[WernerW]

Absolutely right, goldwerger.
So, I encourage everyone to not listen to anything that is posted here, neither postive nor negative.
Please try to get hands on a demo headphone and listen yourself.
Then you decide by your own, if it is for you or not.
So, forget about all the opinions and reviews here.

 

[number1sixerfan]

That's just flat out untrue.
Just because you get used to a particular sound so much that you think that does not necessarily make it that great in reality.
We can also reverse this by observing the "wonky 007" carrying other traits one may not pay attention to at first.

This is one test track I use nowadays because it is easy to get a sense of the tonal balance or to distinguish which headphone reproduces the kick drum, cymbal or vocal better. Not saying this is a valid test, just saying that what the guy says helps a bit at determining where I'm actually at, although listening to it on speakers that were used for mixing would be a better reference point.
(Of course we also need to believe that a particular mix is "correct", which people can argue about all day long as well.)


The X9000 is above average at best (to my ears anyway considering its cost, there are recordings where it may score higher, but I already wrote about only accepting this "feature" in a lower-end model).
Some characteristics are great, but there are others, which are unimpressive. Feels no more reference (or less like a 'hi-fi product') than others costing way less.
Some of it simply comes from being an electrostat where for instance timbre can be problematic. It is what it is, take it or leave it.
And personally, I don't believe in amps, EQ, mods etc. 'magically eliminating' those things.
So maybe the next version will not be 'better', as tuning it to be 'better' without other drawbacks might be an impossible task by itself.

I don't expect to read about those in this thread at all, because I rarely see somewhat less subjective articles anymore anywhere.
People want to upvote positive thoughts, they also don't want to judge their own gear negatively, I get it.
It just annoys me when I see opinions like these that are so blindsided.
(My opinions should be considered as additional takes towards those, not as hate towards a particular headphone. If anyone is going to claim that the next version is "the one", that basically invalidates everything that was previously said about this model.)

Although I strongly disagree, (to me I see the x9000 as a strong value compared to competition), I very much welcome this kind of perspective. Especially from someone that has actually heard or owned them and given them a go. The fact that you're able to type this much insight alone makes it totally fine and welcome.. and even needed to balance out other perspectives in this thread imo. We all hear differently and that's ok.

It's the flat out trolling from those that haven't heard/owned them that is annoying.

 

[BTD1]

Absolutely right, goldwerger.
So, I encourage everyone to not listen to anything that is posted here, neither postive nor negative.
Please try to get hands on a demo headphone and listen yourself.
Then you decide by your own, if it is for you or not.
So, forget about all the opinions and reviews here.

For many here, myself included, there would have been no possible way to demo these phones. I had to rely on and sift through member impressions. Most members I pay attention to are honest and genuine in their comments. So I find the member reviews that are the most similar to my preferences and make my decision from there. A demo is always better but just not realistic in a lot of cases.

 

[number1sixerfan]

we all have different ears. You can like it, you can hate it, there are no absolutes - we all have different ears.

I assume anyone subscribed to this thread is interested in, has, or want to learn more about the K9k and enrich the enjoyment of everyone else that is joining this thread. that's the only point being part of any community here (at least for me).

Peace all

Agree 100%. It's totally ok if some people love it or don't, that's relevant to every headphone on this site. As long as it stems from genuine and well intentioned conversation, it's all good in my book.

 

[padam]

Although I strongly disagree, (to me I see the x9000 as a strong value compared to competition), I very much welcome this kind of perspective. Especially from someone that has actually heard or owned them and given them a go. The fact that you're able to type this much insight alone makes it totally fine and welcome.. and even needed to balance out other perspectives in this thread imo. We all hear differently and that's ok.

It's the flat out trolling from those that haven't heard/owned them that is annoying.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/vin...s-and-impressions-thread.930051/post-17193474
"2) It absolutely has a distant and relaxed presentation which isn’t my main preference."

These opinions - that are not one-sided - carry way more value and very hard to find (on any high-end headphone, not just the X9000 in particular).
That was my main point. I don't even have anything to say to to posts which do point out certain things.

Not sure what the 'competition' is. As I wrote about the previous test, the most expensive headphone might not necessarily come out as the "most reference". I had a big chuckle when the audio engineering guy said "You get what you pay for".
At least with high-end audio that's not always the case in my experience (which is limited but probably above average by some margin).

I'm certainly not sure if I put the X9000 any higher than the 007 Mk1 - just like that guy on YouTube for that matter, who got attacked instantly, just because of stating his honest personal opinion.
And I should add that he got one of the first units, so it was done by people who only got the X9000 on pre-order as well. They didn't actually owned it either at that point.
Is that not 'trolling' as well by the same token...?

 

[goldwerger]

Agree 100%. It's totally ok if some people love it or don't, that's relevant to every headphone on this site. As long as it stems from genuine and well intentioned conversation, it's all good in my book.

100% agree..

