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But it would be interesting to hear from folks using their 1Z or 1A with an extra portable amp. If you look back into this thread maybe a couple hundred posts, you will see I'm not the only one simply pointing out that there are limitations to the amp in the 1Z/1A.
After seeing graphs it's pretty much accepted that even easy to drive IEMs as well as normal full-size headphones are going to sound like they have more bass coming from a more powerful amp.
If you are referring to graphs that were posted in the Focal Clear thread (pointing to these measurements) - they didn't really point to a powerful amp having more bass, but rather how the impedance matching of the headphone with the amp output will have a very noticeable effect on the bass response. In this case the comparison was between 0.2ohm vs 120ohm impedance. However the take away is not there is any limitation to the amp in the Walkman (which has very low impedance), but rather pointing to that dreadful word which some people don't like to use - the "synergy" of the pairing. The result is then a completely subjective matter, as some may not prefer the boosted bass response, and one cannot jump to conclude that either setup is better/worse, just different.
Yes, that's it. Dock came way before the Signature series and accepts the wm port. It works well with 1A, 1Z, ZX100 and many others. Go for it. You can play, charge simultaneously. Also, use another cable and connect to your computer, toggle a switch at the back and start transferring music.
Well, to be truthfull I went to purchase the 1Z in hopes of replacement of much of my home rigs. In many reviews and maybe in an advertisement or two, that's the level these things are pushed to. But I'm totally happy to be able to be closer to changing files and having it all in my hands as a nice home rig. I have yet to listen to a ton of full size headphones with it. but the Sony Z5 IEMs sound pretty darn close to full size headphones in balanced mode. So it's win-win.
This talk maybe only effects those who are on the fence about purchasing a 5K home rig or a Walkman as their home rig?
I'm in the same boat as far as my interest in the 1Z. I use a modest transportable home setup of a ZX1 on a docking station connected to a Hugo and Cavalli LC, and frankly the sound is about perfect for me with my iems. But I too was intrigued with the idea of having a single DAP that could at least come close to replacing this setup. Maybe wishful thinking, but the thought of simplifying and being able to move more easily around the house (I don't listen much out in public) was what inspired me to do the research and purchase the 1z. I've truly reached a point in this hobby where I don't swap equipment for listening and want to just use the one setup that pleases me most with all genres of music. So simplicity is the ideal and I no longer have an inventory of equipment I don't use. My wife certainly liked the idea so she wouldn't have to worry about where my setup was when she decides to move furniture around! lol Still waiting to try out the 4.4mm conncection, so we'll see!
Hi man apologies for the late reply. I'm trying to stay away from Head-Fi for a bit to focus on other things.
I listened to the Ultima SS last year at Canjam London. I listened on both days for a while, but it was a busy show so take my impressions with a grain of salt.
The Ultima and 1Z are polar opposites; the 1Z is one of the warmer players, tuned for timbre. The AK in turn is tuned for maximum detail based on clarity, besides resolution. People might have different preferences for tonality, with some preferring the brighter AK, and others the warmer and smoother 1Z. An analogy would be comparing iems as Zeus or Katana to something like the 5-Way or Prelude. Personally, I find timbre important, and objectively, the 1Z has a significantly more accurate timbre. The Ultima's pursuit of detail comes at the cost of its tonality. I wanted to like it, but found it sterile. Of course, to each their own. I'm still hoping to try the Cu sometime.
I find the 1Z mod brings more balance between its midrange and treble, while improving resolution. But it retains a predominantly warmer than neutral signature, when compared to daps as the LPG or Ultima; the mod doesn't make it neutral or bright altogether. However, for me it is the perfect balance between tonality and performance; it presents a high level of detail in a smooth and natural manner. By contrast, if you generally prefer a brighter signature, the Ultima might be a better fit.
I've had Sony and Panasonic portables ever since the late 1980s, and absolutely the 1Z is one of the best I've heard. Though Ray Samuels once showed me a balanced Audio Emmeline F-35 and "Baby Orpheus?" combo at a home meet that was mind blowing.
It's just that your paying for the fact that everything is small. The benefits are that it's an all in one unit; the variables are lowered. There is no choice of having to get power regulators or RCA interconnects. So Sony can give the consumer one complete package. Our control is simply IEM choices and IEM cable choices. And our final improvement choice is obviously music file choices.
And all this is fully subjective, with maybe the best IEM reviewers simply talking about sound image placement being different after they take their IEMs out of the Z1 and plug them into a reference home rig. In many ways there is such a delicate balance and smoothness from the Z1 which ends up being natural and organic. Mid-Fi home systems are simply going to change the overall IEM sound. But in my humble opinion (depending on equipment) the sound is more reference than the Sony Signature Walkman.
Sony must know this to include the TA-ZH1ES amp and extra docking system (or cord) to get the 1A and 1Z to performance of home rigs. But the ease of use is you can take your Walkman to work then listen at home all with one integrated system. We can now see companies like Sennheiser are adapting 4.4mm Pentaconn cables to everything new so far, even the new Flagship HD820 full-size headphone.
But it would be interesting to hear from folks using their 1Z or 1A with an extra portable amp. If you look back into this thread maybe a couple hundred posts, you will see I'm not the only one simply pointing out that there are limitations to the amp in the 1Z/1A.
