[Welly Wu]

Forget it.
 
I don't want an Apple MacBook Pro anymore.
 
I just saw their MacBook Pro 15" with the Intel Core i5 430 M CPU and the nVIDIA GeForce GT 330 M GPU. It starts at around $2,000.00 USD. The specifications are not nearly as feature rich as my ASUS N61JV-X2 with the Crucial 8 GB of DDR3 PC-8500 SODIMM SDRAM and the Intel X25-M 160 GB SSD and I wound up paying $1,534.76 USD just for the hardware alone. Mine outperforms the Apple MacBook Pro 15" except when it comes to battery life.
 
Apple is a luxury brand.
 
I can do better by sticking with a Intel, nVIDIA, Microsoft Windows notebook PC.
 
End of thread.
 
Thank you.

 

[roadcykler]

Wise choice.
Quote:

Forget it.
 
I don't want an Apple MacBook Pro anymore.
 
I just saw their MacBook Pro 15" with the Intel Core i5 430 M CPU and the nVIDIA GeForce GT 330 M GPU. It starts at around $2,000.00 USD. The specifications are not nearly as feature rich as my ASUS N61JV-X2 with the Crucial 8 GB of DDR3 PC-8500 SODIMM SDRAM and the Intel X25-M 160 GB SSD and I wound up paying $1,534.76 USD just for the hardware alone. Mine outperforms the Apple MacBook Pro 15" except when it comes to battery life.
 
Apple is a luxury brand.
 
I can do better by sticking with a Intel, nVIDIA, Microsoft Windows notebook PC.
 
End of thread.
 
Thank you.

 

[Currawong]

As a friend of mine in Apple once said: People buy Macs for Mac OS X. If the OS doesn't interest you, then it's not worth bothering with.

 

[bangraman]

Welly,
 
 
I've always wondered... do you think in forum posts?

 

 
Quote:

/img/forum/go_quote.gif

As a friend of mine in Apple once said: People buy Macs for Mac OS X. If the OS doesn't interest you, then it's not worth bothering with.

That's true. That, and if you like shiny pretty things of course.
 
 
The only problem with the OS X thing is if you buy them for OS X and expect the reliability and availability from similarly priced Windows gear, especially at the 'Pro' levels...

 

[Welly Wu]

Yes, I do my research and thinking here for high end audio and computer products.
 
I have found that I repeat the same patterns on specialized forums such as Sirius XM Satellite Radio (http://www.xmfan.com), HardOCP (http://www.hardforums.com), and Solid State Drive Technology (http://www.ssdtechnologyforum.com).
 
There are a lot of people that are much smarter than me. If I leave enough clues about my thinking process, then I can find illumination and solve my problems to a much higher degree of satisfaction than were I to keep quiet and just solicit information. I have examined my very early threads and posts on Head-Fi to recent ones and I found this to be the most beneficial change for me.
 
This is how I wound up buying my Audio Technica ATH-W5000 "Raffinato" headphones and I will keep them until Audio Technica releases a newer and better performing top of the line reference headphone.
 
Also, I wound up choosing my ASUS N61JV-X2 notebook PC, Crucial 8 GB of DDR3 PC-8500 SODIMM SDRAM, and my Intel X25-M 160 GB SSD by starting new threads with my thinking process published for peer review and critiques. I do not regret my purchases and they have not given me any problems whatsoever.
 
I could have done a lot worse and this is why I post my thinking process because it helps me discover new ideas or approaches that I would have not otherwise considered.
 
You were instrumental in my decision to buy my Intel 160 GB 34nm SSD instead of the ADATA S599 128 GB SSD. I am glad that I chose Intel because I it is a rock solid brand that just works and it is suitable for production environments. Thank you.
 
Think about this: I could have just placed an order for the top of the line Apple MacBook Pro 17" and wound up with a product that I don't understand how to use and it would have cost me a lot of money to get Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit and all of its native software applications within a complex VMWare Fusion virtual machine. Though I can afford to do it, I would have wound up with a much less palatable selection of hardware and software options compared to what I can get from a Lenovo Thinkpad W701DS or even a Dell Precision M6500 or Hewlett Packard EliteBook 8750w. After the charm of getting a new toy settles in, I would have to live with the fact of less performance per dollar and I would have to retrain myself to learn how to use OS X.
 
NJIT does not support Apple products whatsoever. We do not service, repair, or upgrade Apple products whatsoever at my job either. The selection of available software applications for OS X is limited to Microsoft Office 2011 for Macintosh and that is it.
 