 

[eee1111]

That's just flat out untrue.
Just because you get used to a particular sound so much that you think that does not necessarily make it that great in reality.
We can also reverse this by observing the "wonky 007" carrying other traits one may not pay attention to at first.

This is one test track I use nowadays because it is easy to get a sense of the tonal balance or to distinguish which headphone reproduces the kick drum, cymbal or vocal better. Not saying this is a valid test, just saying that what the guy says helps a bit at determining where I'm actually at, although listening to it on speakers that were used for mixing would be a better reference point.
(Of course we also need to believe that a particular mix is "correct", which people can argue about all day long as well.)


The X9000 is above average at best (to my ears anyway considering its cost, there are recordings where it may score higher, but I already wrote about only accepting this "feature" in a lower-end model).
Some characteristics are great, but there are others, which are unimpressive. Feels no more reference (or less like a 'hi-fi product') than others costing way less.
Some of it simply comes from being an electrostat where for instance timbre can be problematic. It is what it is, take it or leave it.
And personally, I don't believe in amps, EQ, mods etc. 'magically eliminating' those things.
So maybe the next version will not be 'better', as tuning it to be 'better' without other drawbacks might be an impossible task by itself.

I don't expect to read about those in this thread at all, because I rarely see somewhat less subjective articles anymore anywhere.
People want to upvote positive thoughts, they also don't want to judge their own gear negatively, I get it.
It just annoys me when I see opinions like these that are so blindsided.
(My opinions should be considered as additional takes towards those, not as hate towards a particular headphone. If anyone is going to claim that the next version is "the one", that basically invalidates everything that was previously said about this model.)

yo…a couple things. This is kinda why it’s tough to post here anymore.

1. I’m talking about estats and my experience. So forgive me if I don’t listen to a compressed YouTube video and actually try your method.
2. Average at best is an opinion you can have. I find it laughable but you can think that. Just don’t pass it off as an authority
3. Trance has been trolling a year. A year. When people wanted to have conversations there he was to derail and complain and troll.

So excuse me for kinda eye rolling his posts (and yours)

I don’t post here much anymore because posters like him.

Also…I’ve given my thoughts on many models across all different types and brands. Sometimes I feel like listening to 007mk1 sometimes the susvara I constantly switch. I only said mk2 were a little wonky in sound signature.

I mean what makes people go off like you just did boggles my mind. You misrepresented a ton of what I wrote down

I’m out…..seriously my post wasn’t even mean or controversial or anything and it still got an absurd response. Just say you disagree. Or ignore me lol why I even had to type all of that is pathetic in the first place. A good analogy would be me going into the lcd 5 topic and complaining about how I didn’t like my time with them. Who cares if I didn’t like the lcd5 lol. But the X9K is average at best right? Jeeze next time I put them on my head i will remember they’re average overpriced garbage

 

[padam]

My point wasn't about other posts. Just general one-sided opinions, from which are plenty. And lack of less subjective comparisons.

Anybody who is a little bit smart can find this track and listen in lossless format if he or she wishes. It's not complicated.
It's also not the main point. It's about coupling this to what the guy observing, since from my understanding he recorded it.
That enables the listener to at least get an indirect perspective through his ears of how it 'should' sound.
(Not the same as reading measurement graphs, which only tell certain things.)
Compared to what I have here, I certainly didn't find the X9000's reproduction to be great in absolute terms.
But I am sure that are a lot of other headphones, which would fair a lot worse still.

For instance, I don't agree with everything Bob Katz says. But he works with music, not just listens to it.
I reckon he would instantly say the X9000 is bright per se, which I wouldn't disagree with.
Although other people have no problems with the 009.
So, from that perspective, I can see why it would be appealing, I said that from the very beginning.

 

[number1sixerfan]

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/vin...s-and-impressions-thread.930051/post-17193474
"2) It absolutely has a distant and relaxed presentation which isn’t my main preference."

These opinions - that are not one-sided - carry way more value and very hard to find (on any high-end headphone, not just the X9000 in particular).
That was my main point. I don't even have anything to say to to posts which do point out certain things.

I hear you here. I definitely do, and agree.

Not sure what the 'competition' is. As I wrote about the previous test, the most expensive headphone might not necessarily come out as the "most reference". I had a big chuckle when the audio engineering guy said "You get what you pay for".
At least with high-end audio that's not always the case in my experience (which is limited but probably above average by some margin).

I'm certainly not sure if I put the X9000 any higher than the 007 Mk1 - just like that guy on YouTube for that matter, who got attacked instantly, just because of stating his honest personal opinion.
And I should add that he got one of the first units, so it was done by people who only got the X9000 on pre-order as well. They didn't actually owned it either at that point.
Is that not 'trolling' as well by the same token...?