After seeing graphs it's pretty much accepted that even easy to drive IEMs as well as normal full-size headphones are going to sound like they have more bass coming from a more powerful amp. After studying graphs it's almost always a fact that the bass has only been increased by about 1 decibel, that what's occurring is actually much more wonderful. Even with easy to drive IEMs (more with dynamic driver IEMs).......the bass seems like more but it's only more delineated and clear. The slight increase in amp power is just making the bass more clear.
And besides the slight image placement changes using home equipment with your IEMs, it's that bass clarify which is most noticeable in direct comparison with using the the Walkman Signatures with your IEMs.
The whole argument with using a CD transport attempting at better timing is also a highly subjective matter. As using the Signature Series normally bypasses any and all USB timing issues we may encounter with a computer. That's really one of the main reasons I love the Z1 so much, and my idea of maybe why they will never upgrade the FW to make it a computer DAC.
Yeah, 1Z + Docking cradle into my Stax 009 + T2 is simply amazing.
The battery would last for weeks, if I leave the 1Z on the shelves alone without plugging it in.
Yes, Sony included Cables are horrible for cables data transfer for audio performances. Matter of facts, I upgraded cables inside my docking cradles and USB cables too.
The 1Z is fairly awesome for what it can do, the audio quality performances, battery life, and powerful enough to power the Utopia which is a full-size headphones. Yeah, it is a Portable Player, so if you want to run any Othors, I don’t even think any Portable amplifier can help vastly. The point I am trying to make is that, if you look for Portable amplifier, you are sitting half way into real performances that you can get for your cans out of a properly functional desktop amplifier.
But at the same time I’ve spent most of my day with other equipment just to go back to the 1Z and use it on it’s own to try to establish maybe a view of quality that it has which is unique. Call it the color, or character or whatever, but the sound is a coherent and cohesive composite of sorts with my IEMs. And..........as we all know much of finding stuff to work...........in the end is all about subjective “mind-tricks” when, as listeners with IEMs (as in contrast to full-size headphones) we can trick ourselves and mentally tunnel the audio perception to a point of forgetting about any inability at hand and bask in the musical bliss. And musical bliss isn’t always about certain cymbals being extended out the widest or bass going the lowest or being the most detailed. IMO
And just like low power full-range single driver tube amp speaker set-ups, these concepts normally start with an idea of audio pristine sources and simplicity in equipment choices.
In many ways by itself the Z1 offers that lower power slightly warm tube sound with just a hint of character, yet not blurry in details. Just offering a cohesive soundstage, where all things are correct.
So much of this hobby is always about getting to the next level. And this next few months I am going to try and adapt the 1Z to full size cans in what may seem like the best way. In earlier posts I did admit to getting a more reference sound from other equipment, but again as always it’s not always the flat response that’s makes a stereo product magic, but simply the unique character it holds. In the next 60 days or so, I guess l’ll have to figure out how to transport that character into full size headphones if possible?
Hi man apologies for the late reply. I'm trying to stay away from Head-Fi for a bit to focus on other things.
I listened to the Ultima SS last year at Canjam London. I listened on both days for a while, but it was a busy show so take my impressions with a grain of salt.
The Ultima and 1Z are polar opposites; the 1Z is one of the warmer players, tuned for timbre. The AK in turn is tuned for maximum detail based on clarity, besides resolution. People might have different preferences for tonality, with some preferring the brighter AK, and others the warmer and smoother 1Z. An analogy would be comparing iems as Zeus or Katana to something like the 5-Way or Prelude. Personally, I find timbre important, and objectively, the 1Z has a significantly more accurate timbre. The Ultima's pursuit of detail comes at the cost of its tonality. I wanted to like it, but found it sterile. Of course, to each their own. I'm still hoping to try the Cu sometime.
I find the 1Z mod brings more balance between its midrange and treble, while improving resolution. But it retains a predominantly warmer than neutral signature, when compared to daps as the LPG or Ultima; the mod doesn't make it neutral or bright altogether. However, for me it is the perfect balance between tonality and performance; it presents a high level of detail in a smooth and natural manner. By contrast, if you generally prefer a brighter signature, the Ultima might be a better fit.
Okay I understand the difference between moded Sony and AK. I have stock 1Z and to my ears stock AK has better subbass and highs, by the way 1Z has much bigger and colorful midbass. On the one hand I really like AK subbass, clearance, highs on the other hand Sony enjoys more natural mid-range. So I've thought may be rewiring will give 1Z more subbass and a lit bit more resolution.
In future could you possibly write a review with comparing moded 1Z and AK SS or Cu version side by side?
Okay I understand the difference between moded Sony and AK. I have stock 1Z and to my ears stock AK has better subbass and highs, by the way 1Z has much bigger and colorful midbass. On the one hand I really like AK subbass, clearance, highs on the other hand Sony enjoys more natural mid-range. So I've thought may be rewiring will give 1Z more subbass and a lit bit more resolution.
In future could you possibly write a review with comparing moded 1Z and AK SS or Cu version side by side?
Hi buddy, if you or somebody else wants to send an Ultima my way I'd be more than happy to, but other than that I don't see it happening hehe. If a Cu comes available in the FS section I might take a risk, but I'd ideally like to try it somewhere.
Yes the AK has great power in its sub-bass, I remember it having great authority in its low end. The mod won't really change much of the Sony's bass unfortunately, but it will improve its resolution. Similarly, its treble will still be nowhere nearly as bright as the AK's, but it will have more balance and a nice touch of sparkle.
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