[stringgz301]

I just understood the importance of a high quality source.

Being fairly new to the high quality audio world I started by getting a decent headphone (SR80) and then got a decent combo dac/amp (D10) and migrated all my tunes to flac. Sounded pretty darn good.

Then I decided to build a separate amp and had a great time putting together my CTH. After listening a bunch I upgraded my phones to 325is's and then started tube and cap rolling in the CTH. Looking for a little more detail, a little punchier bass, slightly smoother highs, bigger soundstage ... Never quite right. I definitely had those moments of audio nirvana where something sounded so good that you forgot about all the gear and just heard music. But probably had just as many where it wasn't quite there.

I built up my Buffalo II DAC over the weekend and have been listening quite a bit since then. All of a sudden my little CTH sounds huge. Every instrument and voice is well defined and holds a clear position on the soundstage. The weak bass is gone - now strong, punchy, and holds its own. The highs are rich and not brittle. There is an incredible sense of transparency and reality, that you're on stage with the musicians and not listening to a recording. Musical.

I'm not saying the upgradeitis is cured. What I am saying is don't underestimate the importance of your source. You can spend a lot of time and money trying to fix the problems created by a mediocre source. Or you can start with a really good source and use that as the foundation for your listening experience. Based on my experience I'd suggest the latter.

 

[Il Mostro]

As the saying goes, "you can't make chicken-liver out of chicken-$hit".

 

[lescanard]

x2 on this! My recent purchase of my DacMagic is IMO the most significant and dramatic upgrade I have made to my setup (incl new headphone purchases). I'll upgrade the amp someday soon - but the source upgrade was huge for me.

fyi to experienced head-fiers...when I started here and finally got the nads to post and ask some questions, many kindly suggested "upgrading my source" but to be honest I wasn't totally clear as to what that meant. I spent a lot of time (thankfully) re-ripping to lossless etc thinking that was what was the extent of a source upgrade but no one ever really said "upgrade your DAC to XYZ" nor did I understand what that meant or what it would do for me...I do now! Going from a really nice d10 source to a dacmagic was an eye opener.

 

[tim3320070]

Try a Audio-gd Ref-1 DAC.....spooky good.

 

[parskey]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lescanard /img/forum/go_quote.gif x2 on this! My recent purchase of my DacMagic is IMO the most significant and dramatic upgrade I have made to my setup (incl new headphone purchases). I'll upgrade the amp someday soon - but the source upgrade was huge for me. fyi to experienced head-fiers...when I started here and finally got the nads to post and ask some questions, many kindly suggested "upgrading my source" but to be honest I wasn't totally clear as to what that meant. I spent a lot of time (thankfully) re-ripping to lossless etc thinking that was what was the extent of a source upgrade but no one ever really said "upgrade your DAC to XYZ" nor did I understand what that meant or what it would do for me...I do now! Going from a really nice d10 source to a dacmagic was an eye opener.

Right on the point it's way harder to get DAC recommendation than it is to get amp recommendations. When I was shopping around for a new dac I had posted in some thread but didnt get many replys so I just started to pm people that post their gear in their signature to see how certain combo's worked out and what their impressions were. I think this also goes to show posting your gear in your signature is useful because I got some really good feedback and it made my choice a lot easier to be able to actually talk to people that had the combo of gear I was thinking about getting. Also I think it would be AMAZING if the site admins/devs could somehow make it so you can search for users with specific gear since you can input it into fields in your profile.

 

[devast]

x3 this.
I just came home for Easter from the dorms. I made a mistake and left my dac there. Now i'm listening to the headphone out of my notebook through my trusty CTH, and honestly, it's so crap i can barely hear the difference between tubes. And i do not even have any high-end gear or such... I miss the 3D and the layers of the instruments so much (i won't even mention details and high/low end extention), i have to cry

Amps are great, but without a good source it's kind of pointless to amp the trash.

 

[minimus]

I think an "urban myth" of sorts developed when the CD was first introduced that all CD players sound about the same. I seem to remember reading articles 25 years ago about double-blind tests in which participants could not distinguish between expensive and cheap CD players. I think this view still holds some sway. There seem to be enough folks who are happy using a $200 Oppo as their source in otherwise very expensive rigs.

After buying the PS Audio Perfect Wave DAC and Transport, I can personally attest to how important a good digital source is. The PW DAC+Transport is a revelation compared to every other digital source I have heard.

The problem is that it and its competitors (Ayon CD-2/CD-5, Marantz SA7S1, Meridian 808.2, EMM Labs...) are very expensive, as are some of the "state of the art" computer-based setups (the Modwright Transporter and Ayre QB-9 come to mind). It is easy to blow $3K or more on one of these sources, which seems excessive when the signal is ultimately headed to a pair of headphones that cost $1,500 max but probably less, unless you are into Stax or some out-of-production dynamic headphones.

Ultimately, balance is the best route. I generally think it makes sense to spend about as much on your source as on your amp, possibly a bit more.

 

[atothex]

I think this "all digital sounds the same" myth is perpetuated more by speaker heads, as the source is imo less important in a speaker setup.

"Source first" works great for headphones, because most headphones are pretty easy to drive. Just need a little bit of clean power.

 

[tim3320070]

Well I can attest that my speaker rig (which runs off the same system as my headphone rig) has improved even more to my ears than audible through my headphones with the AGD source and amp gear I have employed over the last couple of years.

 

[minimus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by atothex /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think this "all digital sounds the same" myth is perpetuated more by speaker heads, as the source is imo less important in a speaker setup. "Source first" works great for headphones, because most headphones are pretty easy to drive. Just need a little bit of clean power.

Source is very important in a speaker rig, probably more so than in a headphone rig, because soundstage is more audible in a good speaker system. That said, if you have a great source but crappy downstream components in a speaker rig, you are wasting money. There are a lot of downstream components in a speaker rig (preamp, amp, speakers, assorted cables, room treatments..) and often both volume attenuation and amplification before the signal reaches the speaker. Headphone rigs are much simpler so the signal from the source is much more likely to be unadulterated before it reaches your ears.

 

[nikongod]

The weakest link is the most important one.

 

[atothex]

Mmm... I mean "importance" in more of a monetary sense, as that's about the only way I can think of to quantify importance. Like the ratio of source:amp:speaker prices.

For instance: $600 DAC for $300 phones? Sure. $600 DAC for $300 speakers? Maybe not.

 

[Valens7]

As I've said in the past, I've personally found that the source is the most important part of my headphone system in determining overall its overall sound quality. Buy a good one right out of the gate I say, since then you will probably be less inclined to upgrade it in the near term.

 

[parskey]

I bought a basically new misterx y2 for 380 shipped and my d2000's were 250 shipped, and amp was 134+40 for a new opamp and some tubes. I think it was a pretty good way to spend.

 

[mrarroyo]

I have always subscribed that the input and output are the most important components. By input I used to think of the cartridge in a turntable and for output a good set of speakers. Now with headphones I think of source as the file/player and of course the headphone. But to me it is also a matter of balance and synergy, using a $250 source with a $5,000 headphone is out of balance (unless it is for a short period until you get a better source). So although I put most of the emphasis on sources and headphones I do not forget to keep the items in between at the same level of quality.