[proedros]

  If people want to talk about an issue they should be able to even if it is negative.  Otherwise it becomes a love fest and the forum becomes boring and pointless.  

 
i don't mind negativity , but i prefer relativity (to the wm1a)

ok you want wifi , and sony does not - we get it.
 
but seeing posts again and again rehashing the same soci-economic structures of the world as you try to tell us why sony should have implemented wifi , it's boring - and it's rather derailing to the thread.
 
ok you want wifi but this is not a dap that offers it - plenty daps out there with wifi to choose from
 
cheers

 

[Metalsludge]

Wow, the release of a new high-end DAP seems to bring up a lot of hotly debated issues about the industry as a whole - standards for balanced output, operating systems, streaming, the value of DSD etc. One can tell the industry is going through lots of changes at once. 
 
Don't personally mind the lack of streaming or the choice of balanced connection or operating system as a deal breaker, but this does seem like another case where the highest end model costs way more than the next model down for little reason beyond exclusivity and metal type, and a few minor internals differences. Functionality is mostly the same, yet they want so much more money, that it feels suspicious. As such, I think I will steer clear of the bling version, and only keep the more sane model on my radar.
 
We all have our own odd little needs though. I would like a warmer sounding DAP than the AK models that doesn't sacrifice too much clarity, and has lots of power. This new Sony model seems to have the power covered, but we don't have many impressions of the sound yet. I look forward to hearing more about how this thing's sound goes.

 

[Zakalwe]

i don't mind negativity , but i prefer relativity (to the wm1a)


ok you want wifi , and sony does not - we get it.

but seeing posts again and again rehashing the same soci-economic structures of the world as you try to tell us why sony should have implemented wifi , it's boring - and it's rather derailing to the thread.

ok you want wifi but this is not a dap that offers it - plenty daps out there with wifi to choose from

cheers

Well, if companies are to change their product planning, they need to hear loud complaints. Personally I am happy the pendulum swung in my favour this time - button controls, no Android (on a DAP it feels like buying a cow when I want a glass of milk), no Wifi-shenanigans, just stripped down to the essentials and those hopefully done well. I would not buy the dream-DAP of the complainers, but I understand their frustration - I was frustrated about the previous DAPs, and I am glad that the whining of people like me was successful. So let the complainers complain, I say, maybe then the NW-WM2 will be more to their liking next year, and I can still enjoy my WM1.

 

[muzic4life]

I hope someone can give any impression on 1Z vs 1A. Hopefully soon

I like the black color much better, but if 1Z's SQ wins by significant margin..then i would definitely consider the 1Z.

 

[nanaholic]

Per capita income will tell you a lot if you are selling 3200$ dap! İt is like selling Ferrari in Asia only, you may sell a lot, they would be popular but it is also stupid to discard the needs of the europe/north america!
Streaming is the future there is no escaping from it, i am not saying the current bussines model is perfect but streaming is here to stay! Check netfix etc!
Saying it wont survive it is just funny thats all.
And where do you get your DAP sales data according to continents? Where can i find it? İs ipod included? Pono? İt is a dap after all, think about if apple comes out with a new ipod where do you think DAP market will be? Asia? So AK might sell more in EAsia does not mean where the market is!!!

 
No it actually doesn't tell you anything like that.  Per capita income only tells you buying power, but doesn't tell you the demand for the product.  Again look at the car example, NA market has good per capita income, but you can't sell them tiny 2 seater electric cars because there is no demand for it, but you can sure as heck sell them a lot of SUVs.  Flip that to Europe, are people buying 2 tonne SUVs in Europe, even with good captia income?  No - because the demand is dictated as much by the culture - not just money. Ever heard the joke about selling ice to Eskimos? Ergo, what is actually the demand for expensive flagship DAPs in Western markets?   
 
As for market data:
http://www.slideshare.net/AMASASIA/fi-amas03 < check page 7 of the slide - only the regions outside of US/EU is growing for headphone spending and is also the biggest revenue for the past years. One can certainly infer that portable audio is biggest in those area as well because headphones/portable audio equipment goes hand in hand. Thus again, that's where companies like Sony are targeting; the growing and bigger market which are regions *outside* of US/EU eg Asia.  See this is exactly how income per capita doesn't tell you whether the market will buy or not!
 