By competition I mean the “TOTL” headphones available today at or around the same price, give or take a few thousands. To my ears they outperform quite a bit that’s out there, even if it’s presentation isn’t my full preference. The only headphone I have recently heard that just flat out outperforms it is the SGL Sr. (which is just ridiculously priced). These two simply outperform everything else technically that I can think of that I have heard today. But that is only my opinion, so ultimately in the framing of this conversation it doesn’t matter much, as I respect your POV and we just see it differently. And that’s ok.

Also, I get the part about the Mk1, again preference is such a large factor. And I’ve come to respect the MK1 quite a bit more since having the T2. I do now get if it’s endgame for people. I’ve also come across some people that still prefer the 009, or the Omega. The thing I actually love about Stax is how uniquely different and all high performing their TOTL offerings are.

On the trolling piece (which this will be my last post addressing), no you don’t need to own a piece of gear to share an unfavorable opinion. Obviously that’s best case scenario, in home demo with time next, and short single session last. But intent matters, and there has been intentional trolling in this thread from one person repeatedly with an agenda that has simply not tried the headphone which completely takes away from the takes from people like you that have, that are valuable to the conversation. I am speaking very specific to this thread, not YouTube or anything else. And it has nothing to do with your posts or anyone else that is sharing genuine impressions.

 

[Ciggavelli]

I just gotta say that the soundstage, instrument separation and layering are really impressive with the X9K. I do think it does that better than the Shangri-la. The Shangri-la has higher resolution though.

The X9K really reminds me of the Susvaras for some reason. I guess both are fairly laid back.

 

[BassicScience]

I just gotta say that the soundstage, instrument separation and layering are really impressive with the X9K. I do think it does that better than the Shangri-la. The Shangri-la has higher resolution though.

The X9K really reminds me of the Susvaras for some reason. I guess both are fairly laid back.

Totally agree that the X9K is at or near the top for soundstaging and separation. It's probably somewhat amp-dependent, but in my setup the Susvara is more incisive and tactile than the X9K, and is clearly better at rendering rock music. The Susvara's stage isn't as wide, but it also layers instruments extremely well, IMO.

 

[hifixman]

The synergy is the key!

 

[Nomax]

This video was shown to me in Heidelberg, Thomas (unfortunately, it is not yet available publicly).
Axel claimed that Stax doesn't channelize bass through their earpad geometry compared to some other headphone manufacturers. But he did not concretely say that X9000 had a bad bass!

I interpret this by applying Bernoulli's Law, which means increasing the air pressure by decreasing the duct diameter as the sound wave travels from the diaphragm to the ear.
Of course, this allows you to increase the decibels in the pressure-sensitive low-frequency range.

However, this does not automatically mean that the decibels for certain headphones are too low without the application of such a "Bernoulli pressure amplification". It might even get too much boost there. Or do you want to have an exaggerated bass hump? Maybe nice for Heavy Metal music. Take an EQ if you like to adapt the FR to your very personal preferences!

And please don't forget that even Axel - whom I admire as a very experienced and knowledgeable electrical engineer - is talking about his own "baby" (= Sennheiser HE-1) compared to the competition (at eye hight, this certainly is the Stax X9000 and, of course, the Shangri-La Sr).
Normally, no one professionally involved in the headphone business is free from biased opinions .

We will see on measurements soon Werner. The rest is speculation.
Shame Nomax did not post the video with Axel Grell saying why Stax has no bass lol.

NOMAX

PS.lol

 

[Trance_Gott]

NOMAX

PS.lol

Gregor I know you warn me not buy it but I think for fun I will buy it in future. Not easy to get one I heared in the beginning of next year the first dealers will have stock that is not pre ordered. I never pre order headphones months before lol.
I want to feel the same bass quantity vs the CRBN. Shame Gregor you don't feel it hehe.
Or was you wrong like the guy on Youtube?

 

[WernerW]

NOMAX

PS.lol

As I already mentioned, the Bernoulli effect (which Axel explains in that video. He does not exactly cite Bernouilli but the channellizing effect by the earcups of, e.g., a HE-1, is nothing else than described by the Bernoulli equations) acts like a pressure amplification for the lower frequency domain being mainly prone to air pressure conditions, more than the sound wave propagation at higher frequencies.

But this kind of enhancement of the SPL at the bass region means nothing else than some added decibels of enhancement of the frequency response.
It also may lead to an exaggerated bass hump and thus to a thickened mid bass. Not necessarily of course, but it may happen. So, after all, the overall frequency response is important and this should be sufficiently "balanced" (e.g. into the direction of the Harman curve, but not necessarily Harman, depending on everyone's taste).

Also here it is a question of personal taste, if you want to have a mid bass hump for heavy metal music or if you want to have a dry, accurate and balanced bass and overall balanced frequency response for acoustic music.
Also here, it is a question of personal taste.
And I think, this is a good thing, there are so many different headphones available in the market for different human tastes and fitting for different genres of music.
So, I think for padam and Trance_Gott, maybe a dynamic-transducer-based headphone would be the better choice.