Something between HD650 / X2HR?

[fufula]

There's a lot of things that I like about the HD650s and the X2HRs, but then there's this one thing in each case that drives me mad. I could live with the smaller soundstage and less bass of the HD650 if it wasn't for its terrible headband (I'd like to keep my headphones stock). The X2HR are really awesome for gaming and fun to listen to, but every other song is so full of sibilance it feels like listening to snake jazz and I am not a fan of that particular genre.

HD650 pros: dark sound signature, detail
HD650 meh: slightly cramped soundstage
HD650 cons: unbearable pressure from the headband - can't stand it after 30 mins

X2HR pros: bass, soundstage, one of the most comfortable headphones I've tried
X2HR meh: recessed mids
X2HR cons: piercing / uncomfortable highs, too easy too drive (they're too loud for me)

I'd prefer a darker headphone than one with a larger soundstage and more sibilance if I had to choose between the two. I wouldn't stand for less bass than the HD650s provide. I've had my my eye on the Sundaras for a while now, I hear they might be a nice upgrade to the X2HR, though I haven't tried planars before. Is there anything else I should keep my eye out for? The budget is $500. Help me out.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Fostex TR might work for you. They're semi closed so the soundstage is pretty good. They have recessed mids but no clamp, amazing rendering of percussion and are very easy to drive.

 

[fufula]

Fostex TR might work for you. They're semi closed so the soundstage is pretty good. They have recessed mids but no clamp, amazing rendering of percussion and are very easy to drive.

Thanks for the suggestion, haven't really thought of Fostex (maybe there are other brands that I'm missing), but from what I've read it seems they're quite bright, which is something I'm trying to avoid. Like I said, I'm willing to sacrifice some soundstage for a less fatiguing listening experience.

As for the headband thing, it's not the clamp, it's the headband digging into my skull actually. It's not the first headphone that does this, so there's quite possibly something wrong with my head somehow, but what am I gonna do.

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

The only headphone that matches what you’re looking for..at least that I can think of..is the R70x. I absolutely adore the comfort but then again I also really dig the comfort of the 650..after a day or two of heavy usage...but it takes a little time before the Sennie headband conforms to the shape of one’s head. The Maude Technica is even more comfy to me but still has a little clamping force out of the gate. Headphones do get more comfortable as one uses them...most especially Sennheisers. Think of them as shoes. Wouldn’t want to break out a brand spanking pair if you’ve never worn them and about to embark on a 10 mile hike. Nahh then you grab the old moccasins that hug your feet so naturally

Edith: rereading your posts and your issue with the headband digging into your skull, which will lessen with heavy usage or merely by stretching the headband ever so slightly with a couple of books instead of your head...but that very issue will be moot if you go for the R70x as it’s more of a ‘floating design’ with self-adjusting wings.
The reason the little Maude Technica is the only headphone that springs to mind is actually the two headphones you’re referencing..and the fact that you want something in between/similar.
That to me spells out openback, slightly hard to drive, comfortable, dark/non-fatiguing and of course the last bit that I infered myself: natural mids. The latter is what makes the X2 and 650 shine..and also what makes this such a narrow search. Sure you can get a lot of bassy/warm headphones that are about as offensive as an old labrador..but they never get the mids right. Then there are headphones that are both warm and realistic sounding in the mids..but whack you upside your head once you get to the treble. I’m looking at you Beyerdynamic!
There’s always the much pricier ZMFs, but I honestly think you end up paying for a handmade boutique headphone that to be fair looks gorgeous and feels like a luxury product...but you are definitely not going to get the comfort you’re lusting for, and I personally think you get better and a more realistic sound quality with the R70x..but that’s just me though

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Thanks for the suggestion, haven't really thought of Fostex (maybe there are other brands that I'm missing), but from what I've read it seems they're quite bright, which is something I'm trying to avoid. Like I said, I'm willing to sacrifice some soundstage for a less fatiguing listening experience.

As for the headband thing, it's not the clamp, it's the headband digging into my skull actually. It's not the first headphone that does this, so there's quite possibly something wrong with my head somehow, but what am I gonna do.

You said you wanted some sibilance so I thought you might be ok with the Fostex TRs. I don't find them bright at all and they're not sibilant. But, I got the sense that they might be what you're looking for anyway. I guess people who do find them bright might get that impression because the mids are scooped out pretty heavily. For some kinds of music that's fine. I can't listen to them in general without some judicious use of EQ- which makes them into a really nice of cans. The speed is amazing. So no, I would not characterize them as fatiguing.

You could try swapping an HD 600 headpad (looks like nuggets, tastes like chicken) onto your 650s. It's a two second job, they have tabs on the end that slide into the headstrap. Probably the easiest headpad change in the history of headphones. I haven't warn a pair of 650s but when I saw that pad I said to myself, no, I don't think so.

The Fostex headband hurts my head. There is basically a layer of vinyl and no padding. The HD 800 headband also hurts my head. Other people don't have any problem. All heads are different, no can is going to be perfect for everybody. I'm not thrilled with the headband pad on Beyers either.

I'm going to try some headpad experiments on the cans that bother me because otherwise I like them a lot. So before you switch cans, which could cost a lot of money and also be a flop if you don't have time to wear them a while before buying, it might be worthwhile to see what additional headpads and mods are available.

 

[fufula]

The only headphone that matches what you’re looking for..at least that I can think of..is the R70x. (...)