Now that we've established that the Asia region is the biggest and the only growing market for portable equipment, the rest is easy to talk about (sorry for all the Japanese reports).
 
http://www.jas-audio.or.jp/jas_cms/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/document20160427.pdf
Page 5 - of all audio products 31% of the revenue actually comes from DAPs, with headphones following at 18%
Page 27 - Domestically in Japan - biggest source of music is Youtube and CDs purchases, CD rentals.  Only 6% uses dedicated music streaming services in Japan.
Page 29 - nearly 55% of users mainly listen to music during commuting 
 
http://getnavi.jp/av-2/6395/
Sony commands top position - 56% - of the portable player market in Japan. So it's safe to assume they know what their customers - at least in Japan - wants.
 
http://www.phileweb.com/news/d-av/201607/20/39227.html
Surprise! CD and vinyl revenue in Japan is growing YoY. (hence Sony's turntable which rips directly to DSD!)
 
OTOH - services like Tidal and other streaming services aren't making money and is struggling to find a viable business model - basically still chasing after users and selling that to investors just like during the Dotcom bubble.
 
So is it any mind blowing fact that makers like Sony aren't bothering to jump head first into the market where there is no money and a sustainable business model hasn't been found yet? The choices in the product seems pretty well backed by data to me.

 

[chronograf86]

  I suspect Sony decided against streaming and wifi because it costs more to add those features and Sony is all about profit.  Besides if Sony puts every feature possible on the first version of the DAP it leaves nothing to add when they release a newer version next year.  It is the inherent problem of working on yearly product cycle.  Especially on a device like a DAP where there are only so many features you can add before it becomes pointless.
 
I mentioned previously that it costs thousands of dollars to license android features and all android devices have to go through certification.  Sony has no idea how well this DAP will sell so they may not want to invest in the android process until they are sure it will sell enough units.  With the 1A replacing the ZX2 Sony will not have any other DAPs with android so they can't leverage the cost of implementing android over multiple DAP's.  So bottom line it all comes down to cost and profit and if Sony manages to sell the 1Z without wifi and streaming it is a financial win for Sony.  Sony would need to have multiple DAP's with android or none at all to justify the cost.

What kind of license you're refering to? WiFi is a basic feature of Android OS

 

[musicday]

I realise that the Walkman being made of a solid chunk of copper the only way to get to the battery is to lift the glass front panel if one wants to source himself a similar battery right?

 

[emrelights1973]

   
No it actually doesn't tell you anything like that.  Per capita income only tells you buying power, but doesn't tell you the demand for the product.  Again look at the car example, NA market has good per capita income, but you can't sell them tiny 2 seater electric cars because there is no demand for it, but you can sure as heck sell them a lot of SUVs.  Flip that to Europe, are people buying 2 tonne SUVs in Europe, even with good captia income?  No - because the demand is dictated as much by the culture - not just money. Ever heard the joke about selling ice to Eskimos? Ergo, what is actually the demand for expensive flagship DAPs in Western markets?   
 
It does tell you very much for DAPs, we are not talking about ice for eskimos here, where is the biggest hifi market? headphone market?  
 
As for market data:
http://www.slideshare.net/AMASASIA/fi-amas03 < check page 7 of the slide - only the regions outside of US/EU is growing for headphone spending and is also the biggest revenue for the past years. One can certainly infer that portable audio is biggest in those area as well because headphones/portable audio equipment goes hand in hand. Thus again, that's where companies like Sony are targeting; the growing and bigger market which are regions *outside* of US/EU eg Asia.  See this is exactly how income per capita doesn't tell you whether the market will buy or not!
 
Regions outside USA/EU are not only East Asia - Do you know Canada, South America,Australia,Africa Midlle East etc? and from this graph i am seeing USA/EU is still biggest market!! So this Data is supporting my case not yours.
 
Now that we've established that the Asia region is the biggest and the only growing market for portable equipment, the rest is easy to talk about (sorry for all the Japanese reports).
 
No we did not we only establish a ) you don't know how to read to charts b ) you try to manipulate the data Sorry buddy check your facts again....
 
http://www.jas-audio.or.jp/jas_cms/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/document20160427.pdf
Page 5 - of all audio products 31% of the revenue actually comes from DAPs, with headphones following at 18%
Page 27 - Domestically in Japan - biggest source of music is Youtube and CDs purchases, CD rentals.  Only 6% uses dedicated music streaming services in Japan.
Page 29 - nearly 55% of users mainly listen to music during commuting 
 
http://getnavi.jp/av-2/6395/
Sony commands top position - 56% - of the portable player market in Japan. So it's safe to assume they know what their customers - at least in Japan - wants.
 
This is not a product only for Japanese market, also the assumption of japanese market don't need streaming is only an assumption again! 
 
http://www.phileweb.com/news/d-av/201607/20/39227.html
Surprise! CD and vinyl revenue in Japan is growing YoY. (hence Sony's turntable which rips directly to DSD!)
 
