[Mher6]

I agree with your 3 general reasons tom hankins. $1000+ is a lot to drop on an amp. Not to mention that most users that would like to own an extreme and can afford one have already bought one from Mikhail. Just something to take into consideration.

 

[vcoheda]

i think in general all amps (and to a lesser extent headphones) purchased new and not at an introductory price are bad investments and have poor resale value. and of course some, for whatever reason, are worse than others.

 

[MaloS]

Earth to Tom, I am not trying to say they are bad amps, my suggestion is that there is something going on with public's interest in these amps. Thats all. I did a few speculations that something about the amps is not particularly pleasant about them based on my experience, but that is particularly based on my experience, not an extensive one. Now there could be something else, but I am getting bitten like 'EH, NOPE THATS NOT IT, WE LOVE SP', and thats just not pleasant to look at. Maybe that is a bit extreme, but I don't see error with my logic, only disagreement and lack of economic education in my premises.

I can spend time with an SP amplifier if you want to convince me that I will like it, but thats not the object of what I am trying to say.

 

[boomana]

MaloS, there's nothing wrong with your question; it's a good one, but your logic IS faulty when you attempt to draw a conclusion with it, which any logic textbook or statistics 101 class will tell you on page/day one. I don't think anyone's been pushing the "I love SP" vibe in any over-the-top manner, even if this thread is a about an SP amp, and I'd state the same thing to you had this thread been about a Zana Deux, a Raptor, a HeadRoom Max, and F1 or whatever. You can certainly ask the question ("Is the public not interested in the SP Extreme?"), but to say the question answers itself in the affirmative by its mere presence, is again, unsound reasoning. I think what others have been trying to say is that no conclusion can be reached on the offering of a few amps, that have only been in existence a few months, over a couple-week period in the FS forum with anyone biting. To infer that the public is not interested because there's something not quite right with the amps, or the public's perception of the amps, is a compound error in reasoning.

 

[MaloS]

Gah...innate desire to defend myself will eat me alive.

Logic is actually fine, the whole argument has a problem in the premise, thats what any logic or statistics 101 class would say. But I am making a few assumptions about stability of the market that I probably should have stated, that are probably not valid looking at the points brought up.

 

[vorlon1]

Hope I don't screw up everyone's math here, but I just bought one of them.

 

[Agent Kang]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom hankins /img/forum/go_quote.gif [QUOTE/boomana] I also know one person who recently sold his ZD, not because he didn't love it, but the Woo WA5 came out and gave him everything he wanted, including the ability to consolidate his speaker/headphone rigs. I doubt he'll be selling that any time soon. So, maybe I'm wrong, and people like what they like when they like it and then buy and sell when the mood strikes. Who knows, maybe I'm next.

That is pretty much the reason people sell what they have. I have sold dozens of some of the best audio gear made(both headphone and speaker) over the years. Not because they didnt sound great or work right...but because my system was changing and, or room size was changed. The Singlepower amps (along with many others for sale used) are VERY, VERY good. One mans loss is another mans gain. So of all the reasons for selling in this thread the one in your post that says..
People like what they like when they like it and then buy and sell when the mood strikes. Holds the most true.
In the first five pages of amps for sale there are
11 headroom
10 Ray Samuels
10 Mier
9 Singlepower
7 Headamp
amps for sale. No magic reasons. People either dont use them, found something they like more, need the money, or whatever.
They like what they like when they like it and then buy and sell when the mood strikes. If I was in the market for a headphone amp I wouldnt be wondering why the amps from these great builders are for sale....but how I can come up with the money to get one at used prices.[/QUOTE]

But no Wooaudio

 

[Daryn Alexander]

Anyone else disappointed that the opportunity to say "Ground control to Major Tom" was ignored?

 

[Happy Camper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vorlon1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hope I don't screw up everyone's math here, but I just bought one of them.

Good job sir. By the look of your sig, you will have to give us a review with your experience. I will look forward to it.

And yeah, the major tom catch would have been classic.

 

[boomana]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaloS /img/forum/go_quote.gif Gah...innate desire to defend myself will eat me alive. Logic is actually fine, the whole argument has a problem in the premise, thats what any logic or statistics 101 class would say. But I am making a few assumptions about stability of the market that I probably should have stated, that are probably not valid looking at the points brought up.

LOL. And the desire to revive my debating days will probably kill this thread, but here goes:

Your question, as I said, is a good one, but when you reach a conclusion that the amps aren't desirable without evidence to back up your assumptions, you are guilty of an inductive fallacy of speculative evidence, or reaching a hasty conclusion. If you conclude or assume a position by possibly relevant but incomplete evidence in support of your theory, you are guilty of coming to a hasty conclusion.

Also, if you ask the question, "Are the amps not desirable because people are selling them and no one is buying quickly?" and then answer with, "Yes, no one is buying them quickly and people are selling because the amps aren't desirable," you are guilty of Petitio Principii (begging the question). This is the fallacy of assuming, when trying to prove something, what it is that you are trying prove. Basically, you can't use what you are trying to prove as part of the proof of that thing.

It all comes back to evidence. If, for example, in three months time, no one was buying the amps and even more were sale, you might have something. If people started complaining about the sq, you'd have another. Add whatever else you choose. It all goes back to what a few of us were saying earlier. Questions are good. Speculation is natural, but jumping to conclusions is neither fair nor right...and poor logic to boot.

I promise to stop now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vorlon1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hope I don't screw up everyone's math here, but I just bought one of them.

Congrats. I think you'll like it. If you want to try out some tubes later on, pm me. I'd make a trip to Miami, and I still owe you a CD.

 

[soloz2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vorlon1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hope I don't screw up everyone's math here, but I just bought one of them.

I just bought a PPX3 6cg7 does that count?

 

[boomana]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent Kang /img/forum/go_quote.gif But no Wooaudio

Give it three months!!! (btw, this an error of false analogy, or assuming that just because one thing resembles another [FOTM amps], conclusions drawn from one situation will also apply to the other).

Dang...better go to bed. I'm obnoxious, even to myself....

 

[vorlon1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by soloz2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just bought a PPX3 6cg7 does that count?

If this continues, the thread may change to, "Why is it that so many people are buying up these singlepowers"?

 

[MaloS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boomana /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also, if you ask the question, "Are the amps not desirable because people are selling them and no one is buying quickly?" and then answer with, "Yes, no one is buying them quickly and people are selling because the amps aren't desirable," you are guilty of Petitio Principii (begging the question). This is the fallacy of assuming, when trying to prove something, what it is that you are trying prove. Basically, you can't use what you are trying to prove as part of the proof of that thing.

You just entirely disproved religion. Neat. We can always do the opposite. Let's assume people are not buying the amps quickly because they are desirable. But that statement makes no sense... (the old why isn't chemistry a science joke...)

 

[Icarium]

I like my (Mikeg's) SDS a lot ;p I haven't gotten it to sound good with Qualias at all but with the L3K it simply slays. Ranks right up there with Qualias and RP010. Listening to that Glenn Gould album right now and it does the trick quite well... definitely not a one trick (Rock) pony but more like a multi legged mutant pony with many tricks.