I expect to graduate with my Masters of Science in IT Administration and Security degree by Spring 2012. In the meantime, I would have an unsupported computer with limited software available for free for students, and it would have cost me a small fortune. The money is not the problem for me. The problem is the cost of trying to make Windows programs work on Apple OS X which I have found out is specific to the application's requirements. In my case, I would have to spend the $1,200.00 USD for the 512 GB SSD because I require a minimum of 160 GB for just my Windows OS and software applications for NJIT until I graduate. I work with software that I cannot uninstall after a course has been completed because I need it for my job at NJIT to support the faculty and staff members when they run into problems that I must solve for them.
 
We use Dell to meet the growing needs of our IT and IS requirements with some limited deployments of HP workstations and servers for back end roles. We do not support AMD or ATI whatsoever either on or off campus. Intel, Windows, nVIDIA, Microsoft, Scientific Linux, Red Hat, VMWare are our major hardware and software vendors that we do officially support on campus.
 
It sucks because there is a monopoly on these brands, but everybody must comply in order to study or work at NJIT.

 

[khaos974]

Macbook or no Macbook, if you don't need a new laptop right now, I'd advise you to wait until the new Sandy Bridge (Intel's new line of CPUs) hit the market, desktop editions are already sold and laptop editions for Q1 2011 I believe.
Based on earlier update trends, the Macbook Pro is scheduled for a refresh soon anyway.
 
Why wait, after all performances are always getting higher?
- Because, it should be a short wait.
- And mostly because based on preliminary reports (check Anandtech), the Sandy bridge, laptop edition, finally closes much of the gap it has with desktop counterparts, contrary to earlier generations of laptop CPUs.
 
As for not getting used to OSX, I wouldn't worry about it, Win & runs perfectly on a MBP and yes, you end up paying a lot of money for a shiny computer, but it is indeed very *shiny*, none of the laptop PC match its polish, they come close to it, but are still a step behind (and are about as expensive anyway).
 
EDIT: woops, didn't read the latest posts before posting.

 

[Welly Wu]

Actually,
 
I am waiting for these key technologies for my next purchase of a secondary laptop:
 
1. Up to $5,000.00 USD excluding New Jersey sales tax, shipping fees, and rush processing fees.
2. Intel Core i7 Sandy Bridge. I will pick the specific CPU.
3. nVIDIA GeForce GTX 500M GPU or nVIDIA Quadro 5000M with at least 1 GB of VRAM. I will pick the specific GPU.
4. ExpressCard 34
5. Super Speed USB 3.0
6. eSATA
7. Bluetooth 2.1 + EDR or Bluetooth 3.0 + HS.
8. SATA II or SATA III capable Intel X25-M 160 GB or Crucial RealSSD C400 256 GB Solid State Drive for the primary Windows boot disk
9. Secondary SATA I, SATA II, and SATA III capable hard drive with a Seagate 500 GB 7,200 4 GB SSD Hybrid hard drive
10. Full HD 1920X1080 resolution screen up to 17.3" widescreen format
 
Basically, I am looking at a future laptop that should have all of these key ingredients within the next 3 - 6 months in 2011. The brands that I will consider are ASUS, Toshiba, Lenovo, and MSI in that order of preference.
 
Realistically, I am looking at spending about $3,000.00 USD for these hardware features which are mandatory for me.
 
I realize how much more powerful the new Intel Core i7 Sandy Bridge CPUs are and the mobile CPUs are considered desktop grade in terms of performance. The new nVIDIA 500M GPUs are quite powerful as well and they close the gap between desktop GPU graphics boards too.
 
Things are getting much better with new hardware technologies for notebook PC shoppers in 2011.

 

[bangraman]

I'd still say consider HP. The Elitebooks and the 8740/(50 I guess for SB)w are the best-balanced IMO in terms of mobile workstations. They pack decent power, remain somewhat portable, feature excellent expansion capabilities and are definitely well built... to a higher standard I feel than e.g. Apple and indeed Dell. The M6500 (6600 in SB?) on the other hand is the best-looking and potentially the most powerful mobile workstation, especially in the Covet trim. There are some really nice incidental touches in the features and I really like the Prosupport which I'm assuming you haven't experienced, but it's less portable and is not flexible in the battery department. Both can be pushed to lope along with reasonable acoustic profiles under sustained load levels that leaves the Macbook Pro gasping for air (literally) as it cooks up to max case temp and sounding like a small Dyson.
 