It is growing in all over the world and it did not automatically means ripping LPs, i have 2000LPs and a good record player but i never rip an LP so wrong but very wrong again!!!
 
OTOH - services like Tidal and other streaming services aren't making money and is struggling to find a viable business model - basically still chasing after users and selling that to investors just like during the Dotcom bubble.
 
No it is not, with MQS coming and other development it is the fastest growing segment in audio, it is the future for sure, is Apple a stupid company trying to jump into vagon.
 
So is it any mind blowing fact that makers like Sony aren't bothering to jump head first into the market where there is no money and a sustainable business model hasn't been found yet? The choices in the product seems pretty well backed by data to me.
 
The data that you presented is not saying anything about anything, and you did not mentioned iPods or pono ? 
 
Are we talking about DAPs? or are we taking about the ones you like? 
 
So it is my opinion that streaming is an important part of todays music and it should not be dismissed, if it is a model launched for Asia only ( which i still believe had to include steaming services ) is a choice, and it is a bad one....... like betamax  
 

 

[proedros]

has wm1a appeared on any EU sony sites ?

 

[Rei87]

Personally don't use streaming, however if you have a central server with all your music on it, it can be handy for transferring data as well.
It's not good look to stereotype people, there no right or wrong way.
But if it makes you feel better. Than so be it.

You do realize, that every single component in the player adds noise to the entire system. If they are going as far as to use solid copper for the chassis (grounding and shielding), kimble cable for the internal wiring (my 380CU uses ribbon wires for crying out loud), adopting a new standard for its added structural integrity, you would think that an extra antenna inside would be in essence contrary to the concept of the player. 

The player is designed to do one thing; play music in its purest form, without all the unneeded bells and whistles to eliminate any signals or components that might contaminate the signal. Heck, this is a company that even sells a USD150 audiophile memory card that completely fails as a standard memory card outside audiophile use (it takes 20mins to load in 2gb of songs to put things in perspective). The screen is simply a UI necessity so that one doesnt smash the player on the floor in frustration (think HM801).

So, if you want streaming, Sony is in essence saying that this is not the player that you are looking for, and rather unapologetic about the whole thing if I my add.

 

[Virtu Fortuna]

  has wm1a appeared on any EU sony sites ?

http://www.sony.co.uk/electronics/walkman/nw-wm1a?cpint=SG_PRODUCT_DETAILS_SEC-TOUT-PDP-NW-WM1Z-EN_GL-2016-08-M16-COMPLETESIGNATURE-TOUT03-NWWM1A

 

[Kerouac]

  http://www.sony.co.uk/electronics/walkman/nw-wm1a?cpint=SG_PRODUCT_DETAILS_SEC-TOUT-PDP-NW-WM1Z-EN_GL-2016-08-M16-COMPLETESIGNATURE-TOUT03-NWWM1A

 
Thanks for sharing!
 
Waiting for the new DX200 to arrive, but this one's also on my radar now

 

Incorporating the ø4.4mm Balanced Standard Connection

This made me smile...incorporating and standard in the same sentence.
They mean the new standard?

 

[Whitigir]

You do realize, that every single component in the player adds noise to the entire system. If they are going as far as to use solid copper for the chassis (grounding and shielding), kimble cable for the internal wiring (my 380CU uses ribbon wires for crying out loud), adopting a new standard for its added structural integrity, you would think that an extra antenna inside would be in essence contrary to the concept of the player. 


The player is designed to do one thing; play music in its purest form, without all the unneeded bells and whistles to eliminate any signals or components that might contaminate the signal. Heck, this is a company that even sells a USD150 audiophile memory card that completely fails as a standard memory card outside audiophile use (it takes 20mins to load in 2gb of songs to put things in perspective). The screen is simply a UI necessity so that one doesnt smash the player on the floor in frustration (think HM801).


So, if you want streaming, Sony is in essence saying that this is not the player that you are looking for, and rather unapologetic about the whole thing if I my add.

This is exactly it. Well speak

 

[emrelights1973]

This is exactly it. Well speak

Then a 7500£ Naim NDS Streamer with double 555PS 12,000£ , a 19,500£ Naim NDS source is not designed for music? It is equipped with a 500£ power line with Audioquest Vodka etc.... 
 
 
it has Tidal/Spotify added, no body defending Android but Streaming capabilities, if it can be done without android i am more than happy.....  
 
 
ZX2 is good enough for the moment, if Sony is designed for East Asia, let them enjoy it, i won't....

 

[johnston21]

Can't imagine what the cost of a Somes case will be for these models knowing the large $'s for the ZX versions.