms, the ratio is then 3000 ÷ 8 = 375. The output impedance is then the tube plate impedance divided by this number or 700 ÷ 375 = 2.13 ohms. That’s it! Negative feedback can be applied to reduce the impedance further.
Push-Pull
Let’s use a pair of 6550’s with a transformer with a 5000 ohm primary. Two 6550’s in push-pull have a combined plate impedance of about 10,000 ohms in pentode mode. The transformer has an impedance ratio of 5000 ÷ 8 = 625. The output impedance is then 10,000 ÷ 625 = 16 ohms. In this case it is absolutely essential to employ negative feedback to get the output impedance down. Amplifiers of this nature typically require about 25 dB of negative feedback to get the output impedance down to 0.8 ohms. (25 dB of feedback reduces output impedance 18 times)
OTL
Let’s look at the Transcendent T8 as an example. It uses 8, EL509 tubes in push-pull. Each 509 has a plate impedance of about 150 ohms. 150 ÷8 = 18.75 ohms. This is unacceptable. Negative feedback is employed to achieve proper performance. The amplifier uses 33 dB of negative feedback which reduces the output impedance to 0.4 ohm thereby achieving outstanding woofer control and the ability to drive 4 ohm speakers. This specification was verified by Stereophile when they reviewed the amplifier.
Different tubes will provide similar results. The configuration of the OTL output stage does not matter whether it is series connected push-pull or balanced. The controlling factors here are the number of output devices and the plate impedance of the devices. A 6AS7G is a dual triode with a plate impedance of 280 ohms. An amplifier that uses 8 such tubes will have an output impedance of 280 ÷ 16 = 17.5 ohms. A fourteen tube amplifier will have an output impedance of 10 ohms.
So it is absolutely essential that negative feedback be employed in the design of OTL amplifiers and tube amplifiers in general. There is simply no other way to reduce output impedance to acceptable levels.


I believe my WA6 is the first example, single ended. I have no idea how to find out the plate impedance of my tubes and the windings of the output transformer...
 
Mar 30, 2012 at 10:14 PM Post #4,142 of 15,119
Might have found the plate impedance of the 274b, 100ohm. Really tough to find this info though, only found that one source for that number, which seems low considering the 300b is 700 ohm.
 
Mar 30, 2012 at 10:28 PM Post #4,143 of 15,119
Quote:
Maverick, I needs helps!..


That's how you figure out what it will be before you build it.
 
I think I might have missed something with my earlier idea.  I'll have to check it later when I get the chance.
 
Mar 30, 2012 at 10:59 PM Post #4,144 of 15,119
You're talking to someone who works with wood and scrapers every day. I gave it my best shot, but this stuff is beyond me. I don't seem to have values for either readings (unless it's watts?).. the formula on the page is in amperes though so I have no idea what is what.
 
Mar 30, 2012 at 11:05 PM Post #4,145 of 15,119
I'm actually at work right now and my graphing calculator is on the fritz so I can't do it quickly and I can't sit down and work out the algebra since that take a bit more time and effort than typing up posts on head-fi.
 
Mar 30, 2012 at 11:06 PM Post #4,146 of 15,119
No worries just whenever you get the chance. No rush at all. Really appreciate it.
 
Mar 31, 2012 at 1:34 AM Post #4,148 of 15,119
Quote:
It's too tough to comment on everything in this thread when I've been offline for some time...


Sometimes I spend an hour or so multi quoting half a dozen post at a time on threads like these...
 
Mar 31, 2012 at 1:46 AM Post #4,149 of 15,119
I hope you don't do those on your phone... I would kill myself.
 
Mar 31, 2012 at 1:53 AM Post #4,150 of 15,119
Quote:
I hope you don't do those on your phone... I would kill myself.


Nope.  I hate smart phones.  I still use an original RAZR.  I haven't seen a better form factor since.  If I need a computer I'll pull my netbook out of my bag..
 
Mar 31, 2012 at 2:24 AM Post #4,153 of 15,119
Someplace that buys so many of them like Costco might have their own colors or something.  You could email V Moda or PM them here on head-fi.
 
Mar 31, 2012 at 2:31 AM Post #4,155 of 15,119


Quote:
Someplace that buys so many of them like Costco might have their own colors or something.  You could email V Moda or PM them here on head-fi.



Indeed. Best Buy had their own matte-black Porta Pros for a while.
 
Honestly, you should be able to tell if they're fake or legit by listening to them, unless you don't want to open them first. Otherwise just try a Google search for "Costco V Moda color" or something.
 

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