 
I've always felt on the other hand (especially recently) that Lenovo are overrated in terms of build quality, and that like Apple but in a slightly different aspect, the design is more responsible for the impression of build quality than the actual product engineering, and there are situations in which I think they derive their 'more durable' moniker through unnecessary bulk. I've had/have recent/current W, T and X machines (although not the 700 series) and I feel that Lenovo's real advantage is in their 'useful bloatware'... I really like Thinkvantage suite for getting the most out of a machine.

 
Quote:

Macbook or no Macbook, if you don't need a new laptop right now, I'd advise you to wait until the new Sandy Bridge (Intel's new line of CPUs) hit the market, desktop editions are already sold and laptop editions for Q1 2011 I believe.
Based on earlier update trends, the Macbook Pro is scheduled for a refresh soon anyway.
 
Why wait, after all performances are always getting higher?
- Because, it should be a short wait.
- And mostly because based on preliminary reports (check Anandtech), the Sandy bridge, laptop edition, finally closes much of the gap it has with desktop counterparts, contrary to earlier generations of laptop CPUs.
 
As for not getting used to OSX, I wouldn't worry about it, Win & runs perfectly on a MBP and yes, you end up paying a lot of money for a shiny computer, but it is indeed very *shiny*, none of the laptop PC match its polish, they come close to it, but are still a step behind (and are about as expensive anyway).
 
EDIT: woops, didn't read the latest posts before posting.

 
 
Windows runs for the most part unnoticeably differently on a Mac, especially if you've come from a low-end Wintel machine. However drivers can be a problem and you will definitely experience less stable operation in general when compared, once again, to a PC of similar prices. Backup & restore can also be a hair-losing prospect at times due to the way the Boot Camp partition is arranged. No such problems if you run in Fusion / Parallels all the time but this is likely to be a frustrating experience in the long run if you have any real demands in Windows.
 
 
Generally speaking though, if Windows is your priority a Mac is a half-assed experience, certainly in terms of what you pay. The design elements are cetainly very nice, but they usually come with functional compromises... and as such, it's usually more suitable for people who wouldn't be aware of such compromises because their needs aren't as advanced or critical than they themselves might think. If you just want to dabble in OSX, I'd recommend buying a used machine... from what I've been able to sell my oldest unibodies for, the 'Apples have great resale' myth seems to be just that, a myth.
 
 
I'm actually typing this while sitting in a snack bar before a One To One session... only my second ever, and I've been a One To One member / ticking the One To One boxes on new machines for years... (Just like I have a Mobileme account and never seem to use it for anything worthwhile)... heh.
 

 

[BlackbeardBen]

All I can say is "Thinkpad W701ds"...
 

 

[bangraman]

All I can say is "premature hernia"...

 

[BlackbeardBen]

Well, he's talking dual hard drives, a 1920xSomething screen up to 17.3", an i7, USB 3.0 and eSata, etc., etc.
 
That's a lot of laptop, especially for the secondary notebook of a master's student.  It's really an unfathomable amount for a master's student, from my perspective as one...  That much can get you a pretty good used car!  But the O.P. has the money to spend, so...
 
Anyway, it sounds like he's looking for a desktop replacement type computer - which is exactly what the W701ds is.  It's perhaps the best one, especially for photo/video editing, because it has a built-in colorimeter, Wacom tablet/digitizer, and the extra screen for your toolboxes and whatnot.  Dual hard drive bays and for memory slots are a big deal, too.  Oh, and 1920x1200 is a huge advantage, because it lets you view 1080p video at 100% with room on top and bottom for toolbars.  That's my only real complaint about the T510 I have.
 
Now, if I had a computer that big, I'd probably go for an X201 tablet as a companion.  A small notebook with an IPS screen is too good to pass up.
 
To the O.P.: You're fully familiar with SSDs and the performance benefits that the do and do not provide, right?  Faster boot times and faster program load times are a given, because non-sequential read times are indeed much faster.  But large HDDs still have similar write times, so save times and copying files to your HDD from external drives or flash memory (photos, videos, etc.) don't have any huge advantages with SSDs.  Also, if you partition a large HDD to use only the outer part of the disc, you dramatically increase sequential read times to levels that are almost as high as SSDs.  That's how I have my hard drives partitioned - the OS and programs on the first 15% or so.  You'll basically get almost double the average read speed of your drive, and you'll still have the other partition for whatever other use you'd like.  I just use mine for backup, so the heads stay on the OS partition most of the time.
 
