Stax Omega II...dark sounding? Not any more.

[ServinginEcuador]

Well, after trying out some pretty decent ICs I finally took the plunge and took Vertigo-1's advice and got a pair of Z Cable Live v5 single ended ICs. Got them off of Audiogon for under $400, shipped and PayPal fees included. They don't come up for sale often, and now I know why.

Anyway, in another thread I commented on how the Omegas had a slightly dark sound to them. I tried (4) different pairs of ICs in order to fix that, all to varying degrees of success. The RS Audio, which received rave reviews and of which I had the highest hopes was also the biggest letdown. (Mine were the balanced Mk I solid silver version.) At first I thought they were pretty good. They made the slightly dark Omegas more lively. Too lively in fact. After listening to them again I found that they were a bit too tipped-up for my taste. They took a super neutral system and made the highs overdone and too out of balance with the mids and lows. Definitely not for me.

Next up were the W Enterprises NW MUSIC Timbre ICs. Again, these are the balanced version which comes with two strands of their gold/silver/copper alloy vice the one strand that comes with the single ended version. All in all this was the cable that won me over with its sweet presentation that was slightly warm, yet nowhere near overdone. It was smooth from top to bottom with a very sweet sound. The slightly dark sound with a slight lack of bass became my conclusion of these with the Omegas. I could easily have lived with them as they were a real bargain and sounded VERY nice.

Lastly, I got a pair of the highly regarded Z Cable Live v5s. I first hooked them up and noticed a drop in volume. Switching from balanced to single ended normally takes a dive due to the different output levels. These were no exception. At first I had to go a good 8 clicks on the DACTs in order to get satisfactory volume. After a while of listening to them I kept turning them down to where I am only about 2-4 clicks above the balanced IC settings. Another thing I noticed was another slight step-up in details. It wasn't anything huge, but it was noticeable and welcome to my ears. Another thing that appears to be happening is a slight increase in bass from the cans. It is not a big change, but appears to fill in the bass just enough to where I retain hope for my CDP. I considered getting rid of it due to a lack of bass, but I think it is more IC related than anything. An amazing thing is that while the cables are highly detailed, they don't detract any from the musical enjoyment. They maintain a sense of presenting the music in such a way that remains totally enjoyable.

So, now the normally slightly dark Omega IIs have turned out to be even better due to a mere IC change. A slight addition of bass, combined with the removal of their dark presentation made me stay up until after 1AM last listening to some of my favorite CDs.

Am I happy? You bet. Am I done? For now... I may consider a balanced version of this cable, but I have had it with buying ICs and losing some money with each pair. My already favorite W Enterprise NW cables have, in this system, been surpassed rather handily, and leave me with an ear to ear grin that just won't go away whenever I listen to some tunes.

 

[jpelg]

Thanks for the update Doug. Always informative.

Can you elaborate what exactly you mean when you describe the former "dark" sound? It's just that within the context of your post, I can't extract what that means to you in audio terms.

Thanks.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Jimmy,

I use dark as the best way to say the opposite of bright. Tipped-up, rolled-off are also opposite terms I tend to use to describe this phenomenon, depending on which applies.

Sorry about the confusion. Some terms can be taken a few different ways and I'll have to make sure I make it clear when I use something that could be somewhat ambiguous.

 

[jpelg]

Thanks, man. That helps.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Quote:

Originally posted by jpelg Thanks, man. That helps.

Man, you're fast! I edited my original post to reword it. It sounded bad or a little aggressive IMO. Just wanted to make sure it came across as nothing more than explaining how I used the term.

 

[jpelg]

None taken. I only wanted to clarify in my own mind.

I've read where people equate a 'dark' sound more so with extra bass, rather than (just) rolled-off highs. Although I can see how both could go hand-in-hand.

But then you describe your setup as lacking in bass. In my most recent experiences with the Omega II's, they were anything but lacking in bass. Hence my confusion, or at least, ambiguous interpretation.

Now that I mention it, my earlier auditions of the Omega II's were not so positive, in that they sounded bright! That, as it turned out, was due to a cabling problem then as well.

Ha! Who says IC's don't matter?

 

[lan]

Quote:

Originally posted by jpelg I've read where people equate a 'dark' sound more so with extra bass, rather than (just) rolled-off highs. Although I can see how both could go hand-in-hand. But then you describe your setup as lacking in bass. In my most recent experiences with the Omega II's, they were anything but lacking in bass.

More bass or rolled off high. It's relative.

I think the Omega IIs can lack bass depeding on source. Did you hear the massive difference between the Wadia and Cary source at our last head-fi meet?

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Quote:

Originally posted by jpelg I've read where people equate a 'dark' sound more so with extra bass, rather than (just) rolled-off highs. Although I can see how both could go hand-in-hand.

It is easy to do when the system is out of balance. For me it is easy to hear what is rolled-off and what is a lack of bass since I have music that has specific instruments that I listen for to see how it sounds. The RS Audio cables were REALLY easy to spot as being tipped-up since the plucking sound of a guitar in one nearly complete CD was SO out of whack it wasn't funny. That specific frequency was louder than the note and way louder than it should have been.