I know what you mean about the Beyerdynamics. The V sound signature along with the respectable soundstage of the DT990PROs is all fun and games until the treble hits.

Audio Technica has always been kind of on my radar, but I've never got to actually try any of their headphones. I've checked some reviews and the freq. response of the R70xs and I'm thinking this might actually be the right time to get my hands on some ATHs. I'm really excited! Thank you so much for the recommendation.

 

[fufula]

You said you wanted some sibilance so I thought you might be ok with the Fostex TRs. I don't find them bright at all and they're not sibilant. But, I got the sense that they might be what you're looking for anyway. I guess people who do find them bright might get that impression because the mids are scooped out pretty heavily. For some kinds of music that's fine. I can't listen to them in general without some judicious use of EQ- which makes them into a really nice of cans. The speed is amazing. So no, I would not characterize them as fatiguing.

Well maybe I wasn't super clear in my initial post, but I meant that I dislike the sibilance of the X2HRs and would like to get rid of it. It's the only thing that I have an issue with when it comes to the X2HRs. That's why I kind of prefer the HD650s to the X2HRs, since they're significantly less bright and less fatiguing. But then with the HD650s there's the headband issue.

I did try the headpad from the HD600s, as I thought that because there are 4 bumps instead of just 2 they would distribute the weight differently, but that doesn't seem to be the case and the issue persists. I've had these HD650s for over a year (using them a lot less than the X2HRs though due to comfort issues), so I'd think that by this time there should be enough wear on them for the headband padding to mellow out a little bit and stop hurting so much. Nope. I've also had this issue with the Beyers you mention (and several other brands in fact, like Ultrasone and Shure) which as I remember are significantly heavier than the Sennheisers. I actually replaced the padding on the Beyers with the pad from the Goldring DR150s - it was quite thick and wide. So the fix is really simple and something these companies should do - just add a tiny bit more foam to improve the ergonomy for those of us whose craniums are weird, but would like to enjoy the sound for long hours just like everybody else. Especially since this isn't something you have to research for years to realize. Just sit a bunch of people and have them wear your headphones for an hour to find out that some of them will complain that the top of their head feels funny. It's completely mindbogling to me how the comfort of one of the most recognizable and popular headphones and a pretty pricey one at that can suck so much (talking about the HD650s now). I'm aware there's mods I can do to alleviate this, but I'd prefer my $300 headphones not to look like frankensteins with some 3rd party padding that doesn't fit.

I'm actually pretty sure now that to be safe and avoid bringing any more misery to the top of my head I should only ever look at the strap headband design (or whatever it's called) like in the X2HRs, K7xxs, R70xs etc. when choosing my headphones.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

I'd prefer a darker headphone than one with a larger soundstage and more sibilance if I had to choose between the two.

I guess this could be read in a few ways. I didn't understand it hence my answer. Sorry.

For me the Audezes are among the most comfortable headphones despite the weight. I like that you feel like you're down in them rather than wearing them, although to the guy looking at you, you must appear like a spaceman.

 

[tomatoshoe]

Owned both HD650 and X2 in the past. I guess you're super sensitive to treble because I never had that issue... I hate piercing treble.

I would say the DCA Aeon Open-X fits your needs. Just take that recommendation with a grain of salt, because I have never personally heard them before. I would suggest researching about it as I have heard it is quite good.

For me the Audezes are among the most comfortable headphones despite the weight.

I think the weight will be a deal breaker honestly. I've used a friend's LCD-2 and the weight becomes unbearable after a bit.

 

[FullBright1]

Thanks for the suggestion, haven't really thought of Fostex (maybe there are other brands that I'm missing), but from what I've read it seems they're quite bright, which is something I'm trying to avoid. Like I said, I'm willing to sacrifice some soundstage for a less fatiguing listening experience.

As for the headband thing, it's not the clamp, it's the headband digging into my skull actually. It's not the first headphone that does this, so there's quite possibly something wrong with my head somehow, but what am I gonna do.

HarmonicDyne Zeus

 

[fufula]

Went ahead and got me the ATH R70xs. I consider them to be a slight improvement over the HD650s in all aspects that are important to me (the bass goes a little deeper, the soundstage is more spacious and surrounding, and yet they still retain the quality of being dark and non-fatiguing). The X2HRs don't wow me as much with their V sound anymore, but their inferior resolution is much more noticeable when compared against the ATHs. They're also really comfortable (though people with bigger ears should think twice before buying these). One thing that's not so great about the Audio Technicas is the build quality, quite reminiscent of some sub $100 sets. Well, you can't have everything. All in all I'm extremely happy with the purchase. Thanks again @Kammerat Rebekka !

 

[FullBright1]

Went ahead and got me the ATH R70xs. I consider them to be a slight improvement over the HD650s in all aspects that are important to me (the bass goes a little deeper, the soundstage is more spacious and surrounding, and yet they still retain the quality of being dark and non-fatiguing). The X2HRs don't wow me as much with their V sound anymore, but their inferior resolution is much more noticeable when compared against the ATHs. They're also really comfortable (though people with bigger ears should think twice before buying these). One thing that's not so great about the Audio Technicas is the build quality, quite reminiscent of some sub $100 sets. Well, you can't have everything. All in all I'm extremely happy with the purchase. Thanks again @Kammerat Rebekka !

Your choice is a really good set of headphones.
Its an underrated audiophile gear.
Its my favorite ATech headphone, as its amazingly comfy, its sound is open and delicious and never fatiguing.

enjoy your new gear..