Basically, I think the hundreds you'll save over getting a fast SSD would be better spent on better lenses for the camera(s) you get...  They won't be (near) worthless in five years, compared to the i7 and whatever else you put in a $5000 laptop - which as far as I'm concerned is a waste unless you will make more money as a result of the computer than what you paid for it.  We're talking near-instant depreciation compared to a solid semi-investment in lenses - which will be cutting edge for a decade and still useable 50 years from now.  Anyone use 50 year old computers on a day-to-day basis?

 

[Welly Wu]

Yes, I am familiar with SSDs versus conventional hard drives. I do know about advanced partitioning to increase the performance of conventional hard drives. For me, it is much simpler to create whole volumes that consume the maximum allocated disk space. Microsoft BitLocker technology works best in this configuration in my experience.
 
I realize that this is a lot of money for a notebook PC, but I am comfortable with spending that kind of money for one. I am buying a SUV vehicle by the end of this year anyway.
 
For creative content creation, it is hard to pass up the features and performance of the Lenovo IBM Thinkpad W701DS. I have extra money set aside for a digital DSLR camera (i.e., $1,500.00 USD) and a full HD digital videocamera (i.e., $1,750.00 USD) already so it is just a matter of doing more research before making my purchases. I plan to get involved in photography and shooting HD videos as side hobbies this year. It's my new year's resolutions to do so.

 

[BlackbeardBen]

Sure, I understand.
 
About the DSLR/HD camera - why buy into two systems?  Why not get a DSLR that is good at video, and spend the money you save on not getting a video camera on mounts (to adapt the DSLR for primary video use), mics, lenses, and other gear?  You'll free up a lot of money for buying better lenses - which are what really make the difference.
 
$1500 isn't a lot to spend on a camera system and $1750 isn't a lot to spend on a video camera (perhaps a system).  Combined, however - $3250 - that's enough to get a quite good setup if you spend wisely.  Cameras, however, can get very expensive very quickly - it's easy to spend $10,000 if you want to, and still not have everything you need.

 

[Welly Wu]

At my level as a beginner in photography and video, it would not be wise to spend more money than I already have in my bank account that I allocated for the digital DSLR and full HD videocamera. I am looking into NJIT or Essex County College to see if they offer beginner courses in photography or shooting videos. That is important for me.
 
If I wind up buying a Lenovo IBM Thinkpad, then it will most certainly be a W series with a dual screen though it may not be the 701ds because I am still waiting for the aforementioned technologies to become available at the Lenovo web store.
 
Even with a budget of $5,000.00 USD for a secondary notebook PC for a master's student, I cannot afford a Dell Precision M6500 Covet with all of the key future technologies that I am still waiting for.
 
I will look into the Hewlett Packard EliteBook 8740w more closely. I like the fact that it comes with the Trusted Platform Computing 1.2 chip which makes it compatible with Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit and Microsoft Bitlocker technology which I use extensively right now for all of my data.
 
When you look into the features and prices, it seems that Lenovo with its IBM Thinkpad W series offer the most value for the money. Realistically, I am looking for a Lenovo IBM Thinkpad W702DS or something like that. I will have to wait until Christmas 2011 to make my purchasing decision because I want to wait for Microsoft Windows 7 Service Pack 1 and Microsoft Windows Internet Explorer 9 to be released to manufacturing and be ready to buy off the shelf when I am ready to buy my secondary notebook PC.
 
So, I will continue to use my ASUS N61JV-X2 for NJIT. I will use the Lenovo IBM Thinkpad W series to learn more about photography and shooting videos so that I can build up my skills and I will need to make connections with my professors and classmates to further my education. I will see if I can register for courses by next week.

 

[bangraman]

Small maybe, but at 4.5lbs for an actually somewhere near all-day-usable config, way overweight for an optical-less LVi7 unless you *really* want tablet computing. The only reason I have some lying around is due to the fact that I do actually make extensive use of tablet computing... but I suspect even someone like Welly wouldn't.
 
 
When I don't specifically need a tablet, the Sony Z or one of my other actually thin-and-lights are carried far more often. Also, the advantages of IPS screens for mobile use are overstated. The X201T's screen is pretty dim to start with, and the only real advantage over a good matte TN screen is the vertical viewing angles (which obviously a tablet needs, but a conventional notebook doesn't to anywhere near the same degree).
 
Quote:

 
Now, if I had a computer that big, I'd probably go for an X201 tablet as a companion.  A small notebook with an IPS screen is too good to pass up.