Quote:

Now that I mention it, my earlier auditions of the Omega II's were not so positive, in that they sounded bright! That, as it turned out, was due to a cabling problem then as well. Ha! Who says IC's don't matter?

Not I said the fly! They can and do make rather large differences. To me, they are the LAST thing on the list of items to buy and try. Get the cans and source out of the way first, then play with cabling until you get the most of what you're looking for.

If you could hear the way that this rig is now performing I think you would be rather impressed with the sound of the Omega IIs. It is simply stunning it is so good now. The W Ent cables made it sound pretty good too, but the removing of the slightly dark sound it is now stellar. All is good in DougLand once again.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Another wonderful side effect to these Z Cables is their sheer dynamic presentation. Going from single ended to balanced using the Electrocompaniet CDP usually results in a drop in dynamics that lead me to believe that only the balanced outs can be as dynamic as I liked. Well, these single ended cables proved me wrong in that regard.

The music seems to go both quieter and louder during musical passages. There is something to their design which allows for this. These ICs are so light that it feels like they will blow around behind your equipment. They appear to be a little thick, like a normal IC, but there is so little to them they weigh next to nothing. When I took them out of the bag they come in I handed them to my wife to feel how light they were. The philosophy behind this is that all the shielding and such causes smearing and reduces dynamics. Whatever the folks at Z Cable think, I for one am convinced they are onto something. It seems that a couple of other manufacturers are coming to the little insulation theory. The idea is to have nothing more than an air dialectric inside the cable, minimizing where the signal cable touches a dialectric.

More thought to come once I get a good 100-200 hours on the cables and then begin to cableroll a bunch to get a better idea of what is going on. Right now the wife and I are about to enjoy a 3 hour extravaganza of The Two Towers, Platinum Edition. See ya after the movie.

 

[Calanctus]

SiE, how did you break in the interconnects you tried?

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Quote:

Originally posted by Calanctus SiE, how did you break in the interconnects you tried?

Same way I always do as of now: music + time while on my noggin'.. I used to leave the CDP in repeat mode all night to break them in, but now I have started just listening as I go. I bought these cables used off of A'gon, so all I did was put them on and start listening to some music. Impressive to say the least. I switched over from my W Ent cables to these as soon as I got them.

Oh, the paper that came with the Z Cable ICs says not to use a cable cooker or special music for breaking in their cables. It says that this can alter their sonic characteristics. Therefore I didn't use my Pink Noise CD I normally run at night while I'm sleeping. Normally, I would listen to normal music during the day, then leave it on all night with the Pink Noise. Now I am not so willing to leae the CDP running all night casing wear and tear. I paid so much for it I would rather get as many years of listening time adn opposed to just let it run and wear out while I am not listening to it.


[EDIT] Sorry Calantus, I broke in the first (4) cables using both music during the day, and Pink Noise at night. Not all were done this way, but at least 2 were. After a while I stopped due to the above reason of wear and tear on the CDP. I started using just music while I listened.

 

[Calanctus]

Thanks for the reply. Some people say that silver cables never really break in fully without using extreme measures (e.g. a cable cooker).

I'll keep my eye on the Z cable products when I'm next looking for ICs.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Calanctus,

I'll have to try out these cables with my dynamic cans. They work supremely well with the electrostatics, but I'm not sure how they will sound with the dyanamics. If they aren't too bright with them they will be some truly spectacular cables indeed.

The other cables that I worry about are the RS Audio. They are also silver, but their tipped-up nature has never diminished since I got them. I will have to see how they compare to the Z Cables soon.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Well, after an A/B session I can definitely say one thing for certain: upon removing the Z Cable ICs and replacing them with the W Enterprise NW balanced ICs there is a definite difference in the highs of the Omegas. A bit of the nice sparkle they had went away and left them darker sounding. It wasn't a huge difference, but it was denitely there and enough to place the Z Cables ahead in my books. The highs of the cymbals lost a little sheen, piano and guitar notes lost a little bite they just had.


I will report more on this aspect later, but it also appears that the Z Cable ICs also have a more dynamic sound to them. This is amazing due to the fact that this CDP I own is "supposed" to have a more dynamic output at the balanced out, and the Z Cables I own are single ended. If this proves to be the case after some careful testing of the two cables and careful volume matching, these will be an amazing set of cables indeed, and quite a steal at the price I paid for them.

The bass difference is another area I plan to look at more thoroughly as it is hard to say without doing a lot more swapping back and forth. Suffice to say that they both sound rather nice bass wise, and whether there is any difference will pan out over time.

 

[dparrish]

Quote:

I may consider a balanced version of this cable

Unfortunately, Z cable does not currently make a balanced version of this cable. This is what will likely keep me from trying one in my Omega II/717 system. I need a balanced cable to go from my Classe SSP25 pre/pro to the Stax 717--I have no more single-ended outs available.

That having been said, I'm very happy with my Acoustic Zen Silver Reference IIs (that I'm currently using between the Sony XA777ES and the Stax 717), so I may get a second (balanced)pair of these eventually--though I'm tempted to try something different--perhaps a Cardas Golden Reference. Whatever I decide upon, its going to be rather expensive-unless I can learn how to change the ground and hot pins on one end of the cable (Stax pins theirs the opposite of Classe).